Typing women as F and men as T?

[527468]

I am actually, how did you pick that up from my post? lol

I was thrilled to find out she was an ESTP, honestly. It was good to know that at least one of my siblings is not going to be all wishy washy with me when I want a direct answer.

Simply put, it's a rarity. A female T has to be celebrated.

I can tell when a women is a T, ok so normally they will seem somewhat F (at least more than a T man) because they are women, but when you get to know them even a little, it is totally obvious.
As far as men go, well, I think F men that can at all help it, in our society try to hide at least some of the F in them. So it can be hard to tell, but same goes for them, if you just get to know them a bit, it gets obvious too.

I am so F! and I hate that sometimes, cause then people think I am a sterotypical emotional women etc, etc, which I'm totally not! I have a lot of "masculine" type traits about me, it's just the way I am.. but they see F, and they're just like,
so typical tsk tsk...
People can be so ignorant.. because of stereotypes...

I seriously know a strong F preference female who acts masculine and she knows she does, but generally around guys. She's critical around them. Surprisingly enough she is an ISFJ.

 

[garbage]

She's critical around them. Surprisingly enough she is an ISFJ.

Well.. not too surprising

 

[ptgatsby]

I'd say any married 30-year-old woman with a college degree or less is probably an F. The numbers prove it.

About 70% of females test F. Fs are only slightly more likely to get married, IRC. Ts are slightly more likely to get a degree. Either way, it'll work out to about 70%. The additional information decreases your estimation by including unassociated information.

I also assume women are Fs, or more correctly, since I don't agree with the binary distribution, are shifted towards F sub-traits (in unequal proportion). You work with the information you have, and adjust it with new information. Hard to do that when the world is black/white F/T, though.

 

[Mitzy]

Fs are only slightly more likely to get married, IRC. Ts are slightly more likely to get a degree. .

haha i wont do either.
anyway, i assume women are F's too. hey, the numbers are there. majority are F's unless i witness otherwise. then again, i assume most men are F's too. especially when they get shocked & cant handle my demeanor.

 

[BerberElla]

Actually F v T isnt going to affect wishy washiness. Go talk to an ESFJ you want to find out.

I find ESFJ's still have a degree of not wanting to offend though. Sometimes they say something that is blunt, but compared to my sister it is still way off.

If I ask my ESFJ friend if I look fat for instance, I know she will not be honest, she may be more honest than my INFP friend, but nowhere near as honest as the ESTP sister.

ESTP sister doesn't care about social rules.

ESFJ friend does care about them.

 

[ZiL]

I don't find female Ts too difficult to point out as long as I am able to be around them a bit. But maybe that's because I am one. There are some female T's who are very direct to the point of bluntness (but I've met Fs this way too, just in a different manner...), and there are others who seem extremely inviting and friendly, but there is a difference in the "vibe" of how this friendliness is expressed. I probably seem pretty genial to people and I'm more tactful than blunt, but there's a limit on that. I can't do hugging displays. I can't give people advice without becoming a problem-solver (i.e. I can't say "Oh honey, I understand, consoling words consoling words." - I start to sound disingenous). I find it difficult to talk about my "values" in a lot of situations. If you were to put it in terms of functions - I have pretty high Fe, but not THAT high, and my Fi-ness is pretty low. However at first glance I could see someone thinking I'm an F. But that's just because I like to be friendly to draw people in and get to know them, and because I don't like provoking backlash through bluntness because I don't like giving reasons for people get emotional.

The friendliness and tactfulness might look F, but I personally use this like a barrier to keep me AWAY from excessive negative emotion (coming from myself or other people).

So yeah, you sort of have to spend time with a person and not take the few "obvious" cues (like bluntness or tact, for example) as a direct indication of F or T. Their reason for acting this way may not always be the most obvious one.

 

[Giggly]

SJ here... announcing that everybody is happy happy assuming that most females are F's and most males are T's so lets just keep doing that, alright?

Carry on.

 

[ptgatsby]

haha i wont do either.
anyway, i assume women are F's too. hey, the numbers are there. majority are F's unless i witness otherwise. then again, i assume most men are F's too. especially when they get shocked & cant handle my demeanor.

Heh, I think it's safe to say that any T can say that most people are more F than them That is normally what people mean, really. Which is funny, because I'm less T than most males Somewhere around the 40-50% of the population.

 

[527468]

Well.. not too surprising

Aha. Never too surprising when it comes to the SJ.

 

[Laurie]

"college degree or less"

What is more?

 

[pippi]

Heh, I think it's safe to say that any T can say that most people are more F than them That is normally what people mean, really. Which is funny, because I'm less T than most males Somewhere around the 40-50% of the population.

This comes into play when typing, you compare others to yourself. So if you are a strong T you think everyone else is an F. Especially if they try to hug you, ick.

 

[Synarch]

This comes into play when typing, you compare others to yourself. So if you are a strong T you think everyone else is an F. Especially if they try to hug you, ick.

I am pretty huggy with my friends and family. But, maybe this is because I am Italian or something. Or, a closet homo.

 

[Kasper]

Anyway has anyone ever found that they are quicker to roughly type a female as an F, or is it just me?

Nope. If I meet a woman who can handle or even enjoy my bluntness and I find myself not having to censor what I say too much I’d guess they were a T, if I struggle with that, I’ll assume F. I don’t guess one way or the other without reason. No point making baseless assumptions.

 

[pkr289]

Hmm... I don't think I have any bias when typing people, although it could be subconscious. I can't really think of many women I know that I would consider T's, but I can think of plenty of guys that are F's.

 

[Simplexity]

I actually was just thinking about this the other day with one of my friends. It really was uncanny how many value driven statements he made. Like "he's just a good guy, I feel bad arguing with him, He's a guy you don't really want to do that with" when discussing a principal we used to always get into arguments with. I think the biggest thing is how evident those value's are and how frequent they come into play in conversations. There's been many a time I had to annoyingly curb my analysis because it broached on a topic he felt strongly about. Guys have a tendency to deny this and also elevate their "logical, objective" proficiency but with a certain amount of time it's evident.

I think the mode of communication when talking to girls and talking about them is pretty clear at times too. I know plenty of times we'll be talking about the same thing with him, me, and my ISTJ friend and be on two different parallels. The bluntness in my ISTJ friend is very pronounced as well. A lot less tact and cushioning. Much different vibe as well.

 

[01011010]

Yeah this is a huge problem when typing.... as I tend to do the same

But just to add even more complexity to the situation, get this: I had orignally typed my gay INTJ friend as like ENFP or INFP, because he's pretty chatty and has tons of friends (mostly women). So I also think there's a tendancy to type male homosexuals as F, and perhaps female homosexuals as T

Even if a lesbian looks masculine, don't automatically consider her a T. Just acting manly isn't an indication of cognitive processes. This is my quote from another thread. The data was pulled from a personal sample size of 50, and the general lesbian culture.

Lesbians generally have a predictable mode of operation. Meet, fall in love, move in together. I've seen women merge in two weeks to a month. Not just a few couples. Practically every lesbian I have ever known (Except an ENTP and fellow INTJ). It's the most unnerving ritual I've ever witnessed. The 2nd date u-haul and turkey baster jokes exist for a reason.

The aforementioned insanity, leads me to believe most lesbians are F.

 

[dee]

Simply put, it's a rarity. A female T has to be celebrated.

lemons, I don't think that's true, maybe you are just not looking in the right places??
I work in a hi-tech company, and let me tell you, there are plenty of women who work here, and MOST are Ts!!!....(In the techie department of course )

I'm totally serious.

 

[Jwill]

Well, I read a quote somewhere that only a quarter of INTJs are female. So, I'm in the minority there.

As far as F vs T for males/females, I think that sometimes people misunderstand what F means. I think my brother's an F, but he's not sitting there crying all the time during sappy movies. He's more likely to get angry or frustrated or annoyed than I am. He's maybe a little more sympathetic, too. Me, I'm flat-lined. I had him take the test once, and he was an NF. Recently, I had him just choose between the different letters, and he vehemently said he was an NT. He doesn't think he's emotional, but he categorizes emotion as weeping or being completely irrational.

 

[01011010]

Well, I read a quote somewhere that only a quarter of INTJs are female. So, I'm in the minority there.

As far as F vs T for males/females, I think that sometimes people misunderstand what F means. I think my brother's an F, but he's not sitting there crying all the time during sappy movies. He's more likely to get angry or frustrated or annoyed than I am. He's maybe a little more sympathetic, too. Me, I'm flat-lined. I had him take the test once, and he was an NF. Recently, I had him just choose between the different letters, and he vehemently said he was an NT. He doesn't think he's emotional, but he categorizes emotion as weeping or being completely irrational.

Fe can be objective and directional. It's mostly goal driven. Fi is inner value and judgment. Neither neccessarily means emotion in the sense that most people perceive it.

 

[Siúil a Rúin]

Separating the male/female cultural overlay on top of the MBTI categories is not necessarily simple or obvious.
There is some cultural difference in male and female style of communication. I did some reading on it a while back, but am at a loss as to the specific references at the moment. If I have time I'll try to figure it out.

Basically, male communication is more direct, with fewer adjectives and qualifiers, and more decisive. There are a number of aspects of this that correlate to what is understood to be T. Much of the professional world requires a compartmentalizing of reason vs. emotion, objectivity vs. personal experience, etc. To function successfully in the professional world, this male oriented style of communication needs to be adopted to be perceived as intelligent and competent. Women who succeed in having their minds and skills taken seriously often learn to adapt to these expectations. Many are required to overcompensate in order to be seen as a peer, often coming across as colder and less personal than their male counterparts. These women would also be typed as "T". Does this mean that women who maintain a softer, more "feminine" style of communication are F's by default? That they are less prone to preferring logic? Or that men who maintain a professional demeanor and clear communication who are motivated primarily by the approval of others are T?

My position is that type theory is based on cognitive processing which can influence communication style, but is not defined by the way in which one interfaces with the world. This is because that external interface is the part that is most influenced by experience and culture. This is also because there can be several different motivations and reasoning styles to produce the same behaviors. I'll give one example: A person takes an aggressive stance on the phone to clear up a mistake on a bill. This person could feel angry and threatened by the mistake and operates on the assumption that conflicts are worked out by expressing everything you feel and just getting it all out there by getting the other person to feel equally threatened and therefore produce some empathy. Another person might see the aggressive stance as the most likely behavior to produce the desired result and might even do a little acting to play the role most effectively, but would be just as willing to take another approach if deemed more effective. It is the reasoning behind the actions that is the cognitive processing.