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Multiple Enneagram Subtypes/Instincts Using your last instinct

Gerbah

New member
Joined
Oct 6, 2009
Messages
433
MBTI Type
ISTJ
Enneagram
5w4
How do you manage when you want or try to use your last instinct? Can you develop it significantly even when it doesn't feel very natural? I am sx-first and soc-last, and recently I have been conciously trying to use soc more but it doesn't feel that good... When I meet people I am naturally more sensitive to and interested in that unspoken potential to go deeper into another person, or if they are somehow very interesting but I don't yet know why, and when I try to just engage lightly and widely, it's ok, at times it even goes quite well... but a lot of the time I don't feel as confident and like I know what I'm really doing, and I have more doubts running through my head, and I don't actually feel that genuinely engaged even if I want to be. How do others relate to this (whatever your last instinct)?
 

Kasper

Diabolical
Joined
May 30, 2008
Messages
11,590
MBTI Type
ENTP
Enneagram
9w8
Instinctual Variant
so/sx
I'm hella uncomfortable with sx (last instinct), both in myself and others, although I do admire the traits it can bring. I would like to be able to be less sp (first function), or at least overcome the negative aspects of sp-ness, but I don't think I could be comfortable developing sx traits. My time would be better spent on stopping myself from indulging in negative sp traits and maybe developing better so traits.
 

mrcockburn

Aquaria
Joined
Jan 3, 2010
Messages
1,896
MBTI Type
¥¤
Enneagram
3w4
Instinctual Variant
sp/so
I'm actually sx-last and soc-first. I'm your complete opposite! ;)

I suppose that I become deep and severe, when I listen to good music. For instance, speeding in my truck blasting Motley Crue, I'll sing/shout along and have a great time with myself. That seems "sx-ish" to me. Intense, in-the-moment.
 

Amargith

Hotel California
Joined
Nov 5, 2008
Messages
14,717
MBTI Type
ENFP
Enneagram
4dw
Instinctual Variant
sx/so
Trinity..I'm your opposite :D

I hate using SP..it also stresses the life out of me that I have to. I've been actively trying to get a handle on it for a while now, by actually finding a job I love and being able to take care of myself. Not that it's working *sigh*

I *love* connecting deeply with others, and easily do it, and get lost in it..lose hours like that and would keep doing so if only...I didn't have to f*cking survive as well (read, eat, drink, sleep, make money). I can do the social scene when I have to, to wing stuff, and manoevre myself around society, but taking care of myself...sigh. And somehow I've always been lucky that others who are better at this helped me out. Those that I bond deeply with, tend to be SP-doms or aux. And they rule at this stuff.

So in essence, I survive through my first instinct, through sx. ( I do work, just don't have an entire career plan worked out and change jobs often and easily due to boredom and plain disinterest etc). I'm working on changing that coz I do think I shoul dbe able to take care of myself. I just royally suck at it.
 

Gerbah

New member
Joined
Oct 6, 2009
Messages
433
MBTI Type
ISTJ
Enneagram
5w4
Since you're all my opposites I can learn from you guys :D

I don't think I could be comfortable developing sx traits. My time would be better spent on stopping myself from indulging in negative sp traits and maybe developing better so traits.

I'm not comfortable either developing my soc traits, it's just that recently I've been feeling a bigger need for it. For a long time I was fine with my sx-based relationships and saw soc-related things as more superficial and not something I really needed to be secure and happy, but now I'm different, circumstances are different, and I see the soc-instinct differently, and myself differently and less individually than I used to. And there are certain valuable goals and aims that can't be achieved without soc-involvement.

I suppose that I become deep and severe, when I listen to good music. For instance, speeding in my truck blasting Motley Crue, I'll sing/shout along and have a great time with myself. That seems "sx-ish" to me. Intense, in-the-moment.

Yeah, I know what you mean. I love getting lost in something and can do it easily, but similarly to what I said above to Kasper, I'm just feeling more dissatisfied these days with that kind of thing, although it's natural for me. I feel the isolated side of it more now and would like to spend my energy more on cooperative ventures.

Trinity..I'm your opposite :D

I hate using SP..it also stresses the life out of me that I have to. I've been actively trying to get a handle on it for a while now, by actually finding a job I love and being able to take care of myself. Not that it's working *sigh*

I *love* connecting deeply with others, and easily do it, and get lost in it..lose hours like that and would keep doing so if only...I didn't have to f*cking survive as well (read, eat, drink, sleep, make money). I can do the social scene when I have to, to wing stuff, and manoevre myself around society, but taking care of myself...sigh. And somehow I've always been lucky that others who are better at this helped me out. Those that I bond deeply with, tend to be SP-doms or aux. And they rule at this stuff.

So in essence, I survive through my first instinct, through sx. ( I do work, just don't have an entire career plan worked out and change jobs often and easily due to boredom and plain disinterest etc). I'm working on changing that coz I do think I shoul dbe able to take care of myself. I just royally suck at it.

That's interesting, it's pretty natural for me to take care of myself but I can imagine that yes, it must be stressful to find that side of things difficult. You can hardly enjoy other things if you are too stressed out about yourself.

I am also trying to change the status of my last instinct because it is also stressing me out. I don't know if I'll ever master it though. When I try to be "social" the vibe I get with some people is that I make them uncomfortable, or I get bored quickly and can't generate a natural engagement, which I'm sure they feel from me, though I keep talking and trying to find something that will make things click. *sigh* Or maybe I shouldn't be searching for a "click" at all? I don't know really... Most of the time I know immediately if it's going to "work" with someone else, and if I feel it won't, there's no point trying at all. But I am trying now to make it "work" in other ways.
 

hilo

New member
Joined
Mar 8, 2010
Messages
186
MBTI Type
INTP
Enneagram
9 sx
I am only vaguely aware of how one uses Sp. (I'm Sx/so/sp). I can totally get SX, it's what makes me seem to flip a switch in my personality, from cold/aloof/logical (when I don't notice you) to warm/caring/empathetic if I want to get to know you or you are a love one already.

I do sometimes feel a "danger, back away!" feeling if I start to get to know someone too fast - like if I meet some awesome guy and we start hanging out daily, that would kinda freak me out no matter how great I thought they were (but that could be a 9 avoiding commitments thing).

I've never thought of sp as meaning taking care of self physically, but in fact I can be quite bad at that unless I am sick/really upset in which case I will sometimes treat myself to some really nice food/long bath/favorite movie kind of treatment. That wasn't my first type of reaction tho, definitely learned. In my younger days I would have just become severe on myself and not ate anything/worked out very hard, etc.

Not sure if that is coherent.
 

JocktheMotie

Habitual Fi LineStepper
Joined
Nov 20, 2008
Messages
8,491
When I try to be "social" the vibe I get with some people is that I make them uncomfortable, or I get bored quickly and can't generate a natural engagement, which I'm sure they feel from me, though I keep talking and trying to find something that will make things click. *sigh* Or maybe I shouldn't be searching for a "click" at all? I don't know really... Most of the time I know immediately if it's going to "work" with someone else, and if I feel it won't, there's no point trying at all. But I am trying now to make it "work" in other ways.

Perfect description of what it feels like to be sx first, soc last. Said it far better than I could.

I'll try to expand later though, as I think it through. Good thread.
 

Old-Timey

New member
Joined
Jul 15, 2010
Messages
6
MBTI Type
INFJ
Enneagram
4w5
I'm sx/sp/so. In the past year, I found myself really needing to develop my 2nd and 3rd instincts, but the social instinct was baffling to me -- pretty much as Gerbah described above. What I found really helped me was to have a pretense, a shared interest, a conversation piece. With SX's, the other person, or the relationship itself, becomes the shared interest. Intimacy is its own center. With SO, I think, there must be some triangulation.

Anyway, I started organizing creative writers' meetups, which not only requires me to channel more energy to SO, but stirred up my SP too, in my duties as organizer and in the writing itself. I think I've got my instincts as balanced right now as they've ever been in my adult life.
 

CuriousFeeling

From the Undertow
Joined
Dec 18, 2009
Messages
2,937
MBTI Type
INfJ
Enneagram
4w5
Instinctual Variant
sp/sx
As an sx last person here, it takes a bit of effort to achieve the close connection I desire with people. I think it is a matter of gaining trust with the other person, and once I know they won't put me into harm's way, and that I can be emotionally upfront with them, I can be quite close with someone. Not easy getting past the sp barrier though. I find whenever I am in a close relationship with someone I trust, my sx instinct gets activated. Getting involved with listening to music or anything artistic for that matter tends to activate sx as well.
 

rav3n

.
Joined
Aug 6, 2010
Messages
11,655
My stacking is sx/sp/so and can be reactionary.

It starts with being open to intimacy. When threat appears, the wall slams down. So appears if sp feels no threat since so in my opinion, is a necessary add-on to sx. This doesn't mean that so only appears with sx. But within me, I think it does. Eureka moment!
 

hilo

New member
Joined
Mar 8, 2010
Messages
186
MBTI Type
INTP
Enneagram
9 sx
My stacking is sx/sp/so and can be reactionary.

It starts with being open to intimacy. When threat appears, the wall slams down. So appears if sp feels no threat since so in my opinion, is a necessary add-on to sx. This doesn't mean that so only appears with sx. But within me, I think it does. Eureka moment!

Interesting thought. I've often thought that the sx/so motivations would overlap more versus the sp which seems counter to both?
 

rav3n

.
Joined
Aug 6, 2010
Messages
11,655
Interesting thought. I've often thought that the sx/so motivations would overlap more versus the sp which seems counter to both?
I don't disagree that it's counterintuitive but that's what happens within me.

Sp acts like the guardian or counterbalance for sx until all is safe.
 

Amargith

Hotel California
Joined
Nov 5, 2008
Messages
14,717
MBTI Type
ENFP
Enneagram
4dw
Instinctual Variant
sx/so
I don't disagree that it's counterintuitive but that's what happens within me.

Sp acts like the guardian or counterbalance for sx until all is safe.

It's what makes an sx-sp very appealing and intriguing, imo ;)
 

Chloe

New member
Joined
May 1, 2009
Messages
2,196
how i practice using my SO last; I am trying to convince myself that it IS important to do my hair when I am going to the store, even though those people will never ever see me again or remember me.


:huh:
 

rav3n

.
Joined
Aug 6, 2010
Messages
11,655
It's what makes an sx-sp very appealing and intriguing, imo ;)
Flattering but from my side of the mirror, the combination hits a spectrum of confusing to annoying.

Life would be so much easier if stacking was so/sx/sp or sx/so/sp.

*sigh*
 

Gerbah

New member
Joined
Oct 6, 2009
Messages
433
MBTI Type
ISTJ
Enneagram
5w4
I am only vaguely aware of how one uses Sp. (I'm Sx/so/sp). I can totally get SX, it's what makes me seem to flip a switch in my personality, from cold/aloof/logical (when I don't notice you) to warm/caring/empathetic if I want to get to know you or you are a love one already.

I do sometimes feel a "danger, back away!" feeling if I start to get to know someone too fast - like if I meet some awesome guy and we start hanging out daily, that would kinda freak me out no matter how great I thought they were (but that could be a 9 avoiding commitments thing).

I've never thought of sp as meaning taking care of self physically, but in fact I can be quite bad at that unless I am sick/really upset in which case I will sometimes treat myself to some really nice food/long bath/favorite movie kind of treatment. That wasn't my first type of reaction tho, definitely learned. In my younger days I would have just become severe on myself and not ate anything/worked out very hard, etc.

Not sure if that is coherent.

Yes, I think I understood. I think it's normal and healthy to freak out when it's going too fast. I think the opposite would signal a problem. I wouldn't say it's to do with type.

I think part of sp is valuing your comfort. I know someone who I think is sp-first and he gets really stressed out in crowds or the bus whereas I'm not comfortable but I can tolerate it and still be in an ok mood. And he's happy in a certain special way when he's on his own sofa. And good food makes him really happy, stuff like that.
 

Gerbah

New member
Joined
Oct 6, 2009
Messages
433
MBTI Type
ISTJ
Enneagram
5w4
I'm sx/sp/so. In the past year, I found myself really needing to develop my 2nd and 3rd instincts, but the social instinct was baffling to me -- pretty much as Gerbah described above. What I found really helped me was to have a pretense, a shared interest, a conversation piece. With SX's, the other person, or the relationship itself, becomes the shared interest. Intimacy is its own center. With SO, I think, there must be some triangulation.

Anyway, I started organizing creative writers' meetups, which not only requires me to channel more energy to SO, but stirred up my SP too, in my duties as organizer and in the writing itself. I think I've got my instincts as balanced right now as they've ever been in my adult life.

I like how you put that. Yes, I think that is it. Things you share in common will of course play a big part in a more intimate relationship, but the primary thing with SXs is the other person and relationship itself. Just the "beingness" of it, if you see what I mean. Even when I haven't known the other person that well, if "it" is there, there is such a joy in just being with the other person and I'm so happy to see them and the specific activity at hand doesn't matter that much. It doesn't happen often though...

For an SX-first must there be a pretense though? That's what I find difficult. Sometimes what happens is there is plenty to talk about but I'm still very aware of a feeling of something just not sitting well somehow, and then I really hope the other person doesn't feel that too but then maybe they do. Perhaps I just worry too much about it. Things tend to go better soc-wise for me when I really don't care how or who the other person is or what they're thinking and am just easy-going, whatever. But I have to be very conscious about this to turn off the feelers for the deeper emotional undertones, what kind of potential I'm sensing, will it be satisfying for me, etc.
 

Gerbah

New member
Joined
Oct 6, 2009
Messages
433
MBTI Type
ISTJ
Enneagram
5w4
how i practice using my SO last; I am trying to convince myself that it IS important to do my hair when I am going to the store, even though those people will never ever see me again or remember me.


:huh:

Haha, yes, I understand. I'm not quite like that but I don't small talk with people at the store for example. And from what a friend said about it, who is either soc first or second, it's too business-like for her. She would chat with the employees and be friendly and get to know them and enjoy that there's no deepness to it. Real contact would be more scary. As sx-first I don't see the point in that, but I have been trying to do it more often as soc-practice.
 

Amargith

Hotel California
Joined
Nov 5, 2008
Messages
14,717
MBTI Type
ENFP
Enneagram
4dw
Instinctual Variant
sx/so
Flattering but from my side of the mirror, the combination hits a spectrum of confusing to annoying.

Life would be so much easier if stacking was so/sx/sp or sx/so/sp.

*sigh*

Think again. It's highly impractical not to be aware of the fact that you're supposed to take care of your own survival :doh:

And then when you are aware of it..doesn't mean you actually know how to go about it :blush:
 

rav3n

.
Joined
Aug 6, 2010
Messages
11,655
Think again. It's highly impractical not to be aware of the fact that you're supposed to take care of your own survival :doh:

And then when you are aware of it..doesn't mean you actually know how to go about it :blush:
True but sp interferes too much. I've got a long-time friend who I've kept at arms-length since he's the type that's bad for me long-term. Why not just go for it and get all that tension out of the way? But I won't and can't.
 
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