[so] so doms ... join our group!

[Amargith]

Yeah, that's icky to me. It seems subversive, manipulative, and ultimately about you controlling them. I know you like to sugarcoat it and make it seem like this really beautiful thing, but I've seen people even now who use that as power and leverage against others.

Even you refer to it as a challenge and that's just not the way to look at it from my POV. It's almost like racking up notches on bedposts.

I don't sugarcoat anything. Free will is a big thing for me, and I learned a long time ago to wait till asked for help, and ask permission twice at least to poke around, coz otherwise it comes to bite you back in the ass.

But I'm also not one for turning my back on others if they ask for my help. I admit that it's something you can easily take advantage of, other people's emotional vulnerability..but it's something I find despicable anyhow.

Though I won't deny that it's a thrill and an egoboost to do this stuff, it's not why I do it. I do it coz I care. And, when I am able to help, I feel the genuine pride that any person who is succesful at their mission feels. I'm not going to appologize for that, and I do very much enjoy that guilt-free, but try to never do that at the expense of that person.


Anycase, maybe a sx-dom Fe-user would be better suited at mulling over this issue with you

 

[JocktheMotie]

Though I won't deny that it's a thrill and an egoboost to do this stuff, it's not why I do it. I do it coz I care. And, when I am able to help, I feel the genuine pride that any person who is succesful at their mission feels. I'm not going to appologize for that, and I do very much enjoy that guilt-free, but try to never do that at the expense of that person.


Anycase, maybe a sx-dom Fe-user would be better suited at mulling over this issue with you

See! We're people users.

 

[Fidelia]

Haha Jock - That's funny about the hoops to jump through and the turtle shell people. Both descriptions are accurate to some extent!

 

[proteanmix]

I don't sugarcoat anything. Free will is a big thing for me, and I learned a long time ago to wait till asked for help, and ask permission twice at least to poke around, coz otherwise it comes to bite you back in the ass.

I don't know...I don't get that impression from your posts. You feel like an exotic dancer in the champagne room to me. If that's your natural habitat and where you feel most comfortable then cool beans.

I'll let wiki explain it, because it will do a better job than me:

Dancers use props such as make-up, clothing, costumes, and appealing fragrances to complete their character and maintain their "front" while in the club. A customer often wants a dancer to "drop the act," which makes him feel special and desired. Dancers are aware of this customer desire for increased confidence, and will give off the impression that a customer is seeing their true selves. In reality often it is just part of the act. Customers rarely if ever see the preparation of these props since they are denied access to the backstage of a dancer's performance through the layout of the club.

I think you're very purposeful and strategic in how you find your prey and how you attack. I don't think you take no for an answer and you find it offensive if someone rebuffs you and you will stay on them until they relent. And they do. But believe me, I don't hate on your skills and abilities. I half admire it and half aghast. I think that's power and I'm always fascinated by how people wield their power.

Know what I mean?

Though I won't deny that it's a thrill and an egoboost to do this stuff, it's not why I do it. I do it coz I care. And, when I am able to help, I feel the genuine pride that any person who is succesful at their mission feels. I'm not going to appologize for that, and I do very much enjoy that guilt-free, but try to never do that at the expense of that person.

IDK know what to say to the "I do it because I care" part because that's a very nebulous area of intentions and motivations. I feel like if you like to help hurting people, there are a couple of people here that have struck me as needing someone to talk to and reaching out but I feel like they've been outcast and shunned even from the general forum population. I don't know how much the people in need also need to have a certain type code for help and caring to be offered because I've noticed a preference for "helping" people who do have certain types or can sustain entertaining sexual tension.

 

[Amargith]

I don't know...I don't get that impression from your posts. You feel like an exotic dancer in the champagne room to me. If that's your natural habitat and where you feel most comfortable then cool beans.

I'll let wiki explain it, because it will do a better job than me:


I think you're very purposeful and strategic in how you find your prey and how you attack. I don't think you take no for an answer and you find it offensive if someone rebuffs you and you will stay on them until they relent. And they do. But believe me, I don't hate on your skills and abilities. I half admire it and half aghast. I think that's power and I'm always fascinated by how people wield their power.

Know what I mean?

This is my playful side. I've never made a secret out of it though that there's more to me than this. A lot more. I enjoy bantering, I enjoy putting up smokescreens and playing with those that are up for a game

I'll also stop instantly if someone tells me they're not amused. I don't enjoy it if they don't. It's a game, afterall.

IDK know what to say to the "I do it because I care" part because that's a very nebulous area of intentions and motivations. I feel like if you like to help hurting people, there are a couple of people here that have struck me as needing someone to talk to and reaching out but I feel like they've been outcast and shunned even from the general forum population. I don't know how much the people in need also need to have a certain type code for help and caring to be offered because I've noticed a preference for "helping" people who do have certain types or can sustain entertaining sexual tension.

Really? You have insight into all the pm's I get, I know...I had no idea that you actually checked up on that. Not to mention my vent convo's. If you have...I'm not going to be happy. If you haven't..you have no clue who I talk to or why.

When I contribute on the forum, and am not in a playful mood, I contribute to threads that are about something that I've experienced myself, or seen before. This happens to involve NTJs...a lot. However, I contribute equally to female posters' threads as I do to male ones. I also answer to threads that are posted by non-NTJs. In a very serious matter, without playing.

Honestly, I might enjoy certain people more to play with, because there's more of an instant connection there, but I don't rebuff anyone that approaches me for an opinion or help. Ask around.

/derail.

 

[PeaceBaby]

I'll guess I'm the salmon mousse, so get ready to start nibbling.

I made another plate; it's in the fridge, so please enjoy as much as you wish!

I know that I'm very crotchety about people invading my emotional space without me giving them permission to do so. I'm very sensitive to attempts and smack people back when they try, if I have not given them the go ahead. But once I give the go ahead, I'm pretty transparent and enjoy the intimacy.

This is interesting and I relate to it - I especially get itchy when I sense someone trying to get a read on me, because I am used to being the one doing the reading. Not that I use that info for much; it generally stays inside me and becomes a reference point for that person in the future.

I have come to realize I really don't like to deal with people who are like a boiling pot of spaghetti sauce popping and spilling and staining themselves over everyone. To me that indicates emotional instability. I'm not saying be stoic and hide how you feel because anyone who knows me, knows that's not what I'm about. I feel like when people force me into that position and role, I suddenly become your emotional guardian or custodian cleaning up behind you. I'm not really sure how to describe this, but I've discovered that annoys me and makes me not want to be around people whose MO is being constantly uncorked.

Many people are careless with their emotions; they ooze and leak out like pus from an infected wound, spewing onto others like emotional vomit, and have no regard for the ill effects, to themselves or to others. I feel like a nurse in triage, trying to dress the wounds and treat the sick. Sorry if that sounds dramatic or self-righteous, but I do feel angered by those who do nothing to further their own emotional growth and expect others to either do it for them or do nothing and just hurt all the people around them with their brokenness.

Protean's description rang true for me, as did the 1 so/sx description. I think I'm warm, but I do want to reserve the right to welcome people into my space. Even online flirting that is harmless doesn't go over well with me unless I like the person and know them better. (Sort of an implied intimacy that I don't feel is there yet, which feels the same as someone being too touchy feely. The strange thing is that it really depends on how people approach it. It isn't strictly based on how long I've know them, or even what I think of their character etc. Maybe it's how naturally it comes to them as well? Don't know.). I thought what Protean said about the emotional pot bubbling sounded true for me too. I like emotion that is real and I am probably more comfortable than the average person in the face of extreme emotion. At the same time, I don't like it when people go around unnecessarily leaking emotion everywhere, regardless of how appropriate the person or venue they are leaking it on is. It almost seems over the top or false somehow rather than genuine.

That resonates too, but I differ in that I am more protective of myself, even when close I suppose. People take energy from me, not deliver it to me, and I have historically attracted very needy people who take take take. I am much more guarded now about who I allow into the "inner sanctum" ... I used to try to save everyone, include everyone, help everyone. Now I try to be selective, discerning.

@bold: I would word it the same way.

Even entertaining - as a vocalist, I sense the audience takes my energy, and I resent that the transaction is more about them taking from me than giving anything back. The applause and "love" for you is about how you make them feel, and they want more and more of it, sucking it out like vampires.

It's an unbalanced equation, sadly - not what I expected.

I see the things I want out of people, try to get them but if I don't jump through the hoops properly I get rebuffed. And then when we get what we want, there's some kind of implied exit strategy! "Well you got this far, now here are the rules now that you're in the club." It's a bit different with Sps, as they seem equally as closed off to me, but it's more like banging on the turtle shell and them just not wanting to come out.

Just how it seems to me. I'm sure you guys find us to be people users. Like we get our fix and bolt.

It's less about hoops and more about protection for me. Can I trust you? Will you betray me? Will you hurt me? Will you just be another taker? And yes, it does sometimes feel like people get what they need, are happy to take it and move on once the source is tapped out.

I think you're very purposeful and strategic in how you find your prey and how you attack. I don't think you take no for an answer and you find it offensive if someone rebuffs you and you will stay on them until they relent. And they do. But believe me, I don't hate on your skills and abilities. I half admire it and half aghast.

Your words are powerful, protean; your candidness is very impressive and insightful too ... must reflect on this more.

But on a personal note: I do feel Satine's sincerity here and sense her true desire to be helpful ... I see the game, understand what she means by that. I understand it will seem offensive to some.

 

[proteanmix]

Really? You have insight into all the pm's I get, I know...I had no idea that you actually checked up on that. Not to mention my vent convo's. If you have...I'm not going to be happy. If you haven't..you have no clue who I talk to or why.

Hold THE FUCK up. I do not know how many times it's been stated to deaf ears that madmins have NO ACCESS TO PMs.

You are treading dangerous waters with me this very moment. Do not blight my name with such accusations, because that's serious. There is a Madmin Constitution in that modbox that I have abided by from the day I was asked to be a mod. Do not defame my character in that manner. But I guess I hit a nerve so you had to hit a nerve with me. Fair.

If you think you move under the cover of darkness and that people don't blatantly see how you operate then you're deluding yourself. I don't need to read PMs (which I can't) or go to vent. I can count on my two hands the amount of times I've been in Vent over the last year and IIRC you barely speak, or rather you speak only with certain people privately so you can get your (and their) intimacy juices flowing. That in of itself, speaks volumes.

I'm a Fe-dom, I notice this stuff in my sleep.

I've had much more important things happen in my life over the last year then to even check up on you or anyone to that extent. What I see goes on in-thread where anyone can see and it has been seen.

When I contribute on the forum, and am not in a playful mood, I contribute to threads that are about something that I've experienced myself, or seen before. This happens to involve NTJs...a lot. However, I contribute equally to female posters' threads as I do to male ones. I also answer to threads that are posted by non-NTJs. In a very serious matter, without playing.

Honestly, I might enjoy certain people more to play with, because there's more of an instant connection there, but I don't rebuff anyone that approaches me for an opinion or help. Ask around.

/derail.

OK. You keep saying "play" over and over again. I don't "play" with people like that. I don't understand why you keep using that word or the way in which you mean it. Perhaps you could respond in the sx-dom thread?

 

[Amargith]

See! We're people users.

How about I use you a bit? Feel free to return the favor...

 

[cascadeco]

If you think you move under the cover of darkness and that people don't blatantly see how you operate then you're deluding yourself. I don't need to read PMs (which I can't) or go to vent. I can count on my two hands the amount of times I've been in Vent over the last year and IIRC you barely speak, or rather you speak only with certain people privately so you can get your (and their) intimacy juices flowing. That in of itself, speaks volumes.

I'm a Fe-dom, I notice this stuff in my sleep.

I'm not even in here to address specific people, just thought I'd chime in and say that, although I'm not Fe-dom, I do definitely pick up on, and pay attention to, the various forum nuances and group undercurrents/'cliques'/patterns, so I kinda know who's buddy-buddy, and so on, so I know I pick up on similar things, protean. It's not rocket science, really.

sp/so here, by the way. lol.

 

[PeaceBaby]

Oooooh let's not get too testy in my thread please. I like harmony and a party with this kind of tension will require me to use lots of energy to re-establish a light-hearted timbre and tone.

K yes, I am not in the buddy-buddy group either ... I am not a big part of the social undercurrents nor am I super-popular. But let's not make this thread about that please.

I think what I am seeing is that the Sx people really gravitate to each other ... their energy really attracts on some sub-conscious level.

I do feel the pull of that kind of energy, but never seem to be able to get in on it.

 

[Amargith]

Hold THE FUCK up. I do not know how many times it's been stated to deaf ears that madmins have NO ACCESS TO PMs.

You are treading dangerous waters with me this very moment. Do not blight my name with such accusations, because that's serious. There is a Madmin Constitution in that modbox that I have abided by from the day I was asked to be a mod. Do not defame my character in that manner. But I guess I hit a nerve so you had to hit a nerve with me. Fair.

If you think you move under the cover of darkness and that people don't blatantly see how you operate then you're deluding yourself. I don't need to read PMs (which I can't) or go to vent. I can count on my two hands the amount of times I've been in Vent over the last year and IIRC you barely speak, or rather you speak only with certain people privately so you can get your (and their) intimacy juices flowing. That in of itself, speaks volumes.

I'm a Fe-dom, I notice this stuff in my sleep.

I've had much more important things happen in my life over the last year then to even check up on you or anyone to that extent. What I see goes on in-thread where anyone can see and it has been seen.



OK. You keep saying "play" over and over again. I don't "play" with people like that. I don't understand why you keep using that word or the way in which you mean it. Perhaps you could respond in the sx-dom thread?

And I don't know how many times I've said by now that I always check and double check people on the free-will thing. Deaf ears, anyone?

The reason I hit that nerve is because you're not the only one who sees what's going on here. Think of me what you will, but you should caution yourself in slandering my name *just as much*

I'm not the only one capable of (ab)using her social graces, I'd say. You might have a very differentway about it, but you're no innocent girl yourself.
I have to say, I kind of regret opening up to you the way I did, as I genuinly thought you sought to understand. Guess I was wrong. I won't make that mistake again, believe me.

As for what others think of me, I don't care..as long as they get the chance to make up their *own* minds.

I'm done defending myself on this. Especially to you.



@Peacebaby: My appologies, it stops here, I promise.

 

[PeaceBaby]

There's lots of information to be gained from conflict, and I don't want to discourage opposing viewpoints; I just would prefer it not get personal ... you know what I mean I am sure.

That being said, there are nuances here I have not been able to put a name to before, and it is fascinating. Carry on - I want to hear more.

 

[proteanmix]

I have to say, I kind of regret opening up to you the way I did, as I genuinly thought you sought to understand. Guess I was wrong. I won't make that mistake again, believe me.

You didn't enlighten me to anything I hadn't already noticed (see exchange with JtM above as an example). I just wanted to understand the nuts and bolts.

But then that brings us full circle...maybe that does have something to do with being so/sx vs sx-dom. I'm extremely vigilant about who I open myself up to. Someone simply expressing curiosity about me doesn't make me spill my guts to them. Curiosity is not intimacy. You can knock, but it's my prerogative if I want to open the door and allow you to enter. I have no problem sitting on the front porch, talking with you for hours, bringing you something to drink. If I feel comfortable with you, then you come inside. Me asking a person certain questions or having a certain conversations and vice versa doesn't necessarily indicate anything more than information exchange. It can and does, but it's not my first thought. Since I'm aware this does often imply more than congenial rapport to some people, that reinforces even why I'm careful about what I say to people. I don't want to imply more than what is there.

I have had very intimate conversations with strangers and never saw them again. I enjoy that. I think that intimacy was for the moment and should remain two ships passing in the night and saying things to people I know I would never see again was good. It is important for me to recognize the worth of that moment, treasure it and not try to make it more than what it was. I've written this before but I choose who I emotionally anchor and bind myself with carefully because I can't output 100% to 100 people and I don't like to have a revolving door of people coming and going around me.

Everyone who I have deeply bonded with have changed me and I am malleable to them. They have influence over me, I listen to them, I trust them, I take their advice, I tell them things. I've let these people make decisions for me. I'm an EJ through and through and if I'm letting someone decide for me, what I'm going to do, that's a big effing deal!

 

[mrcockburn]

There you guys are!!

ENTP, SLUEI, 7w6, so/sp, aura: tie dye, bye bye.

 

[mrcockburn]

I guess internet interaction like this forum (which is more substantial than say, facebook?) would attract SX's. Particularly SX/SPs who crave intimacy but also get prickly about their space (or *cough cough* INFPS? )

That's what I wondered about. Since it's commonly summed up sx=passion/connection etc.

The fact that I joined TypeC made me consider the possibility of me being an SX-dom and a "feeler". (Which should make EVERYONE here SX feelers. (That is, feeling SeXy...sorry couldn't resist. nyah.)

I'd say I joined because I stumbled upon MBTI to use for career guidance, and lo and behold, a group of people where EVERYONE was interested in the crap. I liked all the activity and randomness and like to use this forum to figure my own self out. So far, at least now I have a semi-valid quasi-psychological excuse to HATE accounting.

 

[Rebe]

I joined because ... wait, I don't remember ... but I have always been part of an internet forum. That sounds kind of sad, but no I sort of 'grew up' with writers over the internet and always loved being a part of a 'group'. I was able to be close to people in a purely intellectual/creative way without all the social norms and drama sort of mess. I really enjoy and need to be part of a group who shares one interest in common. At first, I was just going to peek in now and then and read some theory stuff. But...here I am getting to know people and liking it. There has always been a conflict of wanting to reach out and to understand and share and be part of something and the withdrawing within myself to protect and defend and be safe and a loner. And being proud of being a loner because that means I am very independent and self-sufficient and don't need emotional support from anyone. I don't trust people to always be there for me so I like to feel that I can handle whatever issues I have. I love people as a 'collective' but I don't often like people individually. I have a love for humanity, but each person makes me sort of grimace. I have deep, intense connections with my friends, of course, but they are few. I can't open myself to too many people because then, I feel 'stretched'. I need to feel safe in order to 'share'.

 

[mrcockburn]

With So people, I typically feel like I keep getting disarmed. Or they blow the whistle on me. Like socialization is this game of Simon Says or Stoplight, and they're the referees. I see the things I want out of people, try to get them but if I don't jump through the hoops properly I get rebuffed. And then when we get what we want, there's some kind of implied exit strategy! "Well you got this far, now here are the rules now that you're in the club." It's a bit different with Sps, as they seem equally as closed off to me, but it's more like banging on the turtle shell and them just not wanting to come out.

Just how it seems to me. I'm sure you guys find us to be people users. Like we get our fix and bolt.

And with you SX's, it's like getting zoomed in on like I'm prey deer every time I look their way & say "hey! how you doing?"

 

[JocktheMotie]

And with you SX's, it's like getting zoomed in on like I'm prey deer every time I look their way & say "hey! how you doing?"

Don't squirm too much. *puts on rubber glove* This will all be over soon.

 

[Southern Kross]

Yay So-ers!

I'm a 4w5 so/sp which is a little strange and contradictory. It does explain some things though...

 

[CzeCze]

$8 bucks, 20 minutes: https://www.enneagraminstitute.com/Tests_Battery.asp#IVQ

Why did you do that PeaceBaby? Now I am $8 poorer.

LOL.

Uh-oh, here are my results and it changes my membership slightly...

Sexual 57

Social 55

Self Preservation 38

Which nudges me into Sx/So territory.

It's as I thought...I think for all intensive practical purposes I am So/Sx though, because my So 'wing' is way too strong and too much of a mitigating influence on Sx for being 'Sx dom' to be anything meaningful.

Honestly...I always thought I was an SX dom, it seemed obvious for me. My desire to merge with individuals is extremely strong and has been a driving influence in my life, even as a pre-teen.

On the questionnaire, Sx nosed out So by just 2 points (or 1 question?) - the crucial deciding factor was the question "when you enter a room, what do you immediately do" - and for me it is to zero in on 1 or 2 people - expectations, networking possibilities be damned - that intrigue me and get alllll up in their grill. L.O.L. That is my SX...soul motivation? Otherwise I'm a natural networker. Likewise in relationships I am very So dom and have many acquaintances and casual friendships, I also try to cultivate friendly relations with the people who work at my gym, in my building, at work with the IT and office and 'support' folks etc. But, sometimes I see people that intrigue me and I zero in on them with that internal laser intensity and it's not that I want to sleep with them or even date them, but my desire is very basic almost primal and is "Me likey" or "I want".

Otherwise SO is how I operate, because unlike other strong or clear Sx doms, I cannot easily forget or thumb my nose at social expectations, etiquette, power dynamics, group harmony, etc. Group dynamics and harmony, social standing, reputation, etc. those things are important not because I am a snob and give them importance but rather because those things make up our world on a basic everyday level and I am always conscious of that. It is against my nature to not be conscious of those things and at least consider those things in my decision making. Believe me, sometimes I badly wish I was not aware and that I did not care, but I do. It's who I am. And I consciously scale back my intensity to make it less startling for people I direct it at, my intense focus in others is orchestrated in a way that is more strategic and conscious than instinctual...(I think I understand where Satine is coming from, though I do not necessarily operate in the same way)

I think that ^^ constant awareness is the SO...heartbeat...backbone...signaure? I'm really bad with analogies tonight...

I remember I was a bit miffed when Black Cat said he saw me as an So dom! LOL. Because, again, that strong almost primal need to connect with others, intensely, totally, to the point the boundaries of egos start to blur (I know, this probably sounds crazy and even unhealthy to some people) it's such a core part of me that has driven me throughout my life. I thought, what am I not "intense" enough for you? Am I not "deep" enough to hang with the Sx's??? Nah, but I can see why people might not read me as an Sx dom, because I don't go in like a cauterizing laser or a sledge hammer in my normal MO. My SO variant is way too strong and pulls me back, I generally consciously try to lighten the intense nature of Sx in me, because I am aware of how intrusive that intensity can be and how 'inappropriate', I have also been burned enough times to adjust my approach. I am always very aware of how I am coming off to others...at least when I am consciously trying to get to know someone.

So yeah, upon reading more about what the instincts are and now having taken this questionnaire, I get why Black Cat and others would see me as a So dom..

I am an So-Sx close tie because I have an intense desire and need to connect and 'know' and also be known by people, in the individual and general sense. The ubiquituous 'they' as well the intimate and special 'him/her/etc.'

Can I just call myself a SO-SX tie? x2