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Possible rule for determining one's MBTI Tertiary doppelganger

Mal12345

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I'll start with my own type, and derive the pattern from there:

Dominant - Tertiary
INTP - ISTJ
INFP - ISFJ
INTJ - INFP
INFJ - INTP
ISTP - INTJ
ISFP - INFJ
ISTJ - ISFP
ISFJ - ISTP

ENTP - ENFJ
ENFP - ENTJ
ENTJ - ESTP
ENFJ - ESFP
ESTP - ESFJ
ESFP - ESTJ
ESTJ - ENTP
ESFJ - ENFP

When deriving the tertiary MBTI from a dominant -

1. the attitude (I/E) remains the same, but is reinforced by the tertiary (tertiary users will probably score as high as 100% on the I/E scales).

2. The Dominant letter remains the same (the T in Ti, the S in Si).

3. The Auxiliary letter changes to its opposite (S to N, T to F).

4. And J/P changes to its own opposite.
 

Silveresque

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Cool, seems like it works. I always figured there was some kind of pattern, but I could tell it wasn't a simple or obvious one. Thanks for figuring this out and sharing!
 

Thalassa

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I've seen this in someone!!!

Really using the tertiary, scoring as EXTREMELY INTROVERTED, and appearing as their doppelganger, at least in more distant contact.
 

Little_Sticks

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I've seen this too. That's god damn awesome that I'm not the only one; that means it probably has more truth to it then.
 

King sns

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huh. :yes: I like that... only, without consuming the time it may take for me to change all the types, i'll try to explain my thought. I would think the doppleanger would be one with similar functions all around.... like, instead of INTP (Ti/Ne/Si/Fe) with ISTJ (si/te/fi/ne) it would more be like INTP with ISFJ- jumbled functions (Si/Fe/Ti/Ne.) Know what I mean? I've always thought of strange similarities in the people with jumbled functions- one's tertiary is another one's primary and visa versa (and other top functions are the same.) . Ugh, this is coming out so strange, I hope it makes sense.

Just one more example to make me more comfortable with this post. INFP (Fi/Ne/Si/Te) with ISTJ (Si/Te/Fi/Ne)
 

Thalassa

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Well they're called dom-tert loops. It's not like mal invented this, this is fucking Lenore Thomson, repackaged. :bored:
 

King sns

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Well they're called dom-tert loops. It's not like mal invented this, this is fucking Lenore Thomson, repackaged. :bored:

Hmm... maybe not... wasn't listening, and re read again. Was what I said more Lenore Thompson? I'm not read on her, so I wouldn't know anyway- his thing could be trying to attempt something different.
 

Thalassa

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No he's talking about Lenore Thomson dom-tert loops. As you can see, at the top it says "Dominant-Tertiary."

Like an ISTJ in an Si-Fi loop can seem ISFP (or INFP, which is more similar to what you've said about matchy matchy functions)...but typically yeah more like an ISFP since they're presenting a Sensing function even though it's not Se. They can look like an extremely introverted ISFP.

Or an ISFP in an Fi-Ni loop can actually look similar to an INFP (though mal has INFJ listed, I would say it depends on how strong the Ni is vs. Fi).

Yes, this is absolutely pre-packaged Lenore Thomson dom-tert theory, and I do agree with her theory, and I've witnessed it in people.

It's only pre-packaged because he's making it more about letters than functions. I just wanted to make sure to point out that this is based in a more widely accepted theory since I neglected to do so before.

I sometimes forget how haphazard the knowledge is on this forum about function theory. It's one of the main things I like about Personality Nation, though I'm much more comfortable with the warm social environment here and the level of activity.
 

redcheerio

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I'll start with my own type, and derive the pattern from there:

Dominant - Tertiary
INTP - ISTJ
INFP - ISFJ
INTJ - INFP
INFJ - INTP
ISTP - INTJ
ISFP - INFJ
ISTJ - ISFP
ISFJ - ISTP

ENTP - ENFJ
ENFP - ENTJ
ENTJ - ESTP
ENFJ - ESFP
ESTP - ESFJ
ESFP - ESTJ
ESTJ - ENTP
ESFJ - ENFP

When deriving the tertiary MBTI from a dominant -

1. the attitude (I/E) remains the same, but is reinforced by the tertiary (tertiary users will probably score as high as 100% on the I/E scales).

2. The Dominant letter remains the same (the T in Ti, the S in Si).

3. The Auxiliary letter changes to its opposite (S to N, T to F).

4. And J/P changes to its own opposite.

Wait. Wouldn't ENTP be Ne-Ti-Fe while ENFJ would be Fe-Ni-Se?

So should #3 be the Tertiary of the second is the opposite of the Primary of the first?

Cuz in the case of ENTP-ENFJ, #3 as described isn't true.

I haven't checked the others, though.
 

Thalassa

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Wait. Wouldn't ENTP be Ne-Ti-Fe while ENFJ would be Fe-Ni-Se?

So should #3 be the Tertiary of the second is the opposite of the Primary of the first?

Cuz in the case of ENTP-ENFJ, #3 as described isn't true.

I haven't checked the others, though.

You are correct. In Thomson's theory of Dom-Tert loops the loop of the ENTP is more similar to that of the ESFJ, and the loop of the ESTP to the ENFJ.

But Mal is taking into consideration that an Ne dom (such as ENTP) would still look a little more like an ENFJ if they were using a ton of Fe and skipping their Ti.
 
R

ReflecTcelfeR

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You are correct. In Thomson's theory of Dom-Tert loops the loop of the ENTP is more similar to that of the ESFJ, and the loop of the ESTP to the ENFJ.

But Mal is taking into consideration that an Ne dom (such as ENTP) would still look a little more like an ENFJ if they were using a ton of Fe and skipping their Ti.

I can attest for that statement. Just as evidence to the point.
 

redcheerio

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You are correct. In Thomson's theory of Dom-Tert loops the loop of the ENTP is more similar to that of the ESFJ, and the loop of the ESTP to the ENFJ.

But Mal is taking into consideration that an Ne dom (such as ENTP) would still look a little more like an ENFJ if they were using a ton of Fe and skipping their Ti.

With ENTP & ENFJ, the dom-tert is Ne-Fe & Fe-Se, so they only share Ne. Does the auxiliary Ni in the ENFJ somehow make up the difference?

Strange that I've had so much trouble with a few ESFJs in the workplace considering we share Ne-Fe as reverse dom-tert functions. :thinking:

I do have a few best friends who are ENFJs, though. I don't get it.
 

Thalassa

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With ENTP & ENFJ, the dom-tert is Ne-Fe & Fe-Se, so they only share Ne. Does the auxiliary Ni in the ENFJ somehow make up the difference?

Strange that I've had so much trouble with a few ESFJs in the workplace considering we share Ne-Fe as reverse dom-tert functions. :thinking:

I do have a few best friends who are ENFJs, though. I don't get it.

There is a theory that Ns get along better with other Ns, or that Se and Si dom/aux complement one another and that Ne and Ni dom/aux complement one another. Other people will tell you that it's those people with similar functions that make us happy.

In my opinion, the judging functions are THE MOST IMPORTANT. Te/Ti and Fe/Fi. I think those honestly cause the hugest clashes with people, or people who are honest-to-god opposites, like an ENFJ and an ISTJ...no functions in common, oh no not one.

Compatibility tends to be a more individual thing, too ya know. Some of that comes from non-MBTI related things like common interests, belief systems, and just what you as a person feel comfortable being around, possibly due to parental influence, childhood, or culture, et al.

ENTP and ENFJ share judging functions, Fe and Ti, which is what is supposed to be the real magic I suppose.

I try to apply personality theory to compatibility as lightly as possible, and focus more on individual strengths, weaknesses, and development, though it would be a lie for me to say that I don't see trends...particularly with judging function compatibility (Ti and Fe vs. Fi and Te) but other people might disagree.
 

redcheerio

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There is a theory that Ns get along better with other Ns, or that Se and Si dom/aux complement one another and that Ne and Ni dom/aux complement one another. Other people will tell you that it's those people with similar functions that make us happy.

That's true. I never thought it was strange until I thought of it from the perspective of sharing reversed dom-tert functions.

In my opinion, the judging functions are THE MOST IMPORTANT. Te/Ti and Fe/Fi. I think those honestly cause the hugest clashes with people, or people who are honest-to-god opposites, like an ENFJ and an ISTJ...no functions in common, oh no not one.

That makes sense. It seems especially true of the extroverted judging functions. Perceiving functions seem to live and let live, but judging functions are literally the ones that make judgements, and when those functions are extroverted, it seems like there is more potential for clashes.


Compatibility tends to be a more individual thing, too ya know. Some of that comes from non-MBTI related things like common interests, belief systems, and just what you as a person feel comfortable being around, possibly due to parental influence, childhood, or culture, et al.

ENTP and ENFJ share judging functions, Fe and Ti, which is what is supposed to be the real magic I suppose.

Hm, that makes sense.


I try to apply personality theory to compatibility as lightly as possible, and focus more on individual strengths, weaknesses, and development, though it would be a lie for me to say that I don't see trends...particularly with judging function compatibility (Ti and Fe vs. Fi and Te) but other people might disagree.

I agree, there is much more to personality than MBTI type. But the fact that a lot of people can look back on their lives, prior to any MBTI knowledge, and find a pattern in their past friends' and boyfriends'/girlfriends' MBTI types, indicates that MBTI type does have a large influence on natural compatibility. Not that I've done a scientific study to prove this or anything, though. ;)
 

wildcat

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I'll start with my own type, and derive the pattern from there:

Dominant - Tertiary
INTP - ISTJ
INFP - ISFJ
INTJ - INFP
INFJ - INTP
ISTP - INTJ
ISFP - INFJ
ISTJ - ISFP
ISFJ - ISTP

ENTP - ENFJ
ENFP - ENTJ
ENTJ - ESTP
ENFJ - ESFP
ESTP - ESFJ
ESFP - ESTJ
ESTJ - ENTP
ESFJ - ENFP

When deriving the tertiary MBTI from a dominant -

1. the attitude (I/E) remains the same, but is reinforced by the tertiary (tertiary users will probably score as high as 100% on the I/E scales).

2. The Dominant letter remains the same (the T in Ti, the S in Si).

3. The Auxiliary letter changes to its opposite (S to N, T to F).

4. And J/P changes to its own opposite.

Study Mendel.
 

Mal12345

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With ENTP & ENFJ, the dom-tert is Ne-Fe & Fe-Se, so they only share Ne. Does the auxiliary Ni in the ENFJ somehow make up the difference?

Strange that I've had so much trouble with a few ESFJs in the workplace considering we share Ne-Fe as reverse dom-tert functions. :thinking:

I do have a few best friends who are ENFJs, though. I don't get it.

ENTP/ENFJ
ENFJ/ESFP

Please feel free to add to or even negate any of the following according to your own experiences.

For the ENTP, abstraction, which usually rules, moves to the background when the tertiary doppelganger takes charge and the ENTP personality becomes unbalanced. The problem involves the ENTP's social relationships, which can become endangered due to eccentric behavior. Fe, in this case, may try to come to the rescue, but will only make social matters worse. I would surmise that, when this happens, the ENFJ tertiary will call forth social values to eradicate the 'enemy,' spurning and casting out all those who have offended the ENTP. The ENTP will project the ENTP's faults onto the objects. It's never the subject's fault, but always the object, in this case, others in society, or so the rationalization goes. But it is the ENTP who is his own worst enemy.

The ENFJ personality develops a histrionic aspect when the ESFP doppelganger comes forward to ham-handedly solve problems caused by personal neglect in the intuitive realm, especially that involving social harmony. The problem is not that ESFP tertiary is undeveloped, it may be very well developed, it simply lacks experience in the social realm and therefore falls back on an instinct for social manipulation. An ESFP may often score as an ennea-type 2 along with the ENFJ. The presence of the tertiary explains why such very different personalities score as the same ennea-type.
 

Mal12345

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There is a theory that Ns get along better with other Ns, or that Se and Si dom/aux complement one another and that Ne and Ni dom/aux complement one another. Other people will tell you that it's those people with similar functions that make us happy.

In my opinion, the judging functions are THE MOST IMPORTANT. Te/Ti and Fe/Fi. I think those honestly cause the hugest clashes with people, or people who are honest-to-god opposites, like an ENFJ and an ISTJ...no functions in common, oh no not one.

Not unless you count their tertiary MBTI types. That is, if you want to. They do share Se in common, but only if you count the ISTJ's auxiliary Se in the tertiary. And then they would have to be unbalanced personalities relying on tertiaries to take up the slack.
 
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