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Group Thinking: "What is the problem with mob hysteria and group thinking?

Lark

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I thought you're sending the message that people should break away from conformism. Now, you are stressing that someone else is responsible for them :shock: Don't you think that if people stop relying on others to show the truth and tell them how to think, nobody would care to watch Fox news and the like, or at least, won't be brainwashed by these? IMO, people should learn to take responsibility for their actions and beliefs. Group thinking is shared responsibility, that's why it's so easy - if everybody is involved no one could be wrong or guilty.

Yeah, I hear these sorts of messages all the time, usually what people mean my "take responsibility" is conform to their beliefs rather than other ones or the ones they hold already.
 

Coriolis

Si vis pacem, para bellum
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The obvious problems with groupthink are that it amplifies opinions, especially harmful in the case of negative or destructive ones; and it pushes out alternatives, limiting options, opportunity, and creativity.

No one grows up in a vacuum. From infancy we are surrounded by messages telling us what is acceptable and unacceptable; what to think; what isn't to be discussed. Media are an important contributor to this environment. People can break free of this, but just the fact that we use that term - "break free" - suggests that it does have some hold on people. Overcoming that is easier for some people than others, due to a combination of innate qualities and how much help they have.
 
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Tellenbach

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There is no such thing as a libertarian mob; we'd rather just take a nap or read a book. I think the people most afflicted with group think are people with self-confidence problems; this manifests itself as a disgusting need for approval in others. Every nut in Antifa/BLM/KKK, etc. is a weak-minded person who wants to be led around on a leash and have others think for them; this isn't a problem except that the leaders are similarly very flawed people - usually drug-addicted celebrities or slimey lawyer turned politicians.
 

Lark

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There is no such thing as a libertarian mob; we'd rather just take a nap or read a book. I think the people most afflicted with group think are people with self-confidence problems; this manifests itself as a disgusting need for approval in others. Every nut in Antifa/BLM/KKK, etc. is a weak-minded person who wants to be led around on a leash and have others think for them; this isn't a problem except that the leaders are similarly very flawed people - usually drug-addicted celebrities or slimey lawyer turned politicians.

That might be true, it also may be false. I think its difficult to generalise. People do the exact same thing and have very different motivations.

Its where that saying about doing the right thing for the wrong reasons comes from (although more often I see people doing the wrong thing for the right reasons, its just a bad, maybe worse).

Although, what you're talking about, its been studied and discussed before now, Karen Horney called it the "neurotic need for affection" but she didnt use words like "weakness", which are pretty loaded terms, instead she talked about "basic anxiety" and thought it began in the family home, attachment style and/or deficiencies or disorders could be something to do with it.

I might describe it as a "character flaw" but I know that's a loaded term too. I would say that as I personally prefer some of Erich Fromm's ideas, he thought there was a drive to freedom, which every person experiences and is as powerful as any other drive, maybe more so, but social context, circumstances, some as simple as wanting to be a success, mean that people forfeit their freedom, repress it, adopt a "social character", which is determined by a "social unconscious", and do their best to conform to that. There's the main culturally patterned "social character" but there's subcultures or "scenes" etc. which have their own, its usually a variation on a theme.

Fromm identified a bunch of what he thought were unhealthy types, he had his own typology or characterology, but he thought this changes all the time too. Like he didnt try to develop any kind of a theory which was ahistorical or anything like that.

Anyway, I think character is an important idea, less thought about or talked about these days but it used to be really important, in a broader sense than mere integrity. Even if you think its a fiction agreed upon or social construct I still think it matters and so its how I'd look at things like this. Also Fromm would have suggested that boredom has a lot to do with movements like that. I'm inclined to agree with that. Its not merely boredom in the sense of being unoccupied, its a little bit more compelling than that, because I think you'd have to be pretty damn bored to seek out the kind of trouble that most of these groups generate or attract.
 

The Cat

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Given long enough...
Always ends in blood.
 

Lark

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There is no such thing as a libertarian mob; we'd rather just take a nap or read a book. I think the people most afflicted with group think are people with self-confidence problems; this manifests itself as a disgusting need for approval in others. Every nut in Antifa/BLM/KKK, etc. is a weak-minded person who wants to be led around on a leash and have others think for them; this isn't a problem except that the leaders are similarly very flawed people - usually drug-addicted celebrities or slimey lawyer turned politicians.

I also dont think its necessarily authoritarianism vs libertarianism that's the issue with groupthink, it can be and most authoritarianism is grounded in some way in a groupthink, usually, but its also about unanimity of opinion, when there is no difference of opinion what so ever there can be no evolution, change, development beyond the known, growth is impossible, and when a wrong course or direction is taken its impossible to make a course correction.
 

LightSun

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I think that there's a certain sort of hysterical group think which is the absolute scourge of the western world, or anglosphere at least, at the moment which thinks that its possible to dispense with all societal norms without question or hesitation. Its EXTREMELY radical, in the sense of being radicalised as opposed to simply proposing a great change or difference, those that belong to this group can not comprehend the thinking of those who are not part of the group think and will more quickly just attribute things to non-members than ask them what their thinking is.

I cant remember when the last time that I met someone who did follow norms without question or hesitation or would have known they were actually doing so.

I meet plenty of people who attack them without thinking what good they are or have been.

”It is so hard to rise above the masses of the population that may still harbor outdated and prejudicial stereotypes. These are harmful beliefs and change is needed to be directed in addressing these areas of injustice. This requires a very independent and morally conscious individual. The alternative is holding unto old prejudices and stereotypes stemming and arising from sheer ignorance and fears. I do not know why some individuals are more susceptible to group thought. It is most probable there are a number of factors.

In my mind a person who does not have a firm grasp of critical and independent thought based on reason may hold subconsciously a plethora of cognitive fallacies in thought, laden full of distortions. Another variable is a person who is swayed in a subconscious manner by their own fears. These type of individuals may therefore lash outwardly against other people and the world while finding solace with those who share a similar world view. Another variable are people who have a closed minded dogmatic black and white type of thinking. These individuals are not open to new ideas for they feel threatened by concepts dissimilar to those they hold.

In a type of parable a wind storm comes. The mighty Oak won't bend, so in this scenario it shall fall. It is in this rigid stance and not being open minded enough that they are analogous to the Oak tree. Taking the position of the mighty Oak Tree is to hold on to preconceived held notions and beliefs. They are as unyielding as a mighty Oak and will only bring invariably be left behind in the mists of time as unyielding and to be pitied. These individuals are not willing to engage in rational dialogue nor entertain new ideas so as to effect changes with the coming of new circumstances and societal developments. Change is ever moving as a rolling river.

Invariably the individual not willing to change will be left behind in the mists of time. People who are resistant to change hold on resistant, underlying beliefs and act as a barrier to societal change. It is no easy feat but progress is a necessity when tackling societal issues. Some of societies ills are protected by norms or rationalizing preexisting conditions. It takes courage and fortitude to resist laws as well rules of behavior that happens to be in our society which are outdated. It requires strength that reside's within each and all of humanity. If we succeed we can tap into raising public awareness and raising moral consciousness."
 
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