How do I get ENFJ's to turn down the Fe?

[The Great One]

Precisely. Typically, the objective of someone with smooth and strong Fe is to make sure the group atmosphere is comfortable and "appropriate". If it's a formal dinner and someone is interjecting good-humoured but crass comments and is making the atmosphere "awkward", then the Fe user feels compelled to fix that. So basically if you can convince the person that everyone's fine with it, then he/she will cool it.

Also, it's probably more about them than you. If they don't feel comfortable in the situation/atmosphere or the less they know, the more overbearing they may be with the social rules. E3s are usually extra self-conscious about this, I think.

EDIT: Social rules are like a proactive measure for the Fe dom.

Yeah, I know what you mean. I find 2 w 3 ENFJ's the very hardest to deal with because their Fe is just dreadful, as well as the 3 w 2 types. The easiest ENFJ's for me to deal with are the 8 w 9's.

 

[skylights]

It's just that sometimes I enjoy playing with groups and saying things for shock effect just to see what happens.

More and more you make the accuracy of your ENTP typing clear

To EFs in general, social group harmony is important, and there are some unwritten rules to socializing, including that you try to get along with everyone else for the sake of the group benefit. To say something just for shock effect is to essentially endanger the entire group's pleasant time for your gain alone. It's pretty selfish, in a way. So while I understand what you mean by ENFJs sort of taking on the role of moral police, and I know that it can be frustrating, it's also frustrating to have that one person spoil a really good conversation just because they feel like being ridiculous all of a sudden. IME, that's what it usually seems like ENFJs are trying to avoid, and their Ni is probably backing up Fe to rope in your Ne, which probably seems a bit superfluous to them. If you can demonstrate that you can interact without spoiling group harmony, then the Fe guard should go down, somewhat akin to what Glycerine was saying.

But as for getting ENFJs to quit acting like themselves because you feel like it's impeding your ability to act like yourself, well, that's kind of a hard question.

 

[The Great One]

More and more you make the accuracy of your ENTP typing clear

To EFs in general, social group harmony is important, and there are some unwritten rules to socializing, including that you try to get along with everyone else for the sake of the group benefit. To say something just for shock effect is to essentially endanger the entire group's pleasant time for your gain alone. It's pretty selfish, in a way. So while I understand what you mean by ENFJs sort of taking on the role of moral police, and I know that it can be frustrating, it's also frustrating to have that one person spoil a really good conversation just because they feel like being ridiculous all of a sudden.

No, I generally am a master of groups. I know just what to say and what to do in order to get a group to like me. Often times before I speak I will kind of read the room so to say. Then, sometimes I just randomly blurt something out just for kicks. Let's say for instance, a while back. They held a large wine tasting event in one of my favorite shopping plazas. The people there were all really rich and snobby and one of them said, "You should go taste the wine. It's simply splendid." I then said, "How much is it?" and she told me that it was 50 bucks. I then said, "Fifty bucks! That's bullshit! I think I'll just drink a bottle of "Old English" and drink it out in the parking lot." She then said, "While I never!" I then said, "Yeah, well you should try some."

 

[Zarathustra]

Hanging out with an ENFJ sounds like my personal version of hell.

 

[skylights]

No, I generally am a master of groups. I know just what to say and what to do in order to get a group to like me. Often times before I speak I will kind of read the room so to say. Then, sometimes I just randomly blurt something out just for kicks. Let's say for instance, a while back. They held a large wine tasting event in one of my favorite shopping plazas. The people there were all really rich and snobby and one of them said, "You should go taste the wine. It's simply splendid." I then said, "How much is it?" and she told me that it was 50 bucks. I then said, "Fifty bucks! That's bullshit! I think I'll just drink a bottle of "Old English" and drink it out in the parking lot." She then said, "While I never!" I then said, "Yeah, well you should try some."

I mean, I don't personally see the point in that. You (probably, I'm guessing) don't know if she was a horrible snob or a sweet, fun, and genuine person who was being nice by extending the invitation out to you, and you went out of your way to offend her. It is funny, and I'm not a fan of stupid pretentiousness, but it does seem kind of pointlessly upsetting to say. TBH, if I was there, I'd probably have laughed at your comment, because - well - it's funny. But I can see someone with more of a social consciousness feeling like it would be beneficial to curtail that sort of thing.

But my first comment - about your type - I know, ENTPs often have a good read on groups. It's hypothesized to be the tert Fe.

 

[The Great One]

Hanging out with an ENFJ sounds like my personal version of hell.

ENTJ types and ENFJ's often don't get along I've found. Hanging out with an ENFJ one on one is cool, but if you get an ENFJ in a large formal occasion it's like hell on earth. They do this thing where they'll like socially put you down in an indirect way. For instance, I once went to a formal restaurant with an ENFJ and I went to eat with one fork and it turned out that you were actually supposed to eat the salad with a different fork. Then, the ENFJ did this thing where they like fakely laughed, and put on this big fake "Joe Biden Style" politicians smile and was like, "Oh he's new to this, and but he'll get it eventually". At this point, I'm fuck this, and walked out.

I mean, I don't personally see the point in that. You (probably, I'm guessing) don't know if she was a horrible snob or a sweet, fun, and genuine person who was being nice by extending the invitation out to you, and you went out of your way to offend her. It is funny, and I'm not a fan of stupid pretentiousness, but it does seem kind of pointlessly upsetting to say. TBH, if I was there, I'd probably have laughed at your comment, because - well - it's funny. But I can see someone with more of a social consciousness feeling like it would be beneficial to curtail that sort of thing.

But my first comment - about your type - I know, ENTPs often have a good read on groups. It's hypothesized to be the tert Fe.

Again though, I knew exactly how they would react to my comment. I made the comment because I wouldn't to see the outraged look on their faces. It gave me a huge laugh.

 

[Istbkleta]

Basically, the same way Eric Cartman thinks of gingers:
http://www.southparkstudios.com/clips/103645/gingervitus

INTJ humor. Always funnier on the inside of one's head.

No offence meant, just taking a plucky jab at your ego as a comedian

Thanks for the link. Unfortunately it's not available in my area.

 

[Mal12345]

INTJ humor. Always funnier on the inside of one's head.

No offence meant, just taking a plucky jab at your ego as a comedian

Thanks for the link. Unfortunately it's not available in my area.

Use a browser proxy. I just tested this one on the link and it worked just fine.
http://www.cachemoi.com/

 

[Glycerine]

I tend to get along better with ENTJ than other ENFJs. I am sure about INTJs though. Hah!

 

[Santosha]

I didn't read the thread and am totally just throwing this idea out there, but you could always try to cleverly give the appearance of out fe-ing the fe user

So in this scenario of being censored, you could try to flip the social norms/harmony card against the Fe-user by ever so politely revealing the disharmony they are creating in censoring you while subtely pointing out how they do it to others. This would create moar disharmony but if you were clever enough it'd point back to the fe users censorship.

Ya, I don't know if it'd work.. but I may just have to try this somtime =P

 

[Zarathustra]

ENTJ types and ENFJ's often don't get along I've found. Hanging out with an ENFJ one on one is cool, but if you get an ENFJ in a large formal occasion it's like hell on earth. They do this thing where they'll like socially put you down in an indirect way. For instance, I once went to a formal restaurant with an ENFJ and I went to eat with one fork and it turned out that you were actually supposed to eat the salad with a different fork. Then, the ENFJ did this thing where they like fakely laughed, and put on this big fake "Joe Biden Style" politicians smile and was like, "Oh he's new to this, and but he'll get it eventually". At this point, I'm fuck this, and walked out.

Interestingly, that kind of a thing wouldn't bother me.

I'm awful at remembering arbitrary details, so I can't ever be sure whether it's the larger or smaller fork I'm supposed to use for salad.

I'd probably just make a self-effacing joke at my own expense, and feel very low levels of actual social shame.

Your tert Fe probably makes you more genuinely butthurt by the social shaming.

INTJ humor. Always funnier on the inside of one's head.

No offence meant, just taking a plucky jab at your ego as a comedian

Thanks for the link. Unfortunately it's not available in my area.

I considered dumbing it down so people like you could understand it.

I'm sorry the shitty country you live in prevents you from seeing the video.

If you were culturally more aware, you wouldn't have needed to see the link in the first place.

So in this scenario of being censored, you could try to flip the social norms/harmony card against the Fe-user by ever so politely revealing the disharmony they are creating in censoring you while subtely pointing out how they do it to others. This would create moar disharmony but if you were clever enough it'd point back to the fe users censorship.

I like it!

 

[Istbkleta]

I considered dumbing it down so people like you could understand it.

I'm sorry the shitty country you live in prevents you from seeing the video.

If you were culturally more aware, you wouldn't have needed to see the link in the first place.

This made me feel all fuzzy inside when I imagined what your inner dialogue must be like.

Have fun living with yourself for the rest of your life

 

[Lady_X]

Precisely. Typically, the objective of someone with smooth and strong Fe is to make sure the group atmosphere is comfortable and "appropriate". If it's a formal dinner and someone is interjecting good-humoured but crass comments and is making the atmosphere "awkward", then the Fe user feels compelled to fix that. So basically if you can convince the person that everyone's fine with it, then he/she will cool it.

Also, it's probably more about them than you. If they don't feel comfortable in the situation/atmosphere or the less they know, the more overbearing they may be with the social rules. E3s are usually extra self-conscious about this, I think.

EDIT: Social rules are like a proactive measure for the Fe dom.

I totally do that sometimes too... It's like me protecting other people. I can't stand for others to be made to feel awkward or uncomfortable unless of course they need it and should feel that way because they're being jerks or whatever.

 

[Zarathustra]

This made me feel all fuzzy inside when I imagined what your inner dialogue must be like.

Your delusions must be very satisfying.

Have fun living with yourself for the rest of your life

Your opinions about my ability to pull women really affect me.

 

[The Great One]

Interestingly, that kind of a thing wouldn't bother me.

I'm awful at remembering arbitrary details, so I can't ever be sure whether it's the larger or smaller fork I'm supposed to use for salad.

I'd probably just make a self-effacing joke at my own expense, and feel very low levels of actual social shame.

Your tert Fe probably makes you more genuinely butthurt by the social shaming.

Well yeah you could be onto something there.