Fictional examples of sensing and intuition in action

[proteanmix]

I think people often use questionable examples of what is sensing and what is intuition by making sensing incredibly literal and intuition incredibly mysterious. I'd like to see some scenes from TV or movies where people believe a character is using sensing or intuition and how would a person using the opposite perceiving function differ in approach. If this person is using that big ol intuition buzz phrase "connecting the dots" can you use this as an indicator to definitely say whether or not this person is a sensor or intuitive? If people draw the same conclusion, how would you tell how they arrived there?

I'll start. This is the final scene from The Usual Suspects (w/ spoiler). I believe this is an example of "connecting the dots" via sensing. Agree/disagree? I'm thinking problem-solving would be the easiest area to distinguish sensing from intuition because you can follow mental processes.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-_6560AW1zQ&feature=related

Another one I can think of is a scene from the most recent Harry Potter movie where Hermoine says, "Actually I'm highly logical which allows me to look past extraneous detail and perceive clearly that which others overlook." Hermoine is usually typed as an SJ which makes this statement a typological oxymoron.

What are some other examples you can think of?

 

[KDude]

This is long, sorry.

[youtube=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ULzIE_Jy_p4]Se[/youtube]

 

[Randomnity]

Another one I can think of is a scene from the most recent Harry Potter movie where Hermoine says, "Actually I'm highly logical which allows me to look past extraneous detail and perceive clearly that which others overlook." Hermoine is usually typed as an SJ which makes this statement a typological oxymoron.

Ha, I just saw that last night and I noticed that, too! She seems to start out more ISxJ in the first movies and then move closer to N in every movie. Mind you, it would be strange if her character didn't change at all over so many years and dramatic events.

I think most of what Luna says is pretty stereotypical N.

I'll have to think about it for other examples. I have a hard time telling S from N in most characters (other than most action stars reeking of SP).

 

[KDude]

P.S. Carlito is just a metaphor. I don't mean it to be action heavy. Just kind of illustrating how he brings relevant present details to the forefront, makes use of what will work for him quickly. Or something (although I have been chased before myself!). And Benny Blanco is a metaphor for his lack of foresight.

I think Hermoine is just lying.

 

[Z Buck McFate]

I’ve often thought this movie smacks of introverted intuition, but it’s really hard to explain why. I think the characters are more sensor-like, but there’s a scene towards the end that- even though it catches the viewer off guard- it (or something similar) was obviously coming. The only way the main character knows that *something* is coming is because of odd, vague postcards and videos that keep being left for him. The *something* is in no way supernatural, it’s just a consequence of people dealing with each other and not paying attention to the affect they have on each other. And while the postcards and videos might seem to have some supernatural origin, it’s only because they come from nowhere and it doesn’t seem possible for them to exist. But my point here is that the postcards and videos (and other messages) strongly remind me of introverted intuition. Somehow.

And sorry- there isn’t a single scene that would make sense as an example of introverted intuition out of the context of the scenes that preceded it. Here's the trailer:

[YOUTUBE=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lS4VVUYsK44]"Cache (Hidden)"[/YOUTUBE]

And then this one could probably go either Ne or Ni:

[YOUTUBE=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V94WIjgQKWM]"from "Sweetie""[/YOUTUBE]

^The female character is clearly attaching some symbolic significance to the tree, there are some connections firing off about some parallel in her own life.

 

[Reflection]

I’ve often thought this movie smacks of introverted intuition, but it’s really hard to explain why. I think the characters are more sensor-like, but there’s a scene towards the end that- even though it catches the viewer off guard- it (or something similar) was obviously coming. The only way the main character knows that *something* is coming is because of odd, vague postcards and videos that keep being left for him. The *something* is in no way supernatural, it’s just a consequence of people dealing with each other and not paying attention to the affect they have on each other. And while the postcards and videos might seem to have some supernatural origin, it’s only because they come from nowhere and it doesn’t seem possible for them to exist. But my point here is that the postcards and videos (and other messages) strongly remind me of introverted intuition. Somehow.

I had this feeling too. Maybe it's the way the entire film is presented - some scenes just seem to scream intuition. It is very hard to explain why, especially if you're trying to explain it to someone who hasn't seen the film.

 

[proteanmix]

What do people think about problem-solving showcasing reasoning via sensing or reasoning via intuition? I guess I don't want this to get into mysterious or "I can't explain why" territory. Sorry, but I kinda feel like it's a cop out.

I think it's like watching a movie or TV program twice. When you see it the first time you miss a lot. When you go back and watch it again, you see the clues and setup very clearly and wonder how you missed it. The difference being you weren't looking the first time or you didn't know what to look for, but when you revisit it you see all that you missed. Question is, what would sensing and intuition both overlook and focus on in the first sweep? I think in those details are the tangible differences between sensing and intuition...what you exclude from focus or minimize the importance of being either "sensing" or "intuition."

Hopefully that makes sense.

 

[Z Buck McFate]

Not sure I understand exactly what you mean by ‘reasoning’. Do you mean 'thought process'? Was my second example clear enough, or is it still not what you are looking for?

I’ll have to think about how to explain further about the first example. I made a point of adding there was nothing supernatural going on because I was trying to avoid the mysterious/mystical label myself. I was going for ‘vague’. There are always very tangible reasons for introverted intuition, imo, it’s just that it isn’t always clear. (And it's worth adding that I would think Si would seem just as vague, and just as difficult to explain an isolated film clip of, wouldn't it?)

 

[proteanmix]

Not sure I understand exactly what you mean by ‘reasoning’. Do you mean 'thought process'? Was my second example clear enough, or is it still not what you are looking for?

Yeah, I'm using those terms interchangeably or I haven't made a strong distinction in my mind about how those are difference. I liked your second one I think that was a pretty good example of intuition...not wanting a sick and unhealthy sapling to be her marriage tree or the symbol of her marriage. The trigger was the yellow and withered leaves so it was based on something real...the guys explained it as a mineral deficiency which was probably correct but they didn't attach any significance to it. That was a perfect example, I think.

I’ll have to think about how to explain further about the first example. I made a point of adding there was nothing supernatural going on because I was trying to avoid the mysterious/mystical label myself. I was going for ‘vague’. There are always very tangible reasons for introverted intuition, imo, it’s just that it isn’t always clear.

I'm not sure myself, I think I'm trying to make something that has been historically unclear regarding sensing and intuition clear. I don't believe it has to be unclear. I'll let someone else explain what I'm getting at. When people use examples of intuition, I'm a little bit concerned they will veer into you just have to get it or it's hard to explain as a way to bypass an actual justification for why something is intuition. I think your second example didn't bypass that at all...maybe she couldn't explain why she felt so apprehensive towards the tree but it didn't come out of nowhere.

I like what David Chase, the creator of The Sopranos said about interpreting the final scene of the series...I think he does a better job at explaining what I'm trying to explain.

On moments during and after the final scene, Chase referred to a scene from the episode "Stage 5", "There are no esoteric clues in there. No Da Vinci Code. Everything that pertains to that episode was in that episode. And it was in the episode before that and the one before that and seasons before this one and so on. There had been indications of what the end is like. Remember when Gerry Torciano was killed? Silvio was not aware that the gun had been fired until after Gerry was on his way down to the floor. That's the way things happen: It's already going on by the time you even notice it." source

What I am focusing on in his statement that I think parallels what I'm trying to get is when people say "details" as a buzzword for sensing and "big picture" as a buzzword for intuition is there really no such thing as a detail or the big picture. It's just a matter of what you choose to focus on, what you choose to see, what you choose to notice. Everything that you needed to see and notice was there all along, nothing less nothing more just what are you concentrating on.

 

[KDude]

Really, I don't think Se in and of itself makes that many connections. A hardcore Se dom who hasn't developed auxiliary judging much would be mostly living, going with the motions, jumping at fun or personally empowering opportunities, and that's it. Connecting the dots would be related to whatever keeps them rolling.

(warning: some nudity)

[youtube=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EsgcsPW34VE&feature=related].[/youtube]

 

[wildcat]

How many conclusions do we have?
Only one.
It is there already.
You were not.

 

[IZthe411]

I'll start. This is the final scene from The Usual Suspects (w/ spoiler). I believe this is an example of "connecting the dots" via sensing. Agree/disagree? I'm thinking problem-solving would be the easiest area to distinguish sensing from intuition because you can follow mental processes.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-_6560AW1zQ&feature=related

This is definitely sensing!

I just wrote some similar thoughts over the last 2 days in this thread, starting on page 3.

Just like the guy sees the name in on the board, and all of a sudden all of these things start to come back to him, all of the dots are connected- THAT is a good example of Si in action.

 

[IZthe411]

I know myself, the beginning of the movie I'm just taking it all in. Usually in the beginning it's a set up for things to come. I'm less likely to pay much attention to the people (unless attractive) and even then it's her and not what she's doing LOL. Eventually, though I'll settle in, and pay attention to more of the characters.

ZBuck- I couldn't put together much with the clips of that first movie. Obviously the stuff they're getting in the mail is going to lead to something. What exactly that is we'd have to tune in. I would have to get past the subtitles, since I would want to be able to understand what they're saying less than what they're bodies are saying. The second is definitely symbolism. I think the girl was using Ne- that 'change' of the clothes line to that wilted looking flower threw her for a loop. Since I was paying attention to the action- which I usually do when I'm taking something in initially, I wasn't sure if she was the same girl at the beginning and end. I'm assuming she was, but I didn't look at the clip again.

 

[IZthe411]

What I am focusing on in his statement that I think parallels what I'm trying to get is when people say "details" as a buzzword for sensing and "big picture" as a buzzword for intuition is there really no such thing as a detail or the big picture. It's just a matter of what you choose to focus on, what you choose to see, what you choose to notice. Everything that you needed to see and notice was there all along, nothing less nothing more just what are you concentrating on.

My understanding of S vs N are 2 roads leading you to the same place, but both involve taking in the information and a level of interest.

I'm not a big film watcher, so I don't have anything to contribute, but I can chime in on whatever people put in here.

Kdude that's too long LOL.

 

[Z Buck McFate]

I'm not sure myself, I think I'm trying to make something that has been historically unclear regarding sensing and intuition clear. I don't believe it has to be unclear. I'll let someone else explain what I'm getting at. When people use examples of intuition, I'm a little bit concerned they will veer into you just have to get it or it's hard to explain as a way to bypass an actual justification for why something is intuition. I think your second example didn't bypass that at all...maybe she couldn't explain why she felt so apprehensive towards the tree but it didn't come out of nowhere.

What I am focusing on in his statement that I think parallels what I'm trying to get is when people say "details" as a buzzword for sensing and "big picture" as a buzzword for intuition is there really no such thing as a detail or the big picture. It's just a matter of what you choose to focus on, what you choose to see, what you choose to notice. Everything that you needed to see and notice was there all along, nothing less nothing more just what are you concentrating on.

Okay, I gotcha. Makes total sense. I agree, it’s a good idea to clarify exactly why a scene seems to demonstrate either intuition or sensing. I agree that ‘details’ and ‘big picture’ are buzzwords that are overused to the point of obscurity. Both ends of the S/N spectrum notice the same amount of details, it’s just the nature of the details that vary.

Now it’s really sticking in my craw that I can’t figure out how to articulate why I think the first example demonstrates intuition, because it seems like such a good illustration of intuition to me. But I can't find any pertinent clips of scenes anyway, just the trailer, so oh well.

 

[KDude]

This may be slightly off the point, but what is this? Sensing.. Intuition? Sometimes I get impressions of things (I'm a musician as well, and I pick up on motifs with objects and people.. but not nearly as cool as the scene below). I could see the same sort of thing play out with an ISFP artist honing in on some part of a person's character and painting a portrait, or an interior designer advising someone what would fit their style.. A lot of everyday stuff actually. An stereotypical ESTP conman who sees an easy mark by drawing various associations in the person's manner. They couldn't all be N, right?

Anyways, I'm trying to provide proteanmix a less action-oriented scene that illustrates a sensor being detailed, "connecting-the-dots", and making associations, but I'm kind of at a loss.

[youtube=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Sv4r8PPTPQ].[/youtube]

 

[IZthe411]

This may be slightly off the point, but what is this? Sensing.. Intuition? Sometimes I get impressions of things (I'm a musician as well, and I pick up on motifs with objects and people.. but not nearly as cool as the scene below). I could see the same sort of thing play out with an ISFP artist honing in on some part of a person's character and painting a portrait, or an interior designer advising someone what would fit their style.. A lot of everyday stuff actually. An stereotypical ESTP conman who sees an easy mark by drawing various associations in the person's manner. They couldn't all be N, right?

Anyways, I'm trying to provide proteanmix a less action-oriented scene that illustrates a sensor being detailed, "connecting-the-dots", and making associations, but I'm kind of at a loss.

[youtube=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Sv4r8PPTPQ].[/youtube]

That can be S or N, IMO. The people's faces and actions could take him back to things he's seen before (sensing) or it could be a quick intuitive estimate.

 

[Quinlan]

Another one I can think of is a scene from the most recent Harry Potter movie where Hermoine says, "Actually I'm highly logical which allows me to look past extraneous detail and perceive clearly that which others overlook." Hermoine is usually typed as an SJ which makes this statement a typological oxymoron.

Maybe she's an ESTJ asserting her belief that Te is superior to Si?

Like something an ESTJ might say to an IS_J "I can look past Si blah blah blah to see the truth (Te).

 

[KDude]

ESTJs do override Si, but I'm not sure if it works like that or not. A Si dom isn't necessarily hung up on details so much as some familiarity or consistency. I remember reading about one anecdote of an ISTJ making their rounds to work and dropping coins into the jar of the same homeless guy every day. While an ESTJ may do it to a point, and then finally flip and tell the guy to get a job. The ISTJ might override the temptation. Both see a "truth" to things though.

I'm derailing now though.

 

[sculpting]

What I am focusing on in his statement that I think parallels what I'm trying to get is when people say "details" as a buzzword for sensing and "big picture" as a buzzword for intuition is there really no such thing as a detail or the big picture. It's just a matter of what you choose to focus on, what you choose to see, what you choose to notice. Everything that you needed to see and notice was there all along, nothing less nothing more just what are you concentrating on.

So I think it is pretty well understood in cognitive studies, the role that attentional selection has upon what data you gather from your surroundings and how much of that is observed consciously vs uncosnciously. If I get to make stuff up I would say I miss 90% of the details of my surroundings because I am so busy looking inside of my head at what my surroundings could be....

NLP also uses the terms "chunk-up" or "chunk-down" as ways to approach a topic from the details to the big picture, however the way they use the term entangles Te and Ti I would guess as well.

I cant think of fictional characters in isolation....but for certain MBTI types, I noted that the main character in the "elegance of the hedgehog" book was amazingly NiFeTi and it was so fascinating to step through her mind and see things she noted that I would never observe about my world. There was so much detail and precision, but grace and appreciation for specificity. It was actually depressing as I saw myself in some of the people around her that she disdained as crude and vulgar.

Also to read poetry by Charles Bukowski-an ISFP?-is so incredibly Se heavy from my perspective. It is stunning different from what I would see.

Reading books by CH Cherryh makes me have a better understanding of how Fe plays a role in the minds of ENTPs, and again very different ideas.

Books by Ayn Rand are always interesting as well as they stress the INTJ thought process, especially the Ni visions and context-shift-spins but sprinkled throughout the story I note Se refs here and there-for instance in one scene the INTJs are a at a dinner party and one says "Do you ever get the feeling they will never exeprience and enjoy this particular moment to the degree that we do? That they cant ever appreciate the sheer beauty of the surroundings and taste of the champagn on their tongues as they are too busy never seeing reality?" (or something like that....)