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ESTP vs ENTP - the value system

nanook

a scream in a vortex
Joined
Jul 22, 2007
Messages
1,361
in my childhood i had this extp friend, Chris.

he had a high metabolism, lean but strong body and a rather big one eyed snake wrapped in expensive underwear. yes, he would show it off, both of it.

he would get everything he wanted, pussy and authority. without having to fight for it. eventually someone like me had to challenge this routine, but that is a different story.

shame, jealousy, or any feeling of intimidation were unknown to him. loyalty as well, meaning he got the pussy without the relationship.

when he saw nuns or Amish people, he had feelings of disgust. how could someone live like that? how could someone not want to "integrate" properly with society. of course, referring to nuns, by "to integrate" he would mean as much as: show some ass.

this was a projection of his egocentric value system. "if someone is not a extp, he is not an authentic human being, deserves no respect and is useless anyway. at best he is cute." but projection of egocentric values is normal, that's not the topic here. the values are.

how are the values of intuitives and sensory extp different from each other? are they?

let's focus on early values, because they are more or less common to everyone that would participate in the thread. that's why i gave an early example. you cant compare values of different stages.

but feel free to add your own examples.

don't all young extp want the same? party, power, sex? the good clothing label, the newest skateboard?

if the intuitives were more iconoclastic - would that mean, they hate nuns and Amish even more, because nuns and Amish pray to icons, or would that mean, that they hate them less, because they would be aware, that sex and party are icons as well, and so life, that is dancing around different icons, is essentially still the same life?
 

Blackmail!

Gotta catch you all!
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don't all young extp want the same? party, power, sex? the good clothing label, the newest skateboard?

The answer is no. You forgot knowledge for its own sake.

I fear you're deeply mistaken.
 

nanook

a scream in a vortex
Joined
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Messages
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what knowledge is there, in the teen world?

surely an average enneagram seven is not all that interested into school matter.
and computers are boring, unless you are in a scene where you can throw parties around computers, ie parties financed by pirate/hacker activities.

that stuff did not even exist in the early nineties. no hover boards either.

so, what's left?

do entp go for knowledge about other peoples penis size?
'cause he sure tryed to pull down my pants more than once.
 

Blackmail!

Gotta catch you all!
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Again, I'd say you're deeply biased and mistaken.

You're talking much more about YOU than about reals ExTPs, are you aware of it?
I don't know what your "friend" did to you to make you so angry against him, but frankly, I don't bother. There are other places to chase ghosts.
 

nanook

a scream in a vortex
Joined
Jul 22, 2007
Messages
1,361
now, don't be all emotional and sensitive. (read: manipulative)

i have actually been asking an open question. and an interesting one. and a question that is hard to answer. so yeah, its easier to not take it serious.

the question is not even suggestive. the example is a little suggestive put it is in it self a question. if you want to propose that the example is unrealistic for the both of extp, than make your point and have fun. not, that i will believe it for a second.
 

nanook

a scream in a vortex
Joined
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Messages
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so, how is that value of knowledge, that you mention, displayed in entp, who are not yet on a rational stage of developement, or do not have access to rational means, like books or computers? what was the difference between young entp and young estp in the middle ages, i an agrarian culture, on the country?
 

Gamine

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Nanook, your question is definitely on the silly side of the crazy fence. Everyone has separate values. And everyone will find values that mesh. It's like a giant crazy venn diagram of dynamic confusion.

Blackmail is not being manipulative. And on that point, everyone has moments of manipulation, ENTP's are just gutsy enough to own up to it. Have you bothered to ask this close friend of yours what makes him tick?
 

nanook

a scream in a vortex
Joined
Jul 22, 2007
Messages
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Nanook, your question is definitely on the silly side of the crazy fence

i usually adapt, to the people i talk to. this thread is all entp style.

you cannot answer my questions, right?
 

nanook

a scream in a vortex
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so, its entp style to make fun of others, but not entp style to laugh about one self? i have overestimated you. i am deeply sorry.
 

Gamine

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so, its entp style to make fun of others, but not entp style to laugh about one self? i have overestimated you. i am deeply sorry.

ENTP style is also to be very blunt and honest during the 10% of communication that is not entertaining creative Ne bullshit ;)
 

nanook

a scream in a vortex
Joined
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Messages
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thank you for taking my question seriously, TwinkleToes.

this thread should actually be of interest of those, who will author it, meaning estp and entp. i don't think you people know already a lot about how you relate to each other, in the value area. because i don't know very well how i compare to my respective sensor neighbors (isfx), either. or why. because values are a difficult and broad topic.

i am not in the position to validate your brainstorming.
 

Costrin

rawr
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so, its entp style to make fun of others, but not entp style to laugh about one self? i have overestimated you. i am deeply sorry.

I'll just say that your view of what ENTP style is so majorly off that it'd be useless to try and explain anything.

imo.
 

nanook

a scream in a vortex
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I'll just say that your view of what ENTP style is so majorly off that it'd be useless to try and explain anything.

imo.

you dont know my view on what is entp style, you simply know my statement about how the thread is entp style, that cant be taken literally in any absolute way, because i am obviously not referring to all aspects of it. yet you just judge your interpretation ...
 

Costrin

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you dont know my view on what is entp style, you simply know my statement about how the thread is entp style, that cant be taken literally in any absolute way, because i am obviously not referring to all aspects of it.

Let me rephrase then. It seems to me that your phrasing seems to be a highly inefficient way of communicating with ENTPs in order to get the information that you declared as desired.

But I don't wanna derail your thread too much. So apologies for that.
 

nanook

a scream in a vortex
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Messages
1,361
Let me rephrase then. It seems to me that your phrasing seems to be a highly inefficient way of communicating with ENTPs in order to get the information that you declared as desired.

granted.

But I don't wanna derail your thread too much. So apologies for that.

thank you :)

this thread is not about "explaining" things to me, btw.

it's your occasion to find something out about you, by extp teamwork.
if you are interested.

not, that i am not interested in what you achive. to the contrary, i want to watch you in action!

i am just generally not interested in one on one communication alla "you explain me something".
i interpret what i observe, when ever i want to observe something.
 

Gamine

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I also value fibre. Thoughts Costrin?
 

entropie

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in my childhood i had this extp friend, Chris.

he had a high metabolism, lean but strong body and a rather big one eyed snake wrapped in expensive underwear. yes, he would show it off, both of it.

he would get everything he wanted, pussy and authority. without having to fight for it. eventually someone like me had to challenge this routine, but that is a different story.

shame, jealousy, or any feeling of intimidation were unknown to him. loyalty as well, meaning he got the pussy without the relationship.

when he saw nuns or Amish people, he had feelings of disgust. how could someone live like that? how could someone not want to "integrate" properly with society. of course, referring to nuns, by "to integrate" he would mean as much as: show some ass.

this was a projection of his egocentric value system. "if someone is not a extp, he is not an authentic human being, deserves no respect and is useless anyway. at best he is cute." but projection of egocentric values is normal, that's not the topic here. the values are.

how are the values of intuitives and sensory extp different from each other? are they?

let's focus on early values, because they are more or less common to everyone that would participate in the thread. that's why i gave an early example. you cant compare values of different stages.

but feel free to add your own examples.

don't all young extp want the same? party, power, sex? the good clothing label, the newest skateboard?

if the intuitives were more iconoclastic - would that mean, they hate nuns and Amish even more, because nuns and Amish pray to icons, or would that mean, that they hate them less, because they would be aware, that sex and party are icons as well, and so life, that is dancing around different icons, is essentially still the same life?


Ich glaube nicht, dass das mit Type zu tun hat, das geht eher darum, dass du selbst für dich Selbstvertrauen entwickelst. Aber ich bin fest davon überzeugt dass es dafür zu spät ist. Von daher wirst du allen Frauen denen du jemals begenest auf ewig als der traurige Ritter, den alle mochten aber keiner verstand in Erinnerung bleiben.

Das ist nicht boshaft gemeint, denn Stärke hast du genug. Es weiß nur keine Sau warum du sie nicht endlich zeigst !!
 

entropie

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Egal was gegenwärtig existiert, egal was gegenwärtig geschieht, es gibt immer nur genau Einen der es beeinflussen kann.

[YOUTUBE="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fuX7lHEU7-Y"]The One[/YOUTUBE]
 
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