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Introducing S vs. N

Mal12345

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How is that even relevant? Would the tire store be worse if his enemy owned it? I disagree with your S friend. It annoys me when people change their opinions about something because of that.

I thought this was too obvious to explain. Intuitives see both sides of the story; the Sensor in my example sees only one side.
 

Owfin

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I thought this was too obvious to explain. Intuitives see both sides of the story; the Sensor in my example sees only one side.

No, I got your example. I was reacting to your friend's argument.
 

Mal12345

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No, I got your example. I was reacting to your friend's argument.

I see what you're saying. The irrationality of the guy, who has a strong Si dom, makes me want to fly into a tizzy. Recently however I found a way to bring him under control, for the time being.
 

skylights

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i think i will do this list for myself and my ESFJ.

me --

S:
Concrete
Realistic
Prize enjoyment
Aware of current trends
Lives in the present
Often use straight talk
Aware of surroundings
Notices details
Often like crime novels
Practical
Factual
Observation over imagination
Often content with status quo
Make things happen
Loyal to friends

N:
Future-focused
Sees possibilities
Prize inspiration
Aware of own inspiration
Introspective about the past
Often use difficult words
Flighty ideas
Imaginative
Often dislike crime novels
Reflects but does not always do
Theoretical
Imagination over observation
Often restless with status quo
Contemplate things
See both sides

him --

S:
Concrete
Realistic
Prize enjoyment
Aware of current trends
Lives in the present
Often use straight talk
Aware of surroundings
Notices details
Often like crime novels
Practical
Factual
Observation over imagination
Often content with status quo
Make things happen
Loyal to friends

N:
Future-focused
Sees possibilities
Prize inspiration
Aware of own inspiration
Introspective about the past
Often use difficult words
Flighty ideas
Imaginative
Often dislike crime novels
Reflects but does not always do
Theoretical
Imagination over observation
Often restless with status quo
Contemplate things
See both sides

conclusion:

the real differences between us lie in terms of focus and attentiveness. he is highly present-focused and attuned to the ambient environment. i am highly future-focused and attuned to the conceptual realm.

we are both imaginative, contemplative, dissatisfied with the status quo, practical (i am e6, after all), linguistically sophisticated, motivated by short-term enjoyment, open to multiple sides of issues, and loyal to our friends.
 

chris1207

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When I look at that picture, not a single abstract thought comes to mind. It's just a tower. Yet I relate more to the N characteristics than S. In general, I don't make very many random associations, yet I'm not exactly living in the present and paying attention to my surroundings either; I daydream all the time. Would that make me S or N?

You sound like an SJ that has strong N. S doesn't equal 'living in the present'. That's Pe (either Se or Ne.) SJ's live in the past and NJ's in the future/realm of distinct possibilities (as distinguished from the shallow, mostly grounded possibilities of Ne (e.g. a wonderland that's realistic in many ways but has rainbow colors or schnoz-berries or something.).)

If you're an SJ, maybe you daydream because you're dissatisfied with where you have ended up in life.
 

Silveresque

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You sound like an SJ that has strong N. S doesn't equal 'living in the present'. That's Pe (either Se or Ne.) SJ's live in the past and NJ's in the future/realm of distinct possibilities (as distinguished from the shallow, mostly grounded possibilities of Ne (e.g. a wonderland that's realistic in many ways but has rainbow colors or schnoz-berries or something.).)

If you're an SJ, maybe you daydream because you're dissatisfied with where you have ended up in life.

I don't know, I could be SJ. :shrug: But I've been daydreaming for as long as I can remember, and I'm pretty sure it has nothing to do with where I ended up in life. Some people just daydream more than others, particularly INFP's, I think.
 

Owfin

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I daydream all the time. Sometimes I just go into total Si mode, watching images of the past slide and slip into each other to crazy tangents.
 

Mal12345

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I daydream all the time. Sometimes I just go into total Si mode, watching images of the past slide and slip into each other to crazy tangents.

Isn't there more to it than daydreaming? Is there a feeling-state accompanying the play of images? (For example, nostalgia.)
 

Mal12345

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When I look at that picture, not a single abstract thought comes to mind. It's just a tower. Yet I relate more to the N characteristics than S. In general, I don't make very many random associations, yet I'm not exactly living in the present and paying attention to my surroundings either; I daydream all the time. Would that make me S or N?

Everybody daydreams, it depends on the content. Consider someone who daydreams about making more money and achieving success, versus daydreaming about galaxies colliding, or unicorns.
 

Owfin

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Isn't there more to it than daydreaming? Is there a feeling-state accompanying the play of images? (For example, nostalgia.)

Well, any feelings I feel while daydreaming are my own present judgements. Like "This was good", "This was bad", "This was incredibly stupid". I go off and daydream new things, but when I do that it is my own present voice saying my thoughts, not images.
 

IZthe411

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Everybody daydreams, it depends on the content. Consider someone who daydreams about making more money and achieving success, versus daydreaming about galaxies colliding, or unicorns.

The more you try to put S/N into words or actions, the more confused it gets.
 

Silveresque

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Everybody daydreams, it depends on the content. Consider someone who daydreams about making more money and achieving success, versus daydreaming about galaxies colliding, or unicorns.

I was just about to say something similar but you beat me to it. :laugh:

When I'm daydreaming I make up fantasy stories, imagine conversations with people or review past conversations, think about typology, etc. Sometimes I imagine that I'm that in an alternate universe or something and everything around me looks different--suddenly the McDonalds I'm sitting in looks like a futuristic cafe on the edge of a cliff on an alien planet. (Well, that last part is something I just recently started doing occasionally.)
 

Mal12345

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I was just about to say something similar but you beat me to it. :laugh:

When I'm daydreaming I make up fantasy stories, imagine conversations with people or review past conversations, think about typology, etc. Sometimes I imagine that I'm that in an alternate universe or something and everything around me looks different--suddenly the McDonalds I'm sitting in looks like a futuristic cafe on the edge of a cliff on an alien planet. (Well, that last part is something I just recently started doing occasionally.)

I like to "force" different or unusual realities into being when I'm relaxed, but under stress I go into Si mode and fall back into a negative past history.
 

Silveresque

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I like to "force" different or unusual realities into being when I'm relaxed, but under stress I go into Si mode and fall back into a negative past history.

That sounds about right. Imagining alternate realities is something I have to make a conscious effort to do, whereas reviewing past conversations comes automatically when I'm under stress.
 

Owfin

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That sounds about right. Imagining alternate realities is something I have to make a conscious effort to do, whereas reviewing past conversations comes automatically when I'm under stress.

This is fascinating, because I normally review past conversations, really analyze them. When I am stressed, I can see possibilities for disaster around every corner, and suddenly looking at things with a measured view becomes hard.
 

Silveresque

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This is fascinating, because I normally review past conversations, really analyze them. When I am stressed, I can see possibilities for disaster around every corner, and suddenly looking at things with a measured view becomes hard.

Reviewing and analyzing past conversations might be something I normally do, I can't remember. I don't start imagining disasters though, at least not unrealistic ones. I do, however, plan very thoroughly to make sure things don't go wrong. Like for example, when I'm typing up a post, I have to make sure it's perfect and be very careful not to say something I might regret later (because Si is going to make me review it over and over again and find something wrong with what I said :dry:).
 

freeeekyyy

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freeeekyyy

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Everybody daydreams, it depends on the content. Consider someone who daydreams about making more money and achieving success, versus daydreaming about galaxies colliding, or unicorns.

I don't daydream about unicorns; I'm not an F. Thinking intuition is very different from feeling intuition. I'm more likely to dream about machines.

I'm really not sure this can be described entirely by any of the dichotomies though, or even function pairs. It's at least partly an individual trait.
 

IZthe411

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This is fascinating, because I normally review past conversations, really analyze them. When I am stressed, I can see possibilities for disaster around every corner, and suddenly looking at things with a measured view becomes hard.

Depends. I can do either. I definitely think about past convos with close friends and family but sometimes it's about future events with them. With unfamiliar people or objects I'm either thinking in and N type mode of what it could be if it wasn't what it was.
 

freeeekyyy

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S:
Concrete
Realistic Seems more of a T than S trait, tbh
Prize enjoyment
Aware of current trends
Lives in the present
Often use straight talk
Aware of surroundings
Notices details
Often like crime novels
Practical
Factual
Observation over imagination
Often content with status quo
Make things happen
Loyal to friends
If American; more likely to be conservative This terminology is troublesome. I think there may be a connection between being a sensor and having a "conservative lifestyle," but you seem to mean it as political left/right. I'm an intuitive, and could generally be considered liberal in my worldview, but identify more with the right than left.

N:
Future-focused
Sees possibilities
Prize inspiration
Aware of own inspiration
Introspective about the past This is something which is commonly associated not with either type of intuition, but with Si
Often use difficult words
Flighty ideas More Ne than Ni
Imaginative
Often dislike crime novels
Reflects but does not always do Seems more a P than an N trait. I think your usage of intuition has colored your perception of it for everybody else
Theoretical
Imagination over observation
Often restless with status quo
Contemplate things
See both sides
If American; more likely to be liberal True-ish. Same criticism as I gave earlier. I have a generally "liberal" outlook but am not a left-winger.
 
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