I've got the worst MBTI + Enneagram Combo

[21%]

i know i know...but it is entirely in your head you know and no one else sees it.

We kinda secretly love it, ya know...

 

[21%]

I'm thinking right now that I prefer the enneagram system over MBTI. WHile the idea of cognitive functions is intellectually appealing, I'm skeptical as to whether or not they follow that neat stack.

I think MBTI/function theory might be useful for personal development, but perhaps less relevant for social interaction. I think with others, the enneagram type is more useful for me. It also sees easier to determine without a test.

Take dating... the MBTI types all seem so varied, even within a type, that it becomes silly to say "i'm looking for this type or that type." But with the enneagram thing, I'm looking for a 5 or a 7, and that seems to be easier to identify. MBTI doesn't actually seem to determine if we have compatible interests or not.

Most INTPs seem to be 5s, but there are also INFP and INfJ 5s. When I actually go on dating sites, and look at the test results of people who have done these MBTI-esque tests, I find myself surprised that "INTP shoo-ins"" show up as INFPs or INFJs. I think it's possible that what I think of as "INTP" is actually 5. I have this image in my head of INFxs as 1's, 2's, or 4's but judging from how people identify themselves here, it doesn't always line up that way.

It seems to make ore sense, though, to think of others in terms of the ennegram system... the focus is on specific wants or needs, which seems easier to determine than whether someone is a thinker or a feeler.

This is an interesting post. I used to feel that the Enneagram addresses 'deeper' issues somehow (but then I've been told by other posters that this is not true for everyone and that the Enneagram seems a hit-or-miss). One thing I've noticed is that I am much less influenced by my Enneagram type as I grow older. I don't know if that means anything.

What I feel is that MBTI helps a lot more in terms of communication between types. Cognitive functions seem to explain a lot of the differences and help you realize that other people are so different from you, from which you can develop a strategy to get better communication across. For example, deep down I understand where 4s are coming from, but I sometimes don't agree with them. MBTI seems to be a better predictor of everyday-level compatibility, and I feel that I can understand what other INFJs have to say than other 4s.

In more intimate relationships, however, I think understanding someone's Enneagram type is very important, because that's what makes them get out of bed every day, drives them to do things, whispers in their ears when they make decisions and haunts them in their nightmares. I think it helps you see who they are as a person more -- not that we need tools like this, but it's a starting point where pretty abstract things can be discussed.

To me, I feel that the Enneagram operates more on a subconscious level, while MBTI cognitive functions seem to manifest in the open (getting information from the external world, almost-conscious-level processing, interaction).

 

[Azure Flame]

This thread is turning into the E4 "Your life doesn't suck as much as mine does" competition, lmao.

[MENTION=15392]AffirmitiveAnxiety[/MENTION]

What specifically about me isn't congruent with your understanding of astrology? I feel the descriptions are pretty spot on except where it says capricorns are boring. Just curious. Lay it on me.

Edit: Actually some website say I'm a sagittarius and a flaming bunny. January 14 1988. I think some other sites say I'm an aquarius. I give up.

PS I still think you're Si Fe.

 

[Lady_X]

This thread is turning into the E4 "Your life doesn't suck as much as mine does" competition, lmao.

[MENTION=15392]AffirmitiveAnxiety[/MENTION]

What specifically about me isn't congruent with you? Just curious.

oh i thought that was the point...or the game we were playing....no? haha

 

[Qlip]

This thread is turning into the E4 "Your life doesn't suck as much as mine does" competition, lmao.

[MENTION=15392]AffirmitiveAnxiety[/MENTION]

What specifically about me isn't congruent with your understanding of astrology? Just curious.

What's interesting, is I'm not seeing that at all, I'm just seeing information being shared. Have you had some past traumatic experiences with 4s before?

 

[Azure Flame]

What's interesting, is I'm not seeing that at all, I'm just seeing information being shared. Have you had some past traumatic experiences with 4s before?

no. I saw two people complain about having the worst combo, both were E4's. Two points form a line, a line projects into the future. I was making a prediction as to the direction of this thread, that's all.

 

[Standuble]

no. I saw two people complain about having the worst combo, both were E4's. Two points form a line, a line projects into the future. I was making a prediction as to the direction of this thread, that's all.

I'm tempted to agree with the person who said you were a CP six. I've heard on the grapevine that it is the shittiest enneagram but I'm on the fence.

Four can be bad, nothing like being stuck in a neurotic wasteland where you lack a certain piece to make it all better and you have a need to be you even if being you is the problem. But at the end of it all you could probably write a poem or string a piece of literary prose. Think of all the poor sods who are 9, 1 (stick up the ass jk) and 2.

 

[OrangeAppled]

When I saw the title of the thread I figured you were probably a 4. The idea that another type would be better is a construct of the ego. The purpose of understanding the Enneagram is to learn how to transcend the trap of the ego, and for a 4 specifically it's to let go of the idea that you're inherently flawed and superior/inferior because of it.

The antidote to the 4 trap, as taught to me by Dr. Wyatt Woodsmall is the acceptance that everything is exactly as it should be.

What I personally found very helpful was to first become conscious of how envious I was and once I'd done that to work through it by repeating the phrase in my head 'everything is exactly as it should be.' Any 4 should find that phrase very therapeutic.

Once you start to work through it you'll stop feeling like it's any better to be another type and realize that it's only better to accept yourself and to evolve.

This is really important for 4s to learn. I find little mantras very useful because you're essentially changing your thinking patterns. I try and practice "negative thought replacement". My motto for some times was "be nice to myself" so that I'd correct any self-denigrating thoughts with nothing any worse I'd say to a friend I cared for. First, I allow myself to be flawed or "damaged" just like every other human. I think we block 1 integration when we think it means "perfection".

Now that I've become more conscious of envy, I'm working on the "everyone has it easier" attitude - which I don't experience as others not having problems or being superior, but being more likable, lovable & significant to others because they are "normal".

Letting go of "what is wrong with me that everyone has right?" is important; that thinking is the problem. Learning to feel gratitude is important too, and that includes extending it towards yourself. Focus on what you possess internally over what you lack & act on it. The 5 wing can really make you not ACT enough either.

To the OP - would you tell a friend you cared for that they have the worst personality? No, you are their friend & you'd likely focus on building them up when they are down. Treat yourself more like a friend.

 

[Stansmith]

This is really important for 4s to learn. I find little mantras very useful because you're essentially changing your thinking patterns. I try and practice "negative thought replacement". My motto for some times was "be nice to myself" so that I'd correct any self-denigrating thoughts with nothing any worse I'd say to a friend I cared for. First, I allow myself to be flawed or "damaged" just like every other human. I think we block 1 integration when we think it means "perfection".

Now that I've become more conscious of envy, I'm working on the "everyone has it easier" attitude - which I don't experience as others not having problems or being superior, but being more likable, lovable & significant to others because they are "normal".

Letting go of "what is wrong with me that everyone has right?" is important; that thinking is the problem. Learning to feel gratitude is important too, and that includes extending it towards yourself. Focus on what you possess internally over what you lack & act on it. The 5 wing can really make you not ACT enough either.

To the OP - would you tell a friend you cared for that they have the worst personality? No, you are their friend & you'd likely focus on building them up when they are down. Treat yourself more like a friend.

I relate to that problem alot too as an ENFP 6.

 

[Lady_X]

This is really important for 4s to learn. I find little mantras very useful because you're essentially changing your thinking patterns. I try and practice "negative thought replacement". My motto for some times was "be nice to myself" so that I'd correct any self-denigrating thoughts with nothing any worse I'd say to a friend I cared for. First, I allow myself to be flawed or "damaged" just like every other human. I think we block 1 integration when we think it means "perfection".

Now that I've become more conscious of envy, I'm working on the "everyone has it easier" attitude - which I don't experience as others not having problems or being superior, but being more likable, lovable & significant to others because they are "normal".

Letting go of "what is wrong with me that everyone has right?" is important; that thinking is the problem. Learning to feel gratitude is important too, and that includes extending it towards yourself. Focus on what you possess internally over what you lack & act on it. The 5 wing can really make you not ACT enough either.

To the OP - would you tell a friend you cared for that they have the worst personality? No, you are their friend & you'd likely focus on building them up when they are down. Treat yourself more like a friend.

awesome oa this is the same advice i give my infp 4w5 bf

because to me it's so obvious that this is the issue and we are total opposites in that way. we both have fears, concerns or doubts...but i have that positive encouraging mother/friend voice in my head that tells me loving and supportive things and it's as though he has an abusive, belligerent mean as fuck stepfather in his...telling him he's not good enough or he's going to mess it up etc.

that is the whole toxic thing there.

i think just reminding yourself that every single person has something they feel inadequate about (even if it's so buried that they're unaware of it)
but everyone has fears...everyone has strengths and weakness

just be kind to yourself and lift yourself up
that doesn't mean just accept things that you'd like to improve...absolutely work on the stuff you'd like to improve on but don't falsely believe that you're all screwed up because you weren't born just being naturally good at it...cuz you know what? those people who are...are not naturally good at the things that you are either.

 

[Qlip]

no. I saw two people complain about having the worst combo, both were E4's. Two points form a line, a line projects into the future. I was making a prediction as to the direction of this thread, that's all.

Well, good, that's what I want if that's what's out there. That's interesting data. Thanks for the forecast.

 

[OrangeAppled]

I relate to that problem alot too as an ENFP 6.

Yeah, I think a difference is e6s have more negative thoughts containing worry, doubt, and insecurity about their abilities or standing with others.

As an e4, it's more like a sense of shame, being cursed (not doubt, but KNOWING you are hopelessly flawed & sort of giving up to it), and feeling unlovable/unlikable & misunderstood in regards to your strengths. I don't really worry or fear a lot - it's more like I lament bitterly.

awesome oa this is the same advice i give my infp 4w5 bf

because to me it's so obvious that this is the issue and we are total opposites in that way. we both have fears, concerns or doubts...but i have that positive encouraging mother/friend voice in my head that tells me loving and supportive things and it's as though he has an abusive, belligerent mean as fuck stepfather in his...telling him he's not good enough or he's going to mess it up etc.

that is the whole toxic thing there.

i think just reminding yourself that every single person has something they feel inadequate about (even if it's so buried that they're unaware of it)
but everyone has fears...everyone has strengths and weakness

just be kind to yourself and lift yourself up
that doesn't mean just accept things that you'd like to improve...absolutely work on the stuff you'd like to improve on but don't falsely believe that you're all screwed up because you weren't born just being naturally good at it...cuz you know what? those people who are...are not naturally good at the things that you are either.

In Naranjo's Character & Neurosis, he mentions something about e4s internalizing the "bad parent". This may or may not be from a literal rejection of a parent, but they have a rejecting parent voice in their head. Interesting how as a 7 you have a "good parent" voice. I can't remember if anything was said in regard to 7s there (I lost my book! Or my cleaning lady thought it was satanic & threw it out, which I have no proof of).

But in regards to Stansmith's post, e6s may have something like a "paranoid parent" voice, like they internalized a parent's message that the world is scary, unsure place.

But yes, relating to others also helps you feel less alienated. As long as it's not invalidating, it's reassuring to see how all people struggle with such things internally.

 

[Stansmith]

Yeah, I think a difference is e6s have more negative thoughts containing worry, doubt, and insecurity about their abilities or standing with others.

As an e4, it's more like a sense of shame, being cursed (not doubt, but KNOWING you are hopelessly flawed & sort of giving up to it), and feeling unlovable/unlikable & misunderstood in regards to your strengths. I don't really worry or fear a lot - it's more like I lament bitterly.



In Naranjo's Character & Neurosis, he mentions something about e4s internalizing the "bad parent". This may or may not be from a literal rejection of a parent, but they have a rejecting parent voice in their head. Interesting how as a 7 you have a "good parent" voice. I can't remember if anything was said in regard to 7s there (I lost my book! Or my cleaning lady thought it was satanic & threw it out, which I have no proof of).

But in regards to Stansmith's post, e6s may have something like a "paranoid parent" voice, like they internalized a parent's message that the world is scary, unsure place.

But yes, relating to others also helps you feel less alienated. As long as it's not invalidating, it's reassuring to see how all people struggle with such things internally.

I relate to that at my worst, but yeah really, my image-related complexes are more 3-ish in nature than 4. My identity comes from being cultured, and having minimal flaws, rather than from being a tortured soul. I would love to seem like someone with emotional depth and insight, but its not the primarily place from which I derive my identity.

Overall, 4s own their unloveable-ness and want to find someone who still loves them regardless, while NF 6s want to figure out why they're unloveable, fix it, and become part of the group.

 

[chickpea]

ESTP SLE-Ti E8 Sx/So Capricorn Year of the Earth Dragon.

I'm pretty much in love with myself. Sucks to be you bro.

I'm glad I'm not a Capricorn tbh.

 

[Society]

no. I saw two people complain about having the worst combo, both were E4's. Two points form a line, a line projects into the future. I was making a prediction as to the direction of this thread, that's all.

need 3 points for a repeating circle..

but yea, basically the answer to this question doesn't answer the question of what combo is the worst to be as much as it answers what combo is the most inclined towards self-pity.

 

[OrangeAppled]

I relate to that at my worst, but yeah really, my image-related complexes are more 3-ish in nature than 4. My identity comes from being cultured, and having minimal flaws, rather than from being a tortured soul. I would love to seem like someone with emotional depth and insight, but its not the primarily place from which I derive my identity.

Overall, 4s own their unloveable-ness and want to find someone who still loves them regardless, while NF 6s want to figure out why they're unloveable, fix it, and become part of the group.

So why 6 & not 3 for your core type? 3s can worry also. They're the competent triad (1,3,5), not the positive triad. There's some obvious worry which can go with that.

I agree with the idea of "fixability" being in 6s.... This is likely why they're generally less morose - more sense of hope I guess, or an idea they can have control if they work hard enough. So they keep active in trying to troubleshoot, whether it's in mental theorizing or outer activity. They fear laziness, perhaps because problems may not get handled, and resist 9 integration because of it.

4s sort of lay down & die because the problem seems intrinsic, as if only the destruction of yourself could root it out - hence the emotional masochism.

 

[Stansmith]

So why 6 & not 3 for your core type? 3s can worry also. They're the competent triad (1,3,5), not the positive triad. There's some obvious worry which can go with that.

I agree with the idea of "fixability" being in 6s.... This is likely why they're generally less morose - more sense of hope I guess, or an idea they can have control if they work hard enough. So they keep active in trying to troubleshoot, whether it's in mental theorizing or outer activity. They fear laziness, perhaps because problems may not get handled, and resist 9 integration because of it.

4s sort of lay down & die because the problem seems intrinsic, as if only the destruction of yourself could root it out - hence the emotional masochism.

My life narrative seems more 6w7. I was never an overachiever when it came to grades or employment and I never felt like I had to impress my mother or be a golden boy like 3 kids do. I want to be seen as interesting and impressive but I'm not naturally good at it like core social-3s and I'm basically insecure.

 

[Avocado]

i wanna play!

okay so...imagine for a min being a 7! and being all yay fun adventure whoohoo but then having that annoying lil six voice going...ohhh...better not...cuz what if this or that or omg this!!! back and forth all day long!

they're super conflicting!! dontcha feel bad for me q?

I have that same problem, and being So/Sp makes me paranoid on top of that. I think most people are good, but if somebody hurts me…I worry that somehow I'm defective and that's why I was targeted. I can rationalize my fears away to an extent, but there is always a writhing core of anxiety to my daily life.

I also love dogs. My mother has a dog that just gave birth to puppies.

 

[Lady_X]

awwww i wanna puppy!! pics please?

 

[Avocado]

awwww i wanna puppy!! pics please?

Sure…
The mother dog is really protective right now, but when I have a chance…
I will…