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Some kind soul, please teach me how to develop Fi.

Stanton Moore

morose bourgeoisie
Joined
Mar 4, 2009
Messages
3,900
MBTI Type
INFP
Determine what your 'code' is. What things do you believe which are non-negotiable based on circumstances? For instance, do you believe that all people are inherently equal? Do you believe that certain actions are always good, and should therefore be pursued? Do you believe that dominance via violence is wrong? Etc.. Those things are your values, the things you are willing to suffer for.
Also, be aware that when you are using logic, there are values in the background. Think about it: if you have two people, or equal intelligence, one Republican, the other Democrat, they will come to radically different conclusions regarding the same issue. Why? Because their presuppositions are different. Those presuppositions are their values. Anytime you consider something having to do with people, you are using values behind your logic. Anytime you need to interpret anything, you are using values.
 

Lily flower

New member
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Jun 28, 2010
Messages
930
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INFJ
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2
ISTJ's have people reading skills? Then why are they so mean all the time?
 

Thalassa

Permabanned
Joined
May 3, 2009
Messages
25,183
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ISFP
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sx
ISTJ's have people reading skills? Then why are they so mean all the time?

IxTJ types tend to seem "mean" on the outside but have a soft squishy inside if you pay attention, like a Cadbury creme egg.

I find ISTJs to be more boring than mean, usually. There are mean ones, of course, the ones who are less comfortable with feelings in general, or I should say, they have mean moments.
 
R

Riva

Guest
Determine what your 'code' is. What things do you believe which are non-negotiable based on circumstances? For instance, do you believe that all people are inherently equal? Do you believe that certain actions are always good, and should therefore be pursued? Do you believe that dominance via violence is wrong? Etc.. Those things are your values, the things you are willing to suffer for.

I must have extremely weak Fi. Since I believe that there are very few non-negotiable circumstances. (Well there are exceptions, many exceptions), but for me most situations are negotiable.

For example, when someone does something that is somewhat intolerable one of the 1st things I think about is, WHY DID HE/SHE DO....?

So at the end of tunnel I would still hold the actions wrong but I would try to come to terms with it. (Since reason is what I always search for.) 'There is always a reason for that person to act that way'. Get the picture/philosophy in my head?

But no, I am not a person who looks for these reasons to forgive the culprit. It is just reason I look for. And I always do find reason (though do not justify it). Just UNDERSTANDS it.
 

Totenkindly

@.~*virinaĉo*~.@
Joined
Apr 19, 2007
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50,192
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sx/sp
To put it in different words -
the thinking pattern of a Fi user. or
Ti users go after the facts, what do Fi users go after?

Same thing.

It's not that the facts change, it's the connections that are made among the facts and the way the facts that are prioritized that are changed, based on T vs F valuesets.
 
R

Riva

Guest
Become more in tune with your inner ethics. What do you identify as right or wrong aside from what is purely observable? What is your moral philosophy?

Where do I start? I mean I really haven't thought about this at all.

more in tune with what is genuine. When you talk to people, pay attention to your gut when you feel they are not being 'real', or when they are being questionable. How does another person's words and actions correlate with your own (or how you would voice/act on your own)? Can you tell when someone is being authentic? Take subtle cues and combine them with an inner value/moral compass.

Oh I just love that sentence. That helped me grasp Fi quite a lot.

----

But the question remains, where do I start or how do I start to figure out my moral philosophy?
 

Sunny Ghost

New member
Joined
May 28, 2010
Messages
2,396
But the question remains, where do I start or how do I start to figure out my moral philosophy?

hmm... i don't know... i suppose we could pose some questions for you as a jumping off point?

for my own sake, i wanted to look up Fi specifically before doing this:
It is often hard to assign words to the values used to make introverted Feeling judgments since they are often associated with images, feeling tones, and gut reactions more than words. As a cognitive process, it often serves as a filter for information that matches what is valued, wanted, or worth believing in. There can be a continual weighing of the situational worth or importance of everything and a patient balancing of the core issues of peace and conflict in life’s situations. We engage in the process of introverted Feeling when a value is compromised and we think, “Sometimes, some things just have to be said.” On the other hand, most of the time this process works “in private” and is expressed through actions. It helps us know when people are being fake or insincere or if they are basically good. It is like having an internal sense of the “essence” of a person or a project and reading fine distinctions among feeling tones.

i also found this interesting:
http://greenlightwiki.com/lenore-exegesis/Introverted_Feeling


mmk... value and moral questions...

Do all humans deserve our compassion and understanding? Each human being ultimately strives to be happy. For some, this means robbing the 7/11 to be able to afford the essentials they cannot buy on their own. For others, this means working diligently and being goal oriented. And yet for others, this means fame or popularity or partying or shopping sprees. And still yet for others, it means cramming their nose into a book. Each person seeks happiness in different routes, and we aren't always perfect and we aren't always right in how we seek it. But should each human being be allotted that room for error and be deserving of our compassion and understanding outside of these factors??
 

Thalassa

Permabanned
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Where do I start? I mean I really haven't thought about this at all.



Oh I just love that sentence. That helped me grasp Fi quite a lot.

----

But the question remains, where do I start or how do I start to figure out my moral philosophy?

Do you think Afghanistan deserves to be attacked? Yes or No?

Do you feel sorry for Chechens and think they deserve their own country?

What about Spanish? Are you American? Is it cool that Spanish speaking people have all these TV shows now and that everything is in their language? Are you angry, or are you happy that our country is becoming more bilingual?

What's your favorite color?

What does the song "Wind of Change" by the Scorpions make you feel? [YOUTUBE="n4RjJKxsamQ"]Please watch video closely in entirety before answering.[/YOUTUBE]

Did you cry when you broke up with your first girlfriend?

Don't you hate it when people talk down to you? Why or why not?

Doesn't ajblaise piss you right off?

If your answer to one of more of these questions is "I don't know" you need to have a serious conversation with yourself as to why the hell you don't care, and if you don't care, you should write us an essay explaining exactly why.

That's how you develop Fi.
 

Thalassa

Permabanned
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Uhh Fi people love me, Marmogram. :hug:

And I'm never in those Fe/Fi drama battles.

Oh no, see you don't understand there, Fe boy. You can't tell Fi people how they feel, or think they all love you (or hate you) collectively. There is no such thing as overall Fi consensus. Riva has to answer for himself, not because lots of other Fi people would feel the same way...that's Fe.

Besides, I was just trying to get your goat, you hater of lolcats, you.
 

raz

Let's make this showy!
Joined
Nov 11, 2008
Messages
2,523
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LoLz
As an ISTJ, it's hard to explain Fi outright without having Si thrown in everywhere.

I've always had these...images and insights flash in my head, that started since I was 10ish. It was always something to remind me of my own personal code of conduct, my own personal potential, my own personal purity. It always served as a reminder to look past what was on the surface, not of the things externally around me, but to look past the surface of the things I was involving myself in. I would always question whether I was getting caught up in something as part of an external society or as part of my own personal desires. It also would also point out to me the possibilities and existence of options outside the surface. This starts to get more into Extraverted Intuition. These ways of looking at things have always been with me and seem to serve as the anti-ISTJ, a way of keeping me from falling too far into the clutches of routines, forced decisions and inhumane outlooks. It's not a guideline. It acts as a guideline, but it is enforced through gut feelings and insight.

Introverted Feeling is about understanding and adhering to your own sense of ethics and beliefs. Religion is a good example. Being able to recognize your own right to a decision without external influences is what leads Fi users to easier religious changes and movements. As an SJ, it's easier to follow the collective viewpoint on religion, and stick to an organization or family's viewpoint. For me, it was especially harder during the holidays. My immediate family is Catholic, but I have decided over the past year to be Agnostic. I went against my family's beliefs, but I couldn't ignore my own personal analysis of religion. It was a higher priority to find personal comfort than to stick with the family.

As an Fi user, I have a constant struggle between Te and Fi. As a person who follows logic primarily and understands the advantages of putting aside personal attachments for the sake of accomplishing a goal, I struggle to strike a balance between doing such a thing and following what my personal feelings tell me about a given situation. Do I treat life as a chess board or act on my emotions? This is where the confusion sets in.
 

skylights

i love
Joined
Jul 6, 2010
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so/sx
my function order is Ne Fi Te Si... i dunno if it's the combo or just me, but i feel like Te often is the avenue to enforce Fi when my "lines" are crossed. they actually don't clash for me very much, they just seem to apply to totally different realms. though Fi concerns always take precedent...

as for developing Fi, i think really paying close attention to people and their motivations as individuals. not to how they act, but to their state of mind and how they feel. what makes them comfortable and what makes them uncomfortable, what they really care about / what really engages them and how they approach stressful things. try to find points of empathy with all people, especially if they really annoy you or make you uncomfortable - and if they do annoy you or make you really uncomfortable, then try to figure out what it is about them that's bothering you.

i feel like for me, Fi is often about getting to the "core" of things - the most basic line of (humanistic) reasoning. i see my values and ethics more as a system of reasoning than i do a set of "noble" causes or whatever. it's just what makes sense to me.
 
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