MBTI questions of a childish nature

[Mort Belfry]

If type is inherent and can't be changed, which seems to be the current mode of thinking, (though strengthening of weaker functions is always possible) then at what point do we gain our type?

Conception? In the womb? Is it genetic? Are there sperm with strong Ti and Ne fighting off other sperm with strong Te and Si? Are there some pairings of parents that are more likely to have one type of child over another? Do the functions we "choose" to form strongly not arrive until we start to form self awareness at around age two or three?

And at what stage in our evolution did this happen? Homo Sapien? Erectus? Was it when we were still chimps or even tree shrews? Can we then type animals? Or would some animals have a different number of functions? Maybe just Si, Se, Ti, Te?

Do we even have the right number of types? Maybe there is eight funtions, but maybe there's fifty-six types? Or even forty thousand three hundred and twenty types?

Have these questions already been asked and answered? I'm curious.

 

[disregard]

If type is inherent and can't be changed, which seems to be the current mode of thinking, (though strengthening of weaker functions is always possible) then at what point do we gain our type?

"Weaker" functions which have been strengthened cannot become one's natural preference.. The reason they need be strengthened in the first place is because they do not come naturally to a person. Therefore, the strengthening of weaker functions cannot affect a person's type, although it might make them more balanced.

 

[Night]

Well, I'm of the logic that type is flexible (and intimate in expression) to the user.

External social influences combine with innate biochemistry to generate a cognitive process that dances to a cadence unlike that of any other. Revision is thus a sophistication culled from either (or both) avenues to arrive at one's approximate MBTI.

Where I to step back from this position, I'd infer that type is likely best demonstrated when the individual is programming his acumen to best appreciate the dynamics of his world.

This "exploratory" phase is probably best realized during adolescence. Maturational stages prior to adolescence likely lack the connective intellectual tissue to create meaningful connections between one's internal and external world.

To my initial point, I'd imagine a bevy of variables can influence (and possibly alter) one's MBTI. I suspect catalysts could range from the subtle (changes to one's career; social circle; familial structure; etc.) to the grandiose (physical re-location; personal trauma; psychosocial connection to one's community) might re-trace one's MBTI trajectory to best adapt to changes in one's environment.

I s'pose this proposition means I view the MBTI as a best-fitting buffer, hung carefully on one's psychological mantle.

 

[Seanan]

I didn't even need to look at your type!

Some have been on the site and others not.. check out the archives and starting making individual threads per question... well at least per a couple at a time.

 

[Mort Belfry]

"Weaker" functions which have been strengthened cannot become one's natural preference.. The reason they need be strengthened in the first place is because they do not come naturally to a person. Therefore, the strengthening of weaker functions cannot affect a person's type, although it might make them more balanced.

I know. That's what I was trying to get across. I was trying to suggest, tragically, in as few words as possible, that when people "change" their type, that they are in fact strengthening naturally weaker functions.

In my haste to ask the following questions I was trying to get that out of the way as quickly as possible.

"I s'pose this proposition means I view the MBTI as a best-fitting buffer, hung carefully on one's psychological mantle.

There's still a skeptic deep inside me that doesn't believe a word of it. I don't know where to hang it at the moment, but I don't have a psychological mantle, just a tattered trophy case piled high with scant information on a lot of meaningless subjects.

check out the archives and starting making individual threads per question... well at least per a couple at a time.

Yeah I just kind of spiralled out of control there, but you can pick any question you want to answer.

I didn't even need to look at your type!

You must have at some point.

 

[Haphazard]

Well, one could propose that any perceived changes in MBTI are actually somebody's maturation and growing appreciation for other functions when the actual MBTI doesn't change. And, you know, this is usually a good thing.

Type is descriptive, so you could divide into as many different categories as you like, except if you go too far, you have too many types and not enough reference material to go around. Once there are too many types, people can't be bothered to learn and understand them, and that's just another system down the drain. General consensus seems to think that 16 is a good number.

When it comes to the differences of young children and whether MBTI type is decided at conception, well, I don't think one will ever know because 1) nature versus nurture is a bitch to unravel and 2) MBTI is mostly used in the business world and by enthusiasts like us, so there's no study that would be willing to test any of this. Anecdotal evidence, though, suggests that there are some things about babies' personalities that are inherent or do develop very early. Whether this has an influence on subsequent MBTI type is unknown, though. MBTI, so I've heard, is supposed to be for people in their mid to late twenties for accuracy. This is likely because the brain is mostly developed by then. It's probably like chromatography or electrophloresis; there is certainly something that's definitely in the original, but what's in there doesn't distill or become obvious until later in life.

And there are other factors, too. Let's not forget Phineas Gage and all that.

Again with the animals and type, certain types of animals definitely display differences in personality -- look at dogs, for example. I don't think the breakdown of human psychology would be correct with trying to type animals, though. Because humans come in such great variety when it comes to psychology, I'm pretty sure that the differences in 'functions,' as we choose to describe them, came about pretty early. Go to zoos and ask, the chimps definitely have different personalities. Variety probably helped with survival, because though specialization breeds weakness for individuals, it can make a group strong -- and despite what introverts may want, humans are definitely social animals.

 

[aeon]

If type is inherent and can't be changed, which seems to be the current mode of thinking, (though strengthening of weaker functions is always possible) then at what point do we gain our type?

Conception? In the womb? Is it genetic? Are there sperm with strong Ti and Ne fighting off other sperm with strong Te and Si? Are there some pairings of parents that are more likely to have one type of child over another? Do the functions we "choose" to form strongly not arrive until we start to form self awareness at around age two or three?

I posted this on another forum, and I repost it here in answer:

---

I have the sense that human beings arrive in the world with a certain neural presentation that results in various forms of expression. In receiving that expression, we might choose to say that the infant is of a specific temperament.

That temperament, or more properly, neural potential, shapes the expression of the infant, and later, child. Interactions with the child are a function of the engagement style of the parents and other individuals, as well as the experience of being influenced by awareness of the child's temperament.

The degree to which the child's environment is one where that child's needs are met potentiates or inhibits different aspects of development.

Some time later, near pubescence, those children begin the process of individuation, and in so doing, begin to meet their own needs as best they can, with the resources they have available.

At this point, they may take the MBTI and type as one of the 16 types. The indicated type will be a function of their realized neurological potential, their nurturance (or lack thereof) in the world, as well as their expression of values that serve to meet their needs as human beings.


cheers,
Ian