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View Poll Results: Sx-firsts, what are the dominant instincts of your parent(s)?

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  • Sx-first (both parents)

    1 2.38%
  • So-first (both parents)

    2 4.76%
  • Sp-first (both parents)

    15 35.71%
  • Sx-first + So-first

    4 9.52%
  • Sx-first + Sp-first

    5 11.90%
  • So-first + Sp-first

    15 35.71%
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  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Z Buck McFate View Post
    I remember posting that. I'm pretty sure it was in an exchange with @Southern Kross, but it wasn't in the thread I posted above. It's in another one. One which we'll never find, since I'm not very good at the internet either. But I do remember it.



    Yes, I think is a darn good recap of what I said (some of it probably better than the way I said it- Santa's elves, moonlight, snug in bed, it's all true).


    ***


    I feel compelled to point out use of the term "damaged" to describe what happens was Fauvre's, not mine. I actually like Helen Palmer's description more, but I'm not sure it's okay to post here (since it's from her book, ownership rights and all).

    No matter how hard we tried neither one of us could ever pass internet school but I swear, IJs are the Pe doms of the forums. Yes, I went and got coffee and stuff but I was very much still attempting to edit the hell out of my post while you just full-rainbowed out this message.

    *If* you have any theories on how sx doms become sx doms that are different I'd really like to hear them.

    As for "damaged"...yah I knew that merely because I know you wouldn't frame anything in that light.

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by star tripper View Post
    I know this wasn't directed at me, but a lot of it echoes my thoughts on the matter.



    I have speculated this about both my being ENTP and my being sp-last on a different website (I think PerC). My mom is an ISFJ and sp-dom + my dad didn't like the idea of my having to deal with sp matters since he was an sp-last dealing with them and was miserable. Consequently, I never felt Si, Fe, or spness were any sort of pressing matter and left 'em on the backburner. I even distinctly recall frequently thinking to myself, "Oh, my mom's got this. I'll do something else."



    I can think of some reasons though I don't necessarily believe sx is more rare either honestly.
    - sx more frequently than sp and so leads to self-destructive behavior. Think Darwinian.
    - sx has to be less frequent than sp and so because the world needs more sp and so and has less of a need of sx.
    - sx has to be less frequent than sp and so because too much sx could have a worse result (the likes of which I haven't envisioned yet).

    Again, I haven't seriously considered any of these arguments (just thought of them as I read your question), but I think they might explain why people think sx is rare by comparison.



    I think there's a huge misunderstanding of what the sx instinct is because people often equate it with "one-on-one" and "intimacy" and "searching for a mate" which literally anyone, sx or not, could relate to. I remember some people describing sx as having obsessions and people were like, "Well, I have obsessions! Does that make me sx-dom?" Those buzz words, imo, don't get to the heart of sx.



    I agree with this 100%. Puts what I was trying to say more succinctly.

    I like you star tripper. Similar name, similar type...And I've truly enjoyed your posts.

    whoops, I should explain that that wasn't my official response to this post. Just catching you online.
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  3. #13
    MyPeeSmellsLikeCoffee247 five sounds's Avatar
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    I'm not sure of my parents' instinctual variants, but I related to the OP in that sp and so things were valued highly and enforced as 'better' or 'wise' by my parents. I felt frustrated and misunderstood from a young age. Neither of my siblings are sx-first either. I always enjoy your threads of this nature @small.wonder. Interested to read this conversation.
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  4. #14
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by small.wonder View Post
    Anyone relate to my experience? If so, chime in! If not, what do you think caused your preference of Sx?
    I tend to view like any other preference: innate.
    The intensity of it might be driven by the absence of it in our childhood, however.
    When you don't get what you personally need from your parents, it's a form of deprivation that lingers and impacts your view of the world.

    I'm also curious about the parental types of Sx-first people-- check out the poll to participate. Thanks!
    My parents were probably so/[notsure] + sp/so.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft
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  5. #15
    So she did. small.wonder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    I tend to view like any other preference: innate.
    The intensity of it might be driven by the absence of it in our childhood, however.
    When you don't get what you personally need from your parents, it's a form of deprivation that lingers and impacts your view of the world.

    My parents were probably so/[notsure] + sp/so.
    I do think all things are somewhat inate, but do account for Nurture as well.

    Yes, I think it's telling that 7/9 in the poll so far report non Sx-first parents. I do think it's possible to still end up Sx-first with one Sx-first parent, as long as the other parent plays a large role (in order to withold, or prioritize the other instincts in the family culture).

    I also agree with some of what has been said by others, in that this applies to the way all instinctual stackings form. A Sp-first is deprived of that, a So-first is deprived of that (and thus, their parent[s] probably prioritized other instincts first).

    It does make me wonder if there is a way (knowing this stuff) to parent a child acknowledging all three areas? Clearly they will still have an order of preference, but perhaps less extreme if all three areas are acknowledged intentionally.
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  6. #16
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    Now that I'm considering it, I think being a good parent means having an awareness of who YOU are... and having an awareness of who your CHILDREN are. I think we hopefully gain some self- and other-awareness as we age, but some people seem to struggle with that.

    I feel like both of my parents were really caught up in their own worlds and viewpoint without really understanding that there were other ways to view the world and other sets of needs that maybe did not align with their own. My mother was worlds better -- but it mostly amounted to wanting her children to be happy and not wanting them to be sad. I remember having these thoughts even when I was still a child... that my parents were lost in their own problems and had no real understanding of what I needed, wanted, hoped for, was hurt by, etc. I know my mom would have given it to me if she could, but she just had trouble understanding. My father was very self-absorbed and overbearing, meanwhile, and felt like everyone should be like him.

    ... which triggers memories of discussion about the various enneagram types, and how they position themselves to their parents. I can't seem to find any tables or such now, but it's essentially Object Relations, and how various types might be generated by their positioning towards the parental figures (attached, ambivalent, etc.)

    In any case, if I think about my kids, one of them seems to have traits of all three variants, another is so/sx probably, and the other is very strong SP so much I don't even know what the secondary is. But I had to recognize what their tendencies were and find ways to engage them and give them what they needed so that THEY could be happy... and the secondary thing was to at least give them a taste of who I was, so that maybe along with their needs being met I could stretch them a bit and enjoy our relationship from my end. The hardest was with my SP kid, because I build connection through "information/secret sharing" and she was just so very adverse to sharing anything or asking anything for the longest time. But at this point I have open lines of communication among all three and they know they can talk to me and have opened up from their end. But again, I have different expectations (and tailor who I am a bit) for each. These tendencies seem to be in place earlier in life, not later.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft
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  7. #17
    blackbird, fly Julius_Van_Der_Beak's Avatar
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    Both of my parents are SP, probably. I know that none of them are SO.

    I know I've always felt like an outsider, and I think this has something to do with the SX orientation. It would not surprise me if most of the people with this orientation felt like perpetual outsiders.
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  8. #18
    Away with the fairies Southern Kross's Avatar
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    @Starry @Z Buck McFate

    Did you mean this thread?
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  9. #19
    Fe this! Z Buck McFate's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Southern Kross View Post
    Thanks for that, it's not the one though. (The one you linked is the same thread I linked in my earlier post. I appreciate your looking for it though.)

    It's possible the conversation wasn't with you (and that I'm conflating the one we linked with the other thread), but there was a more in-depth convo about it somewhere. I'm pretty sure it was you, and you'd included an example of what happened when your family went out to dinner one night, and I mentioned my mother as an example-- but there's a good chance it was a tangent in a thread that wasn't even originally about variant instincts.


    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    ... which triggers memories of discussion about the various enneagram types, and how they position themselves to their parents. I can't seem to find any tables or such now, but it's essentially Object Relations, and how various types might be generated by their positioning towards the parental figures (attached, ambivalent, etc.)
    Is this what you're talking about? (I remember this coming up in past discussions here a few times- though I'm super bad at finding threads, so I'm linking the source instead of the past discussions.)


    eta: Here's at least one of the past discussions.
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  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Z Buck McFate View Post
    Is this what you're talking about? (I remember this coming up in past discussions here a few times- though I'm super bad at finding threads, so I'm linking the source instead of the past discussions.)
    That wasn't specifically what I was thinking of (I've never read that page before), but it was that kind of thing, yes, so it's worthwhile to look through that...
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

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