Visual Reading of Cognitive Types

[Stansmith]

As far as how I relate to the SeFi video, I usually stay relatively still when I speak, and my eyes are usually more sunken in. They seem manic.

The idea that bounciness/constant body moment = dominant Pe seems a bit misleading though. Fiona Apple and Andrew Garfield (INFPs) strike me as somewhat bouncy and jittery at times, although obviously, not to the same extent as someone like Katy Perry or Quentin Tarantino.

 

[brainheart]

As far as how I relate to the SeFi video, I usually stay relatively still when I speak, and my eyes are usually more sunken in. They seem manic.

The idea that bounciness/constant body moment = dominant Pe seems a bit misleading though. Fiona Apple and Andrew Garfield (INFPs) strike me as somewhat bouncy and jittery at times, although obviously, not to the same extent as someone like Katy Perry or Quentin Tarantino.

You know, I was thinking about Fiona Apple and Andrew Garfield, too, as being bouncy/jittery INFPs (and they type Garfield as an INFP, btw). I'm thinking Joan Baez, etc, are more fi-heavy INFP while Fiona Apple and Andrew Garfield are a little more Ne-ish INFPs.

I was looking at their website and I was thinking of all of the reasons that would cause a person to be typed as more extroverted vs introverted by their method. First, if you're talking to a friend or recording yourself on your laptop you're going to be more expressive than if you're being interviewed by a stranger- that's just how it is. (or if it's a stranger you get along with you might seem more extroverted vs someone you don't connect with.) Also, I think there are plenty of introverts who extrovert in a 'weird' way which is going to make them seem more extroverted- like Robert Pattinson, as you say. I think a true extrovert will seem less awkward when extroverting, and it will be more consistent. With Pattinson it seems more sporadic- bursts of extroversion. It's kind of like all of the comedians who act wild and crazy but off stage are quiet and reserved. (Or in Spiderman 3 when Spidey gets all awkwardly extroverted and everyone looks at him like he's insane.)

I think it might be possible to determine the cognitive functions used by this method, but I think it would be more difficult to determine the order. There's just way too many variables.

 

[Stansmith]

[MENTION=7140]brainheart[/MENTION]

I've noticed Woody Allen (IxTP) does the 'Te' micro-headshake too

I'd imagine its common among 6s and some 7s.

 

[Lady_X]

You know, I was thinking about Fiona Apple and Andrew Garfield, too, as being bouncy/jittery INFPs (and they type Garfield as an INFP, btw). I'm thinking Joan Baez, etc, are more fi-heavy INFP while Fiona Apple and Andrew Garfield are a little more Ne-ish INFPs.

I was looking at their website and I was thinking of all of the reasons that would cause a person to be typed as more extroverted vs introverted by their method. First, if you're talking to a friend or recording yourself on your laptop you're going to be more expressive than if you're being interviewed by a stranger- that's just how it is. (or if it's a stranger you get along with you might seem more extroverted vs someone you don't connect with.) Also, I think there are plenty of introverts who extrovert in a 'weird' way which is going to make them seem more extroverted- like Robert Pattinson, as you say. I think a true extrovert will seem less awkward when extroverting, and it will be more consistent. With Pattinson it seems more sporadic- bursts of extroversion. It's kind of like all of the comedians who act wild and crazy but off stage are quiet and reserved. (Or in Spiderman 3 when Spidey gets all awkwardly extroverted and everyone looks at him like he's insane.)

I think it might be possible to determine the cognitive functions used by this method, but I think it would be more difficult to determine the order. There's just way too many variables.

i'm pretty sure i'd be more extroverted in a stranger interview...or just anyone interviewing me...or just me talking to anyone. i'm pretty sure i seem pretty introverted when just talking to a camera by myself.

i mean...i think i can be pretty animated but not at all when alone. i mean...that would be weird.

 

[Avocado]

i'm pretty sure i'd be more extroverted in a stranger interview...or just anyone interviewing me...or just me talking to anyone. i'm pretty sure i seem pretty introverted when just talking to a camera by myself.

i mean...i think i can be pretty animated but not at all when alone. i mean...that would be weird.

Same here…
If I'm animated when I'm alone, I'm acting…

 

[brainheart]

i'm pretty sure i'd be more extroverted in a stranger interview...or just anyone interviewing me...or just me talking to anyone. i'm pretty sure i seem pretty introverted when just talking to a camera by myself.

i mean...i think i can be pretty animated but not at all when alone. i mean...that would be weird.

Well.. hmm.. maybe it's different for extroverts? Or just me?

I do know that I watched a youtube video of an ixtj and an isfp and they also said they were more animated in their videos than they are with other people. And my isfp kid will go crazy in front of a camera.

[MENTION=18664]Stansmith[/MENTION], yeah... I think there's still a lot that they need to work out- if it even can be worked out.

 

[CatBalou]

It's pretty cool to see all those micro-expressions repeating in each interview. The INTPs act so much like my INTP sister it's untrue, esp the guy with the Ne toggling/Si scowl.

The NiFes definitely act the same as I do, with all that Ti disengagement and eyes leading the head.

I agree it doesn't feel very scientific though as there's no possiblity of "proving" anyone's type, through testing or otherwise.

 

[chaoticbrain]

You know, I was thinking about Fiona Apple and Andrew Garfield, too, as being bouncy/jittery INFPs (and they type Garfield as an INFP, btw). I'm thinking Joan Baez, etc, are more fi-heavy INFP while Fiona Apple and Andrew Garfield are a little more Ne-ish INFPs.

I was looking at their website and I was thinking of all of the reasons that would cause a person to be typed as more extroverted vs introverted by their method. First, if you're talking to a friend or recording yourself on your laptop you're going to be more expressive than if you're being interviewed by a stranger- that's just how it is. (or if it's a stranger you get along with you might seem more extroverted vs someone you don't connect with.) Also, I think there are plenty of introverts who extrovert in a 'weird' way which is going to make them seem more extroverted- like Robert Pattinson, as you say. I think a true extrovert will seem less awkward when extroverting, and it will be more consistent. With Pattinson it seems more sporadic- bursts of extroversion. It's kind of like all of the comedians who act wild and crazy but off stage are quiet and reserved. (Or in Spiderman 3 when Spidey gets all awkwardly extroverted and everyone looks at him like he's insane.)

I think it might be possible to determine the cognitive functions used by this method, but I think it would be more difficult to determine the order. There's just way too many variables.

Your actually quite right with this, telling polar pairs apart is the most difficult aspect of cognitive type. One thing to keep in mind though, is that one of the most striking parts of visual reading is the difference between Perception leads and Judgement leads. Meaning that normally the trouble comes down to spotting whether someone is SiFe or NeTi for instance. Telling apart TiNe and NeTi is actually a lot easier.

 

[Sunny Ghost]

I'd like to see an ISFP and an ENFP video. I think there is merit to this. I just don't know if all of their typings are correct. Mila Kunis is an ENTJ?

 

[Galena]

I am skeptical of VI, and I don't know whether the TeNi video should affirm or challenge that skepticism because of the obvious. I haven't felt that snooped upon by a typology profile in ages.

 

[Lady_X]

I'd like to see an ISFP and an ENFP video. I think there is merit to this. I just don't know if all of their typings are correct. Mila Kunis is an ENTJ?

I think she is entj! I thought enfp at first but I think I was wrong.

What do you think she is?

And I want to see those videos too!

 

[chaoticbrain]

There busy with writing their book right now, so that's why their not making videos. I am going to suggest that maybe some of us forum members should just make one of these videos.

I can try vreading any of your guys pics or videos if you guys want btw, I've been doing this for about 5 months, so my reads have a decent accuracy at this point .

One thing to keep in mind too, is that this isn't MBTI, we define all of the functions differently than MBTI, and it isn't even the same thing as Jung either. Such systems aren't compatible with what we're seeing the functions as.

 

[Stansmith]

There busy with writing their book right now, so that's why their not making videos. I am going to suggest that maybe some of us forum members should just make one of these videos.

I can try vreading any of your guys pics or videos if you guys want btw, I've been doing this for about 5 months, so my reads have a decent accuracy at this point .

One thing to keep in mind too, is that this isn't MBTI, we define all of the functions differently than MBTI, and it isn't even the same thing as Jung either. Such systems aren't compatible with what we're seeing the functions as.

Can you do mine?

http://www.typologycentral.com/forums/what-s-my-mbti-type/64893-enfp-what-video.html

 

[chaoticbrain]

Can you do mine?

http://www.typologycentral.com/forums/what-s-my-mbti-type/64893-enfp-what-video.html

Yes, but you'll have to give me awhile, you seem like a bit of a tough read.

 

[011235813]

Can you do mine?

http://www.typologycentral.com/forums/what-s-my-mbti-type/64893-enfp-what-video.html

Tons of sad Fi from a purely visual perspective. I would say Fi dominant is a perfect fit. I'm not sure about perceiving functions yet. Your eyes could potentially be described as naive (which is typically associated with Ne, according to their system) but it's mostly that they're just kinda ... wounded looking? So that puts us back at Fi. On the other hand, you do the Ni zone out as well, the Se lock on is less obvious though and they do come as a pair. So if pressed, my tentative read would be Fi with strong Ni ... which is the type label you're wearing right now, I guess.

EDIT:
Fi/Te cues:
Breathy but monotone speech
Asymmetrical, pained-looking expressions
Tension in the cheeks

Ni/Se cues
Lots of Ni zone out while looking to the sides
Slightly fixed quality to the gaze
Some Se eye darting at a mild pace.

I'll look for the Ne/Si stuff later, but I've kind of convinced myself of FiNi and by extension, FiSe.

You have fairly rigid and unmoving posture, which implies introversion and I don't think your eyes lead your face, so Ji-dominant.

 

[chaoticbrain]

[MENTION=13147]senza tema[/MENTION]

Woah, are you new to vreading ? That's pretty good. I think I agree with Fi/Te, but I can't confirm Se/Ni (could you give some timestamps of zone outs ?). The rate at which he wanders seems more Ne right now.

I think he's a perception lead,

-he has a very free flowing and fluid way of acting and talking.

-He spends the majority of his time darting and scowling (Pi/Pe oscillation) rather than articulating (Fi/Te oscillation).

-The rate which he does perk ups, (eyebrow raises) are more in line with PeFi.

His lower energy level could be due to heavy Pi, or some other reason. But for now PeFi alt.(FiPe).

 

[011235813]

[MENTION=13147]senza tema[/MENTION]

Woah, are you new to vreading ? That's pretty good. I think I agree on the function pairs. (Though Ne/Si is possible).

I think he's a perception lead though,

-he has a very free flowing and fluid way of acting and talking.

-He spends the majority of his time darting and scowling (Ni/Se oscillation) rather than articulating (Fi/Te oscillation).

-The rate which he does perk ups, (eyebrow raises) are more in line with SeFi. (FiSe tend to have very static eyebrows moreso than any type).

His lower energy level could be due to heavy Ni, or some other reason. But for now SeFi alt.(FiSe).

I'm not new to the system but I'm new to reading. It doesn't seem hard though.
He doesn't seem present enough to me to be an extrovert. He retreats into himself a lot while thinking about his answers. I could go for NiTe if it weren't such a clear case of Fi >>> Te.
Also, in my experience, FiSe seems to do the judgy eyebrow lift a lot. I think CR is onto something as far as classifying the different kind of signals is concerned but they don't necessarily interpret them in the right order.

 

[chaoticbrain]

[MENTION=13147]senza tema[/MENTION]

But this is a new system, it's not the MBTI or even carl Jung, (though trying to describe the same thing as Carl Jung). We believe for instance that people can have very high use of the lower functions, and we also don't think that Ti is an empirical/scientific process. Types such as SiTe and FiNe tend to be the best at innovating in science and mathematics because they have Ne and Te. Do you see what I mean ? It's not the same system as MBTI, and SiTe's are going to bare almost no resemblance.

Also, you can say visual reading is wrong, and that's fine, many of us are skeptical of it's 100% validity, but to just pick and choose which elements you like and decide some parts are valid but other parts aren't arbitrarily is intectually dishonest. The J vs P lead difference is something that is well established, P-leads do on average spend the majority of their time scrunching/darting/drifting, and J-leads really do spend the majority of their time articulating, an Fe-lead will articulate through Fe, but then pause and access Ti, then go back to Fe etc. And only occasionally do they go to their perception process.

If you want to assert that this is wrong ^ then that requires a lot of research and providing counterexamples.

Of course, it's possible your correct about his type, but if he really does spend the majority of his time scowling and darting like I'm saying, then it's unlikely he's a J-lead.

 

[011235813]

[MENTION=13147]senza tema[/MENTION]

But this is a new system, it's not the MBTI or even carl Jung, (though trying to describe the same thing as Carl Jung). We believe for instance that people can have very high use of the lower functions, and we also don't think that Ti is an empirical/scientific process. Types such as SiTe and FiNe tend to be the best at innovating in science and mathematics because they have Ne and Te. Do you see what I mean ? It's not the same system as MBTI, and SiTe's are going to bare almost no resemblance.

Also, you can say visual reading is wrong, and that's fine, many of us are skeptical of it's 100% validity, but to just pick and choose which elements you like and decide some parts are valid but other parts aren't arbitrarily is intectually dishonest. The J vs P lead difference is something that is well established, P-leads do on average spend the majority of their time scrunching/darting/drifting, and J-leads really do spend the majority of their time articulating, an Fe-lead will articulate through Fe, but then pause and access Ti, then go back to Fe etc. And only occasionally do they go to their perception process.

If you want to assert that this is wrong ^ then that requires a lot of research and providing counterexamples.

Of course, it's possible your correct about his type, but if he really does spend the majority of his time scowling and darting like I'm saying, then it's unlikely he's a J-lead.

I sense some defensiveness from you, and it wasn't my intention to attack. I understand you're proud of your system but I was just offering my impressions. I didn't even say the system was wrong, just that my personal impression is that things still need tweaking and it's a mistake to think you've already got everything right. I don't need to prove intellectual honesty or dishonesty to you in order to share an opinion.

Also, if this is a new system entirely, it should have its own set of labels. Using the same terms is just going to muddy the waters even more. I assume the creators have already started thinking about that.

For my part, I think there's some overlap between the stuff Erifrail and co. have come up with and MBTI/JCF. That's what I'm interested in exploring ... on my own terms. I'm a member on the CT forum and I find a lot of the resources interesting and helpful, but the discussion style there is really not my thing. It's just too ... idk, there's too much consensus for my comfort.

 

[brainheart]

[MENTION=13147]senza tema[/MENTION]

But this is a new system, it's not the MBTI or even carl Jung, (though trying to describe the same thing as Carl Jung). We believe for instance that people can have very high use of the lower functions, and we also don't think that Ti is an empirical/scientific process. Types such as SiTe and FiNe tend to be the best at innovating in science and mathematics because they have Ne and Te. Do you see what I mean ? It's not the same system as MBTI, and SiTe's are going to bare almost no resemblance.

Wow. Yes, it definitely is a different system then. Then I agree with [MENTION=13147]senza tema[/MENTION]. Why are you using the same labels if they are going to bear almost no resemblance? If you can have very high use of lower functions, why call them lower functions? Shouldn't the order for a FiNe who uses lots of Te not be termed as FiNe but something else entirely?

And why is it then that certain people you type with your method also are typed the same by cognitive function/MBTI methods? For example-

Andrew Garfield (FiNe/INFP)
Cate Blanchett and Carey Mulligan (NiFe/INFJ)
Katie Couric (SiTe/ISTJ)