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View Poll Results: When you think "feminism", what do you think of?

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  • I generaly think of it positively (please explain)

    33 37.50%
  • I generaly think of it negatively (please explain)

    21 23.86%
  • I'm admantly for it

    12 13.64%
  • I'm adamantly against it

    13 14.77%
  • I'm somewhere in the middle (please explain)

    18 20.45%
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Thread: Toxic Feminism

  1. #751
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    Quote Originally Posted by Julius_Van_Der_Beak View Post


    I'm really surprised nobody has created a thread yet decrying this.

    To be fair, I suppose some hay could be made of this coming from Georgia-Pacific, of all places.
    Strength is good all around, I like that lifting has become more popular with both sexes.

    I do think there are more bodyshapes among women than men and that strength can look different if that makes sense, I've known a few women who complained about how strength training did not give them the appearance they were looking for which was kind of impossible as they wanted a different shape as opposed to simply "shaping up".

    Personally, I think it should be about how utilitarian strength and a hard physic can be as opposed to an aesthetic.

  2. #752
    Senior Member Jaguar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dep View Post
    Women supposedly get paid less for the same work, and yet they're still not being hired more often because businesses across the board are irrational and not fully motivated to make money? I find it hard to believe that no sector within any industry was able to identify this supposedly irrational behavior in order to outperform the competition.
    Paying on straight commission is how you know who is worth a shit to begin with. Gender is irrelevant.
    Toto, I have a feeling we're not in Kansas anymore.

  3. #753
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    If we consider the core idea of "feminism" to be the belief that people should receive equal protection under the law regardless of sex, I absolutely support it and think of it positively.

    Though feminism can be used in other contexts too as a term. If used in another way, I'm not going to make a guarantee right now of my support or lack thereof.

  4. #754
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LucieCat View Post
    If we consider the core idea of "feminism" to be the belief that people should receive equal protection under the law regardless of sex, I absolutely support it and think of it positively.
    The definition of feminism I use is this one, from a standard dictionary:

    the belief that women should be allowed the same rights, power, and opportunities as men
    I have run into very few people who oppose it, though many can offer legitimate critique of specific advocates for it, or methods used to try to achieve it.
    I've been called a criminal, a terrorist, and a threat to the known universe. But everything you were told is a lie. The truth is, they've taken our freedom, our home, and our future. The time has come for all humanity to take a stand...

  5. #755
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    The term itself could be used rather dangerously to lump sum a variety of beliefs, positions, etc. What does it mean to be a feminist? I want to be seen as a fearless warrior. I also want to be a super sultry sex kitten. I want my fierce independence. I also want to admire the raw strength of a man and feel safe in the comfort of his protection. Not every thing in the world needs to be devisive.

    - - - Updated - - -

    The term itself could be used rather dangerously to lump sum a variety of beliefs, positions, etc. What does it mean to be a feminist? I want to be seen as a fearless warrior. I also want to be a super sultry sex kitten. I want my fierce independence. I also want to admire the raw strength of a man and feel safe in the comfort of his protection. Not every thing in the world needs to be devisive.

  6. #756
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coriolis View Post
    The definition of feminism I use is this one, from a standard dictionary:



    I have run into very few people who oppose it, though many can offer legitimate critique of specific advocates for it, or methods used to try to achieve it.
    Liberal feminism.

    Its fine I suppose but I tend to think that equality as sameness sucks. Uniformity. Androgyny. Grey Goo. Who wants that?

    Lately I've begun to think of it as a unique problem with zero-positive personalities, Baron-Cohen's idea about zero empathy, systematizing psychology present in aspergers and autism.

    The best versions of a more robust feminism I think are in literary and fictional sources actually, like Gate To Womens Country or Swastika Night, unfortunately they are much like a lot of political fiction, they tell a tale well but generally the truth of the matter or real world examples are hella sobering in contrast to the dreams of the authors.

    Like for most of my life I've tried to identify with feminist causes, some of it seems basic, some of its libertarian as pertains to women, but I've also experienced the toxic variety first hand, its ugly, at least as ugly as many other varieties or equivalents I've encountered. So I cant identify that way anymore. I think some of the thinking is interesting, even helpful, at lot of it is not.

    These days it seems like a lot of personal illness, troubles, trauma and issues are channeled into politics and public life, its not good for anyone, a lot of the time all it does is summon up and strengthen wraiths and specters which where just about dead, gone and forgotten too.

  7. #757
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    Quote Originally Posted by MyINFJness View Post
    The term itself could be used rather dangerously to lump sum a variety of beliefs, positions, etc. What does it mean to be a feminist? I want to be seen as a fearless warrior. I also want to be a super sultry sex kitten. I want my fierce independence. I also want to admire the raw strength of a man and feel safe in the comfort of his protection. Not every thing in the world needs to be devisive.

    - - - Updated - - -

    The term itself could be used rather dangerously to lump sum a variety of beliefs, positions, etc. What does it mean to be a feminist? I want to be seen as a fearless warrior. I also want to be a super sultry sex kitten. I want my fierce independence. I also want to admire the raw strength of a man and feel safe in the comfort of his protection. Not every thing in the world needs to be devisive.
    What is the whole fearless warrior thing? It used to get condemned as a male fantasy at a time, back when feminists where more readily setting out a stand on being positively in favour of difference and talking about the greater empathy of women, an ethic of care etc.

    While its one sided perhaps, there's some basis for it in recent psychological research too. The male warrior versus female carer archetypes based on empathy that is.

    Although the fearless warrior thing is something that I've read feminists write about, it appeals to women and men, maybe its about courage, skill, strength, fitness or something, I remember reading about archetypes a long time ago and the idea of warrior-scholars or warrior-poets as archetypes and wondered why the "warrior" part was important and if it was equally weighted with the second part or not.
    Likes MyINFJness liked this post

  8. #758
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    Liberal feminism.

    Its fine I suppose but I tend to think that equality as sameness sucks. Uniformity. Androgyny. Grey Goo. Who wants that?
    You are not the only one who mistakenly equates equality with sameness. I don't understand the basis for this error as I don't see anyone making that claim. If anything, it is the opposite: removal of barriers, so every person, male or female, can be who they really are. Gender is just one of the many factors that make all of us different one from another. Removing gender-based restrictions, expectations, and programming doesn't change that at all, merely means people no longer have to suppress it to conform on the basis of gender.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    Lately I've begun to think of it as a unique problem with zero-positive personalities, Baron-Cohen's idea about zero empathy, systematizing psychology present in aspergers and autism.

    The best versions of a more robust feminism I think are in literary and fictional sources actually, like Gate To Womens Country or Swastika Night, unfortunately they are much like a lot of political fiction, they tell a tale well but generally the truth of the matter or real world examples are hella sobering in contrast to the dreams of the authors.

    Like for most of my life I've tried to identify with feminist causes, some of it seems basic, some of its libertarian as pertains to women, but I've also experienced the toxic variety first hand, its ugly, at least as ugly as many other varieties or equivalents I've encountered. So I cant identify that way anymore. I think some of the thinking is interesting, even helpful, at lot of it is not.

    These days it seems like a lot of personal illness, troubles, trauma and issues are channeled into politics and public life, its not good for anyone, a lot of the time all it does is summon up and strengthen wraiths and specters which where just about dead, gone and forgotten too.
    No idea what a "zero-positive personality" is. Based on the definition I use and posted before, I don't think there is any toxic, ugly feminism, only some toxic, ugly feminists who are going about things the wrong way.
    I've been called a criminal, a terrorist, and a threat to the known universe. But everything you were told is a lie. The truth is, they've taken our freedom, our home, and our future. The time has come for all humanity to take a stand...

  9. #759
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coriolis View Post
    You are not the only one who mistakenly equates equality with sameness. I don't understand the basis for this error as I don't see anyone making that claim. If anything, it is the opposite: removal of barriers, so every person, male or female, can be who they really are. Gender is just one of the many factors that make all of us different one from another. Removing gender-based restrictions, expectations, and programming doesn't change that at all, merely means people no longer have to suppress it to conform on the basis of gender.


    No idea what a "zero-positive personality" is. Based on the definition I use and posted before, I don't think there is any toxic, ugly feminism, only some toxic, ugly feminists who are going about things the wrong way.
    I'm not equating equality with sameness, that was my point I'm afraid.

  10. #760
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    As Rimbaud said "the day when women will be equal to men it will be a total disaster".

    Today it seems old fashioned to think "women are men' future" (I see some artists like Jean Ferrat or others who sing who used to sing/write such stuffs in my own language) .

    Probably because women don't wanna feel like it anymore
    ALL THAT WE SEE OR SEEM TO BE IS BUT A DREAM WITHIN A DREAM

    Dare observing your shadows (50 shades of darkness) for your own well-being Unfortunately we are all fucking contagious Smile and see what happens around you......

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