Spanking: Should spanking be used to discipline a child?

[prplchknz]

In TN spanking is legal but under the condition that it is done with a bare hand on the bottom, the idea is when the hand begins to sting it's time to stop. I don't know if agree with this, I don't have kids and I was never spanked as a kid and I'm not a hoodlum like pro spankers claim will happen. I feel that the adults who spank a lot of times (I said a lot of times not all the time so don't be like but but but or i will cut you) are doing it out of anger and a lot of people who were hit as a child are really angry and resentful and they behave out of a fear respond instead of hey I'd hate for someone to do that to me.

 

[Poki]

In TN spanking is legal but under the condition that it is done with a bare hand on the bottom, the idea is when the hand begins to sting it's time to stop. I don't know if agree with this, I don't have kids and I was never spanked as a kid and I'm not a hoodlum like pro spankers claim will happen. I feel that the adults who spank a lot of times (I said a lot of times not all the time so don't be like but but but or i will cut you) are doing it out of anger and a lot of people who were hit as a child are really angry and resentful and they behave out of a fear respond instead of hey I'd hate for someone to do that to me.

Sting is all about how you spank...i can break a bone without "stinging". I actually go for a sting when i spank...because it painful, quick, and temporary. Stings dont last as long as if you try to hurt and end up bruising.

I spank if it works, i dont if it doesnt. Its kid dependent. I stopped spanking my first because he spiralled out of control and it didnt work so i found other methods of punishment. I would have stopped spabking sooner, but sometimes your with someone who disables other methods and your stuck with limited options. After divorce spanking stopped completely as i had more options that i coupd actually follow through with.

Ohh...when your hand starts to sting...i agree with that. If it takes more then twice you really need to learn to spank better as your kinda beating ypur child at that point IMHO. Skin to skin requires the least amount of force and is preferable to me. I hate spanking over clothes as you lose most of any notion of how hard you spanked.

I usually spank the side of the thigh...to much padding on butt

 

[EcK]

Spanking is the last refuge of the incompetent parent.

We use different terms for the same thing: spanking is assault. Assaulting someone that couldn’t possibly defend themselves. It’s cowardly and vile.

 

[Beorn]

[MENTION=7111] but [Social] science has pretty much proven that spanking is not effective and can cause emotional damage.

aka not real science

 

[Litvyak]

I find that spanking doesn't really work. Try hitting them on the head with a crowbar or other metal objects, that always does the trick.

 

[Obfuscate]

In some areas, reporting by such institutions - often required by law - has gotten quite out of hand. The institutions and CPS authorities take a "shoot first and don't bother to ask questions" approach, ambushing familes with bureaucratic requirements and intrusive inspections based on evidence that is flimsy at best, and often turns up an accident or brush with another kid that has nothing to do with an abusive family. It turns into a witch hunt, and offers an easy way to make trouble for a neighbor or relative one doesn't like.

true, and i have known many people (such as my step sisters) who landed in more abusive environments due to actions taken by cps... when i was younger, getting them involved in my life felt like a gamble, so my brothers and i skipped it... there was a lot of other factors at play, but there was a pervasive feeling that they would either do too little or too much... getting them to deal with real abuse can be hit or miss, as can getting them to keep their nose out when someone who isn't involved misunderstands... i am not suggesting that there isn't a place for cps, but i just don't trust them as an organization...

 

[Aquarelle]

aka not real science

JFC.

 

[Aquarelle]

Although I vehemently disagree that social science isn't "real science"...

Spanking and Adult Mental Health Impairment - authors from psychiatry, neuroscience, pediatrics (in addition to also psychology, social work, community health)

Relationship of childhood abuse and household dysfunction to many of the leading causes of death in adults from the American Journal of Preventive Medicine

Slapping and spanking in childhood and its association with lifetime prevalence of psychiatric disorders in a general population sample from the Canadian Medical Association Journal
...

Need I go on?

I don't necessarily think that CPS should remove children from homes for spanking alone, because of course separation from the family is also traumatic. I don't have a fail safe answer to when/if CPS should remove children from homes, but doctors use the determination of "greatest risk" when deciding to prescribe medications with potentially negative side effects-- is the risk to the individual greater if they do take this medicine, or if they don't take it? Perhaps a similar formula could be applied in this case.

 

[Beorn]

Relationship of childhood abuse and household dysfunction to many of the leading causes of death in adults from the American Journal of Preventive Medicine

Slapping and spanking in childhood and its association with lifetime prevalence of psychiatric disorders in a general population sample from the Canadian Medical Association Journal

The titles themselves show that they're inconclusive. I don't even need to read them to know that they haven't "proven that spanking is not effective and can cause emotional damage."
They simply can't prove causation.

Human interactions are far too complex to come up with simple black and white determinations on an issue like this. There are just too many people like me that don't have any issue with the fact that they were raised with spanking.

You can't tell me to disbelieve my own eyes and trust some academics when it comes to something like this.
Moreover, even if I agreed I certainly wouldn't believe in forcing others to comply based on some research.

Also, you really shouldn't be so quick to defend the social sciences.
In many areas they're an absolute mess and a joke.
New Real Peer Review (@RealPeerReview) | Twitter

 

[Aquarelle]

Also, you really shouldn't be so quick to defend the social sciences.
In many areas they're an absolute mess and a joke.
New Real Peer Review (@RealPeerReview) | Twitter

I work at a Big Ten university. Forgive me if I trust my colleagues in academia more than Twitter.

 

[Lark]

aka not real science

I like to keep a Phrenology head for just such occasions as this.

 

[Lark]

The titles themselves show that they're inconclusive. I don't even need to read them to know that they haven't "proven that spanking is not effective and can cause emotional damage."
They simply can't prove causation.

Human interactions are far too complex to come up with simple black and white determinations on an issue like this. There are just too many people like me that don't have any issue with the fact that they were raised with spanking.

You can't tell me to disbelieve my own eyes and trust some academics when it comes to something like this.
Moreover, even if I agreed I certainly wouldn't believe in forcing others to comply based on some research.

Also, you really shouldn't be so quick to defend the social sciences.
In many areas they're an absolute mess and a joke.
New Real Peer Review (@RealPeerReview) | Twitter

http://icpla.edu/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/Freud-S.-Child-is-Being-Beaten%E2%80%99-A-Contribution-to-the-Study-of-the-Origin-of-Sexual-Perversions.pdf

There you go.

Anyway, its not like I'm for ill discipline and I know a lot of parents who arent a fan of corporeal punishment who arent a fan of punishment per se or even correction or even knowing their offspring happen to be there at all, indifference to child, whatever the damn motive, and I've seen it often enough and I've seen it motivated by a range of things, is likely to give rise to the worst sort of delinquency, deviance and anti-social behaviour, whether the harm is to others or mainly to themselves is a different matter.

Things like this are abused too much to make their use even remotely a good idea, they also involve mutual harm if you ask me of one sort or another I'm not happy to contemplate myself personally, so for myself, which I would suppose is probably the most important question it'd not be an option. Should it be available to others? I dont think so as the temptation to abuse it is too great. Its part of why I wouldnt want it as public policy either. Its in the same ball park as public stoning and Taliban craziness.

In the heat of the moment you're not supposed to give way to emoting with violence and the idea of cold bloodedly involving in rational violence, if there's such a thing, I'm not even sure.

 

[Lark]

I work at a Big Ten university. Forgive me if I trust my colleagues in academia more than Twitter.

Careful now, I hear academia is sketchy and shady AF.

Most of the Gangsta raps is about the academias.

 

[highlander]

I think there are few adults who can use spanking in an appropriate way, as one rarely used tool for a very small child, among many other tools. There are also some kinds of children for whom no amount of spanking will be helpful and it just kindles long-term resentment. Mostly the spankings children remember and are upset about are the ones that were done unjustly and as an outlet for the adult's anger or frustration.

This is the issue. That being said, I'm not really against it. Kids are too spoiled these days. We've gone overboard with sentiments that the child can do no wrong, poor discipline, etc. I sat in front of this couple on a airplane a few weeks ago and this kid was completely obnoxious and much in need of discipline over a period of a few hours. They needed to do something as it was disturbing all of the people around them. Sometimes kids need discipline.

 

[Lark]

This is the issue. That being said, I'm not really against it. Kids are too spoiled these days. We've gone overboard with sentiments that the child can do no wrong, poor discipline, etc. I sat in front of this couple on a airplane a few weeks ago and this kid was completely obnoxious and much in need of discipline over a period of a few hours. They needed to do something as it was disturbing all of the people around them. Sometimes kids need discipline.

I definitely know what you mean, I dont have any children and am in no rush to have any because I'd need to have a very good wifey to help out who had similar views to myself on the matter so we could be consistent and I dont meet women like that very often, plenty I would date, none I would marry for reasons like that.

I had a mate once who was out in a hotel lounge with me once and we were seated next to a group of kids who were rowdy and ill behaved, their parents were ignoring them and it was steadily getting worse, one of the kids was going totally manic to the point at which they ran head long into a small table with a portable DVD player that they had been given to occupy themselves and, dude, this was a big smash, they'd broke the DVD player clean in half and the parents still appeared sort of non-plused about it. My mate loudly declared "Ha, Ha! You broke your thing!", in that instant you should have seen the parents snap to attention and the kid go quiet. I had wished he hadnt done anything because I didnt want to get into a possible fight with these parents, which upon reflection is crazy, the same people couldnt be bothered to have a word with their children but they were prepared to start a fight with two strangers who'd been drinking.

Which kind of comes back to the issue being a sort of indifference, an absent minded, abdication of from what's going on in the immediate surroundings. I've seen it a lot. Its like life is a dress rehearsal for a lot of people living it.

 

[Aquarelle]

The titles themselves show that they're inconclusive. I don't even need to read them to know that they haven't "proven that spanking is not effective and can cause emotional damage."
They simply can't prove causation.

I put the articles there to show that it's not only social science that has addressed this topic.
Also, I said "pretty much proven," not "proven beyond a doubt" and "can cause emotional damage," not "always causes emotional damage."

If you know anything about science, you know that scientists don't ever consider anything 100% proven. Rather, the primary criterion and standard of evaluation of scientific theory is evidence.

Human interactions are far too complex to come up with simple black and white determinations on an issue like this. There are just too many people like me that don't have any issue with the fact that they were raised with spanking.

I don't disagree. As I said above, I, too, was raised with spanking and am fine. Almost nothing in the world is black and white. But it's not black and white from your angle either-- just because you and I were spanked and not traumatized by it, it doesn't mean that no one else is. Science surely wouldn't accept an n of 2 as strong evidence that spanking is not harmful.

You can't tell me to disbelieve my own eyes and trust some academics when it comes to something like this.
Moreover, even if I agreed I certainly wouldn't believe in forcing others to comply based on some research.

And in fact, I didn't tell you that, and I never said anything about forcing anyone else to comply based on "some research" by "some academics." (And here I will point out that twice, you told me what I "can't" or "shouldn't" do.) Is this not a forum where one can state their opinion and back it up with evidence?

In all honesty, before I had my son, I used to feel a lot like you do. But before putting that belief into practice, I read the research, and was convinced otherwise.

 

[highlander]

I put the articles there to show that it's not only social science that has addressed this topic. Also, I said "pretty much proven," not "proven beyond a doubt" and "can cause emotional damage," not "always causes emotional damage." If you know anything about science, you know that scientists don't ever consider anything 100% proven. Rather, the primary criterion and standard of evaluation of scientific theory is evidence. I don't disagree. As I said above, I, too, was raised with spanking and am fine. Almost nothing in the world is black and white. But it's not black and white from your angle either-- just because you and I were spanked and not traumatized by it, it doesn't mean that no one else is. Science surely wouldn't accept an n of 2 as strong evidence that spanking is not harmful. And in fact, I didn't tell you that, and I never said anything about forcing anyone else to comply based on "some research" by "some academics." (And here I will point out that twice, you told me what I "can't" or "shouldn't" do.) Is this not a forum where one can state their opinion and back it up with evidence? In all honesty, before I had my son, I used to feel a lot like you do. But before putting that belief into practice, I read the research, and was convinced otherwise.

I'm skeptical of such studies. What did people do 50 year ago? 500? 1000? Most certainly they ate better though studies were published advocating consumption of carbohydrates in the late 70s and since then we have the obesity epidemic. All I know is there are a lot of spoiled and indulged children these days .

 

[Betty Blue]

This is the issue. That being said, I'm not really against it. Kids are too spoiled these days. We've gone overboard with sentiments that the child can do no wrong, poor discipline, etc. I sat in front of this couple on a airplane a few weeks ago and this kid was completely obnoxious and much in need of discipline over a period of a few hours. They needed to do something as it was disturbing all of the people around them. Sometimes kids need discipline.

That's a tough one, in a confined space with no escape for a prolonged period of time. I can see how a parent might give in to constant whining. There would be better ways of dealing with it of course. Trying to put a positive spin on things (aka if you behave well we will go to the park tomorrow etc), engaging with said child i.e playing a game. Lots of ways to deal with a child without the use of force. Imo spanking/hurting a child is never ok. It is usually done out of anger or frustration which is the opposite of discipline, you are actually teaching your child violence is the answer when you can't cope. As for the occasional spanking when the child is misbehaving i don't agree with that either, i don't believe for a second it even 'works', why should children be afraid of their parents? respect yes, love yes, care yes... but why fear?

 

[rav3n]

Children are pretty easy to reason with, if you take into consideration that they're not fully formed and that the world revolves around them. Once you realize this, many of their decisions are quite logical.

The way to teach empathy to children, is to exhibit empathy with them and others. They'll absorb it through osmosis.

 

[Lark]

I'm skeptical of such studies. What did people do 50 year ago? 500? 1000? Most certainly they ate better though studies were published advocating consumption of carbohydrates in the late 70s and since then we have the obesity epidemic. All I know is there are a lot of spoiled and indulged children these days .

God said to Abraham, kill me a son...

Maybe its that there's a lot a lot of spoiled and indulged adults who cant stand that little chaotic mofos are gonna ruin their fleeting serenity?

We're all adults and children living in a world in which, for most of us at least who're visiting this forum for instance, we're not having our mortality threatened. That's a thing maybe. There's other big changes too. Though in my experience and that of teacher friends, and this isnt something I'd expect is mirrored globally, but we've seen an upsurge in what to all appearances seems to be some sort of epidemic of learning disabilities or something.

When you have those sorts of trends or things trending what are you going to do? Most of the people I'd like to see receive some sort of physical punishment are adults rather than kids, although I say that, I never felt physically threatened by children or kids, big adolescents or adults, its a different story and the aspect of threat would be the only thing that made me think that way.