Type an IQ... Again!

[Blackwater]

So apart from the relatively bland studies avaliable on the net (which don't even seem to use standard IQ) does anybody have any info on this?

I came across an article recently that concluded that the traits correlated with high IQ are Introversion, Intuition, Thinking and Judging.

It also stated that INTJs had the highest IQ on average, closely followed by INTPs, INFJs and INFPs.

This seems to correspond well to my impression of reality.

It also corresponds nicely to my impression that while ENTPs are smart on average, ENTPs in the top 2% of the IQ scale are very rare.

---

Any thoughts on eigther or both?

EDIT: Ok, so I left out a 'd' in the thread title. Very ironic when discussing IQ. But you can't blame me! I've pulled an all nighter chatting with Bluewing. Admins please fix it if possible.

...ang good niglt!

 

[Samuel De Mazarin]

Let's discuss how one appraises IQ in the first place.

A may be inherently smarter and more talented than B at spotting patterns.... but A's less hard-working... and B has spent one year working on logic problems and training for the LSAT and MENSA tests...

A and B are both sitting for an IQ test which relies heavily on those abstract pattern recognition problems (which are thought to greatly reduce cultural bias, but more on that later)... because A's a lazy asshole, he comes out with a whopping 110 while B stuns everyone with 144.

Who's got the higher IQ?

________________________________________________________________________

As for culture bias, there may be people who are super-smart but don't think the way conventional scientists expect them to think.

For instance:

Q) Pick the odd one out in the following group of animals;

Elephant, Monkey, Snake, Rat, Koala

a) Elephant

b) Monkey

c) Snake

d) Rat

e) Koala

___________________________________________________________

I could choose:

a) Elephant because of its elongated proboscis.

b) Monkey because it's the only animal of the five which exhibits the use of tools.

c) Snake: It's a 'reptile' (lays eggs, etc.) and doesn't have 'feet' per se. It's also the only obligate carnivore of the group.

d) Rat: Rats are the only animals of the five which use their whiskers as extra-sensory tools. They're also the only animal of the five with a representative mutant in the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles show.

e) Koala: only animal of the five which carries its young in a pouch (it's a marsupial) <-- problem of greater uniqueness versus snake... so in this case, snake wins... but still...


Who's to say that the snake, which is typically the obvious answer, is the best one? Are we simply to go on stacking which animal's got 'more' differences? How would you ever find out? The possible lists are endless... Besides, who's to say that greater intelligence may not lie in the road less traveled by?
______________________________________________________________________

The whole point is... how does one determine intelligence?

My bet is that introverted types tend to be higher up on the (highly problematic) IQ scale because they tend to be more focused and thus concentrate more on building problem-solving skills in mathematics, etc. than highly excitable types like ENTPs and ESFPs. But that doesn't mean they're more 'intelligent', whatever that means.

 

[Samuel De Mazarin]

My apparent dislike of the IQ test can be derived from my experience with it...

I have gotten two official test scores, 122 and 154 (there was a four-year gap, the higher score came later)... on the internet my scores have ranged from something like 104 to 144!

You might as well judge people's intelligence based on the sum total of their standardized testing scores.

 

[Blackwater]

I agree that IQ is flawed in oh-so-many ways.

None the less, there are also some very telling correlations

Take, for instance, the world's leading academic mathematicians.

 

[Haphazard]

Okay, there's a very simple explanation for why INTJs tend to score high on IQ:

They tend to be very good test takers.

Introversion and intuition give all these types the attention span and ability for pattern recognition that the test is asking for, but why the order? INTJs tend to have a very strong feeling that they're 'right' when taking tests so they go with their first instinct and move on, without looking back -- which has been shown by studies to yield a higher score than if you were to deliberate a lot over the answer (like an NP would). Also, Ni+Te would be cockier than Ni+Fe if it believes it knows the answer.

So, you know, with INTJs, if one of them comes around with a high IQ, you can say, "Damn, you're a good test taker!" That's one of the reasons why INTJs tend to have some of the highest grades in school, too. It doesn't have much to do with their actual intelligence than their testing style.

 

[pure_mercury]

Aren't ESFJs supposed to be amongst the least likely to have very high IQ's?

 

[disregard]

As for culture bias, there may be people who are super-smart but don't think the way conventional scientists expect them to think.

For instance:

Q) Pick the odd one out in the following group of animals;

Elephant, Monkey, Snake, Rat, Koala

a) Elephant

b) Monkey

c) Snake

d) Rat

e) Koala

___________________________________________________________

I could choose:

a) Elephant because of its elongated proboscis.

b) Monkey because it's the only animal of the five which exhibits the use of tools.

c) Snake: It's a 'reptile' (lays eggs, etc.) and doesn't have 'feet' per se. It's also the only obligate carnivore of the group.

d) Rat: Rats are the only animals of the five which use their whiskers as extra-sensory tools. They're also the only animal of the five with a representative mutant in the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles show.

e) Koala: only animal of the five which carries its young in a pouch (it's a marsupial) <-- problem of greater uniqueness versus snake... so in this case, snake wins... but still...


Who's to say that the snake, which is typically the obvious answer, is the best one? Are we simply to go on stacking which animal's got 'more' differences? How would you ever find out? The possible lists are endless... Besides, who's to say that greater intelligence may not lie in the road less traveled by?
______________________________________________________________________

The whole point is... how does one determine intelligence?

My bet is that introverted types tend to be higher up on the (highly problematic) IQ scale because they tend to be more focused and thus concentrate more on building problem-solving skills in mathematics, etc. than highly excitable types like ENTPs and ESFPs. But that doesn't mean they're more 'intelligent', whatever that means.

Thank you so much for pointing this out. This is a problem I have had with tests in school for ages.. I would over-think the question, and rule out the obvious answer in favor of another. It's not that I didn't think the obvious answer was correct, but I would find connections between the question and other answers as well.. And it became a matter of.. "what are they really asking here?" It's just fucked. That's why math is enjoyable.

 

[Night]

Listen to Sam De Maz.

Intelligence is impossibly subjective.

 

[Mondo]

I went to a private school where you needed an IQ of 135 to get in.
Trust me!
There were more SJ's and SP's than NT's and NF's.
If you went to the school I went, you would agree there were a good number of people who were very much Sensor-types, even in terms of the stereotypical descriptions of Guardians and Artisans.
However, it was probably 40% N, 60% S.. which is unusually high.

 

[Night]

You give me a hideous idea, Mondo...

Has anyone ever had an IQ test? If so, what were the results...?

 

[Samuel De Mazarin]

I agree that IQ is flawed in oh-so-many ways.

None the less, there are also some very telling correlations

Take, for instance, the world's leading academic mathematicians.

Well... obviously... right? Mathematicians have drilled themselves into doing complex logic problems... I guarantee you I'll pump up my IQ score by at least five or ten, maybe fifteen points if I get a PhD... I wouldn't be surprised if it went higher.

(though I would cry every step of the way till my dissertation)

 

[Samuel De Mazarin]

Okay, there's a very simple explanation for why INTJs tend to score high on IQ:

They tend to be very good test takers.

Introversion and intuition give all these types the attention span and ability for pattern recognition that the test is asking for, but why the order? INTJs tend to have a very strong feeling that they're 'right' when taking tests so they go with their first instinct and move on, without looking back -- which has been shown by studies to yield a higher score than if you were to deliberate a lot over the answer (like an NP would). Also, Ni+Te would be cockier than Ni+Fe if it believes it knows the answer.

So, you know, with INTJs, if one of them comes around with a high IQ, you can say, "Damn, you're a good test taker!" That's one of the reasons why INTJs tend to have some of the highest grades in school, too. It doesn't have much to do with their actual intelligence than their testing style.

I had very high test scores in school and always finished first... I think a lot of what you're saying is absolutely on the ball (as far as typing can be), but I have a lot of faith in the power of ambition.

I hated math so I abandoned it after high school... five years later, I'm studying it again... math is so bad, it's good.

 

[Night]

I hated math so I abandoned it after high school... five years later, I'm studying it again... math is so bad, it's good.

Wait till you discard Euclidean limits and move into free-range, vectorless matrices.

Knock you on your ass, man. Math is great.

 

[Samuel De Mazarin]

You give me a hideous idea, Mondo...

Has anyone ever had an IQ test? If so, what were the results...?

I already mentioned mine... 122 at the age of 16 and 154 at 20.

 

[Samuel De Mazarin]

Wait till you discard Euclidean limits and move into free-range, vectorless matrices.

Knock you on your ass, man. Math is great.

I'm very excited about eventually moving onto geometry Riemann style... but I'm really into math for the chaos theory and combinatorics... probability and what not. OOoOOohh... and Set Theory... that, to me, is a very sexy sub-discipline in mathematics.

_____________________________________________________________________________

Night: you out of college yet?

 

[Night]

I'm very excited about eventually moving onto geometry Riemann style... but I'm really into math for the chaos theory and combinatorics... probability and what not. OOoOOohh... and Set Theory... that, to me, is a very sexy sub-discipline in mathematics.

Combinatorial math is boundless.

Chaos Theory and Quantum Field are great unifying agents. Have you studied either yet?


Edit - yes: I've been out of undergrad/grad college for a few years, now. I teach.

 

[Samuel De Mazarin]

Combinatorial math is boundless.

Chaos Theory and Quantum Field are great unifying agents. Have you studied either yet?


Edit - yes: I've been out of undergrad/grad college for a few years, now. I teach.

Oh shit! We need to talk... but no... I'm an absolute neophyte...

 

[Night]

Oh shit! We need to talk... but no... I'm an absolute neophyte...

Aren't we all?

 

[Thursday]

You give me a hideous idea, Mondo...

Has anyone ever had an IQ test? If so, what were the results...?

140
whatever that means

 

[SillySapienne]

Amongst the "gifted" population, ENFP's are the most prevalent type represented.

At 15.45%

Cerebrals Board • View topic - Characteristics and Behaviors of Gifted Women

SENG: Articles & Resources - Gifted kids at risk: Who's listening?

Which means.....

That we rock, and that all y'all are stewpid!!!!