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MBTI and population

Little Linguist

Striving for balance
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Jun 23, 2008
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xNFP
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sx/so
Just out of curiosity, which population was sampled to determine percentages for MBTI types?

Do you think culture matters?
 

heart

heart on fire
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I think culture affects how the preferences are expressed.
 

placebo

New member
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May 11, 2008
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492
MBTI Type
INFP
Just out of curiosity, which population was sampled to determine percentages for MBTI types?

Do you think culture matters?


From The Myers & Briggs Foundation

Although the study groups for the original research for the MBTI® instrument were drawn from populations in the United States, subsequent MBTI personality research has proved that type differences correlate in all the cultures studied.

More About Personality Type - International Use - Multicultural Use of the MBTI Instrument

# Distributions of the sixteen types differ across different cultures. However, distribution patterns are similar across all the cultures studied.

* STJ types predominate in all cultures.
 

Little Linguist

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Thank you for your assistance. I have a question: Even though the type differences occur across all nationalities, is it possible that different nationalities have different proportions and/or percentages of each type? (Or do they mean that the percentages correlate among all groups?)

I'm asking because somehow I have the feeling that Germany MUST have different percentages than the US. My personality is extremely uncommon in Germany. On the whole, Germans tend to be much more reserved and structured - and our systems tend to be much more bureaucratic. People also tend to be much more direct, to the point, etc. Our state also has a great deal more centralized power.

Of course, then one must ask the question: Are these socialized behaviors or intrinsic tendencies? Although I recognize that general cultural differences and historical developments can constitute the main reason for these systemic differences, I still believe that MBTI percentages would be different in Germany. I'm convinced!

However, I do not want to make a premature assessment because I have not been dealing with the MBTI that long.

Thanks for your assistance. I look forward to anyone else's additional input.
 

Mole

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Mar 20, 2008
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Growing up absurd

It seems silly to keep on saying this but MBTI has no more truth value than astrology.

MBTI and astrology are essentially religious beliefs.

MBTI and astrology are not connected to reality. They are essentially imaginary.

Personally I am very attracted to the imaginary, for instance in poetry.

So I would say that MBTI and astrology are essentially poetic.

After all poetry does nothing and neither does MBTI or astrology.

Poetry is completely useless like MBTI or astrology, and yet some think that poetry is the purpose of our civilization.

So MBTI and astrology are poetry for beginners.

But to stop at the beginning and go no further is to grow up absurd.
 

"?"

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Messages
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TiSe
Just out of curiosity, which population was sampled to determine percentages for MBTI types?

Do you think culture matters?
Depends on what you call population. Based on what I have read Myers-Briggs' stats were derived from the school district she worked in during the 50's that comprised of less than 4,000 students, Keirsey admitted that he never conducted a study but guessed and the most recent and largest study conducted to date was in Ontario Canada with 16,000 surveys sent and less than one percent returned. There has been no real study.

As for whether culture matters, Myers-Briggs says that it can't be dismissed that since there are some who are born with clean slates, predisposition to type is not totally certain and cultural influence may be the reason that there are so many SJs. We sort of started a similar topic here.
 

Little Linguist

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Depends on what you call population. Based on what I have read Myers-Briggs' stats were derived from the school district she worked in during the 50's that comprised of less than 4,000 students, Keirsey admitted that he never conducted a study but guessed and the most recent and largest study conducted to date was in Ontario Canada with 16,000 surveys sent and less than one percent returned. There has been no real study.

As for whether culture matters, Myers-Briggs says that it can't be dismissed that since there are some who are born with clean slates, predisposition to type is not totally certain and cultural influence may be the reason that there are so many SJs. We sort of started a similar topic here.

Thanks! I did not realize the topic was already discussed since I am relatively new here. I appreciate it! :yes:
 

"?"

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Thank you for your assistance. I have a question: Even though the type differences occur across all nationalities, is it possible that different nationalities have different proportions and/or percentages of each type? (Or do they mean that the percentages correlate among all groups?).
Not only is it that true but the only assertion that can be made regarding statistics and population breakdown. I guarantee the eastern culture will have almost an opposite population breakdown than the western. Typical of the USA to make ethnocentric assertions as though the world revolves around us. Yet in defense of type, I have never read where Myers-Briggs, Keirsey or anyone implied that the type breakdown went beyond the USA. That has only been expounded on by readers over the years.
 

alcea rosea

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Do you think culture matters?

I think the same personality type can look different in different cultures. For example: American extrovert can look a bit different than a Finnish extrovert. I heard this from professional MBTI trainers and it's true. Finnish people in general tend to be more reserved than Americans. :)
 

"?"

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I think the same personality type can look different in different cultures. For example: American extrovert can look a bit different than a Finnish extrovert. I heard this from professional MBTI trainers and it's true. Finnish people in general tend to be more reserved than Americans. :)
I am not sure that I agree with this. There are basic principles of type that I would think has to remain constant regardless of external influences. Clearly again and as I have always claimed that to determine anything by dichotomy is limiting and results in a force choice. So to give an example by your example about extraversion, which extravert are we alluding to Te, Fe, Se, Ne? They're all going to be different and based on the degree of healthiness and development of auxiliary or other functions, even these aforementioned may look different regardless of culture.
 

edcoaching

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The National Sample used with the 1998 Form M version of the MBTI was developed through surveys of 3,200 respondents in the United States, selected from an original sample of 16,000 households to gather data in percentages similar to the US population for age, gender, ethnic background, etc. (MBTI Manual, 1998, p. 143)

Similar samples have been collected by MBTI publishers in the United Kingdom, Spain, Italy, Germany, Netherlands, and Korea, with other studies scheduled. (Type and Culture, Kirby, Kendall, & Barger).

Type does in fact go around the world; Jung explored the concepts early on with a tribe in Nigeria and the Southwest United States to see if the preferences described normal ways of being in those cultures too.

However, cultures differ in which preferences are honored, or held up as archetypes. In the network of type professionals in over 40 countries, Association for Psychological Type International, we wouldn't determine the archetype of another culture but instead ask them to inform us of how the preferences are viewed from within their cultures. Our colleagues in India for example talk of their archetype for Intuition thus, "We have over a billion people, a million gods in our pantheon, over 300,000 spoken dialects, and a religion, Hinduism, where the goal is to move beyond reality. This is Intuition permeating our very thought structure." Our colleagues within the First Nations describe their archetype for Introversion as "Great leaders are those who listen to everyone else and then synthesize the wisdom."

Type becomes a great tool for talking about cultural differences without stereotyping if one a)actually believes all 8 preferences are equally great ways of being and b) listens to what the cultures say about themselves rather than judging what they are from afar.

edcoaching (INFJ)
 

alcea rosea

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I am not sure that I agree with this. There are basic principles of type that I would think has to remain constant regardless of external influences. Clearly again and as I have always claimed that to determine anything by dichotomy is limiting and results in a force choice. So to give an example by your example about extraversion, which extravert are we alluding to Te, Fe, Se, Ne? They're all going to be different and based on the degree of healthiness and development of auxiliary or other functions, even these aforementioned may look different regardless of culture.

Difficult one. I don't know. Maybe all extroverted functions look different in different cultures? Maybe people being outgoing is more acceptable in some countries even if outgoing is not the same as extroversion.
 

"?"

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Difficult one. I don't know. Maybe all extroverted functions look different in different cultures? Maybe people being outgoing is more acceptable in some countries even if outgoing is not the same as extroversion.
Okay, your thoughts are on whether extraversion is culturally accepted as it is in the western. I don't know. And I question whether it's as culturally accepted as reported in the U.S.
 

edcoaching

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Do all facets of the US culture consider Extraversion the best way to be? No, but evidence that it's the ruling force include:
  • People worry about their shy children, not their outgoing children
  • In corporate settings, quick brainstorming is rewarded, not carefully reasoned answers 2 days later
  • In a recent Harvard Business Review study, the researchers professed surprise that Introverted types could be effective and excellent leaders
  • Class participation, defined as speaking up rather than as listening attentively, is still graded heavily in many, many schools
  • Teachers usually give people less than 2 seconds to answer, whereas research shows correct answers will triple if 5 seconds are allowed. 5 seconds of silence is an eternity to most people in this country

There is much, much more. People from within cultures that they've determined are Introverted (Japan, First Nations, Finland, UK, etc.) report different norms. It has nothing to do with % in the population but with "approved" behaviors.

edcoaching
 

redacted

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It seems silly to keep on saying this but MBTI has no more truth value than astrology.

MBTI and astrology are essentially religious beliefs.

MBTI and astrology are not connected to reality. They are essentially imaginary.

Personally I am very attracted to the imaginary, for instance in poetry.

So I would say that MBTI and astrology are essentially poetic.

After all poetry does nothing and neither does MBTI or astrology.

Poetry is completely useless like MBTI or astrology, and yet some think that poetry is the purpose of our civilization.

So MBTI and astrology are poetry for beginners.

But to stop at the beginning and go no further is to grow up absurd.

if you run with that line of reasoning, where do you stop?

why not label thought processes as cognitive functions? it's the same idea as calling something a table. is there some objective thing called a table? no. we subjectively apply terms to concepts. if you're against that, well...you miss out on language, metaphor, and basically any other key component of human thought.

and regarding truth value, MBTI and astrology are quite different. astrology arbitrarily connects behavior with star patterns, which obviously have a completely negligible effect. MBTI (i should say jungian functions) is a labeling device. it's a set of terms used to describe observed data. completely different...

if you use MBTI as a predictive device, you start running into more problems. most of the misapplication of MBTI lies in the false belief that Ns somehow don't use sensing all the time -- that thinkers somehow don't feel. once you recognize that everyone always uses S, N, T, and F all the time, and that being an S in MBTI only means that you're slightly more consciously attuned to sensing than intuiting, for example, there really aren't any problems with the system.

p.s. EVERY belief can be reduced to faith.
 
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