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[skylights]

Im not going to let this go ... Think about those self help books though where it's the psychologist/sociologist who track "happy people".. The happy people almost always are the type of people who DONT ever even think "am I happy?". The researchers are probably no more happy than they were before they started their "quest" for happiness, and that's because happiness is probably a state of being rather than a place to arrive to. Merely asking yourself is probably enough to push you farther from it.

Sure, and I've read self-help books that say that very thing - that happy people don't really obsess about their happiness - they do whatever makes them happy. But what if the researchers are happiest researching? They've effectively made themselves happy by studying happiness. Writing makes me happy, and sometimes I write about happiness, which still makes me happy. That doesn't contradict itself. And some people are happy reading self-help books about happiness...

Secondly, not enough books tell the truth about giving up. The easiest way to overcome being a lone wolf with no friends? To get past not having a cool enough house? Give up and stop caring.

True, but if you have found the key to selectively not caring, you should probably publish and/or patent it as quickly as possible, because you are set to make billions with your new cure for addiction and childhood wounds.

My general theory on self-help books is that the people who read them probably read quite a few of them - it's more of a genre than a resource section. It's like people who like reading about cars, or fishing, or cooking. Some people like reading about self improvement. It's a hobby. That's why I relate it to NF, perhaps. Emotionally attuned people who like theory for the sake of theory would naturally seem to gravitate towards that kind of thing. It may be that NFPs are more drawn to them because we seek external information / Ne.

So essentially you have two groups of people who read self-help books - those who read them mostly because they enjoy them (and enjoy self-improvement in general) and those who read them pursuing a solution to one specific thing. If a book offers one concrete solution, and that person applies it and it's successful, then the book is not pointless. Whether or not that has ever happened, I am not sure, but I would be willing to bet money on it. Nor are the books pointless to the people who enjoy pursuing self improvement as a general hobby.

I suppose what I'm saying is they're as useful as you make them. If you don't like them, who cares? Don't read them.

 

[garbage]

Self Help books are useful when they serve as reminders of common sense concepts, when they organize common sense in an understandable and meaningful way, when they at least corroborate good concepts, and when they deliver their messages in a way that moves you to live by them and that absolutely compels you to keep them in the back of your mind and to draw upon and apply them when the time is right.

Many are bunk;some are not. They're typically written around some dude's collected wisdom, with parts that are either bullshit or simply not applicable.

 

[NathanZ]

My general rule with self help stuff is to ask: 'Is this teaching something actionable? Are there exercises that may improve my current thinking / behaviour?'

If yes, then I may give it a look. If no, then I don't bother unless it's by someone I've already read before.

 

[Eric B]

Personally... I would never even consider reading a self-help/motivational books. Unless of course I'd have a hidden agenda, but that is very unlikely.

I consistently noticed S types liking them... A lot. "Books about life" is what they call them. N types, however, don't seem to like them much, in my surroundings (online and offline) at least.

SJs or SPs, they like them. STs or SFs, they like them. Why? Is this "phenomena" widespread, or is it just my surroundings?

Would/have you read such a book? Why?

It seemed to me too that self-help was more an S thing. Especially ISTJ.

S's focus on concrete reality such as day to day living and getting through life, and less on meanings of things. Hence, they would always be saying "that's life", when I'm digging for meanings. So the books help provide them a framework of concrete reality, so they can adapt better, and that to me was always trite and fatalistic ("this is just the way life is, so you just have to adapt and roll with the punches"; at least how it came off to me).
Some sort of conceptual philosophy underlies most self-help, but this is already pre-packaged up for them, wrapped up in the concrete observations and experiences they are aware of.

Really MBTI itself is a self-help tool...so why would someone here dismiss the whole genre but accept MBTI? Seems...ironic.

If you're talking about here, then perhaps because the MBTI draws more N's, because it is more conceptual or abstract than mainstream psychology and self-help. So for me, for instance, it will provide the underlying meanings I've always looked for, rather than just saying "that's just the way people are, just because; now just adapt and deal with it". Understanding stuff like temperament and functions, it then became palatable enough where I could finally say "OK, this is why they do what they do, and this is why I react to it the way I do, etc.
When I try to discuss this stuff with S's, it's largely irrelevant, and more of a distraction with no ready answer. Even my wife, citing mainstream psychology critics, says Jung offers no practical, clinical-style solutions, or something like that. Well, of course it does, but you have to understand the deep concepts.

 

[the state i am in]

for people whose work is themselves.

there's also a kind of art to it. and the delicious narcissism of wanting to be fucking perfect.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4R8EkrZVq8A


my favorites are the wisdom of insecurity by alan watts and the five things you must accept by david richo. an entp 7w6 friend prefers control theory by glasser and an enfp 7w6 friend prefers 7 habits. i'm trying to work on these last two right now, along with the mindful way through depression by kabat-zinn/others. collectively they've been among the most helpful resources i've discovered so far. they also provide a touchstone to converse about yourself and dialogue with others to learn from each other in a more grounded way.

 

[Glycerine]

I am not a big fan of personal self-help books. I would rather research multiple sources/get input from others, analyze it and tailor the best option to my own specific needs. I like to figure out solutions on my own and am resistant to "self-help" books that pertain to the personal.