do you think depression and anxiety are overdiagnosed

[prplchknz]

or that many people have depression and anxiety? I had more to say but I forgot

 

[WhoCares]

I think its more prevalent that even diagnosis indicate, although I will also say that the medical profession seems to love any diagnosis that results in a prescription. But overall I think modern life and the transgression of ones authenticity out of fear, most likely puts a large proportion of the population genuinely into those conditions. Few people are living the life they really desire (not measuring in terms of money but in terms of what they would rather be doing with their lives). It's almost a given that once you reach adulthood you should put your personal interests into the occassional hobby category and get in with torturing yourself in an office job for the sake if money. The human equivalent of being a battery hen. That cant be good.

 

[mooseantlers]

Definitely levels are rising at a scary rate, if any thing there are many people un-diagnosed; when it comes to mental illness people are less likely to seek help.

 

[cafe]

I think its more prevalent that even diagnosis indicate, although I will also say that the medical profession seems to love any diagnosis that results in a prescription. But overall I think modern life and the transgression of ones authenticity out of fear, most likely puts a large proportion of the population genuinely into those conditions. Few people are living the life they really desire (not measuring in terms of money but in terms of what they would rather be doing with their lives). It's almost a given that once you reach adulthood you should put your personal interests into the occassional hobby category and get in with torturing yourself in an office job for the sake if money. The human equivalent of being a battery hen. That cant be good.

So much this.

I had nasty depression that mostly went away when we stopped being impoverished. Crazy how that works!

 

[Alea_iacta_est]

I think its actually to do with the amount of people that actually do have anxiety or depression disorders. I attribute it to the fast-paced civilization we live in today, to where if anybody falls behind, they are utterly lost and displaced. In today's society, there are all of these little events that are said to be "life-changing" and that if one were to miss those opportunities or mess up, then they would not be successful. Who wouldn't be anxious in a system like this? But it intensifies if the person in question already had above average anxiety levels. Depression follows the same route, if these crucial decisions or small events are performed poorly, then society has ingrained that those people are average citizens with nothing left to look forward to except the successes of others.

 

[prplchknz]

so basicallly, what we need to do is destroy society and build it from the ground up and make it more decent for people to do what they want to do.problem solved

 

[empertet]

I don't really believe in either (bar people who have been exceptionally screwed over), I think depression and anxiety are just manifestations of us continually having to pretend to be someone we're not. The root to this problem is usually having a job which isn't right for you (and that you can't leave), Continuous negative input from media, Being exposed to excessive light after dark (this causes the body to produce "wake-up" hormones up to 16 hours after exposure), Too much instant entertainment (the brain requires boredom to relax), Ready meals (Full of trans-fat, saturated fat and other things the human body isn't designed to regulate properly), excessive noise and light pollution (This is actually causing some birds to stress their vocal cords to reach 100dB [roughly one Jackhammer] just to be heard across streets), pollution (found to cause asthma, and believed to cause obesity [mice exposed to pollution produced more fat cells than those who where not exposed, despite both receiving the same amount of food]) and lastly- the one that we can't blame on other people or things we deem "beyond our personal control": EXERCISE. It's proven to reduce stress and anxiety (and in some cases rid people of both), yet we always try to make excuses not to at least give it a go.

I admit that I'm guilty of some of these , However I have recently started walking down the "natural" path (that's basically asking myself "What did we do about _____ before technology/convenience?", the answer is usually simple and effective: Eat better, eat less, do some yoga, avoid things you think are bad, enjoy silence etc. Since I started living more simply I've felt less stressed and as for anxiety? Well seeing more than 30 faces in a room still freaks me out but I've started to learn to ignore what I can't see, Just as long as it's not too loud I can cope without running off.

As a species we need to stop making things so easy (Unlike Parts of America, in England you're never more than 5-10 minutes away from a 24 hour shop), stop places other than emergency services being open past 3am, and learn that talking on a phone/computer doesn't equal socialising on ANY level. I view any message via technology as an informational exchange rather than true social interaction.

Sorry for the rant, if someone tl;dr's me I won't blame them!

 

[prplchknz]

I don't really believe in either (bar people who have been exceptionally screwed over), I think depression and anxiety are just manifestations of us continually having to pretend to be someone we're not. The root to this problem is usually having a job which isn't right for you (and that you can't leave), Continuous negative input from media, Being exposed to excessive light after dark (this causes the body to produce "wake-up" hormones up to 16 hours after exposure), Too much instant entertainment (the brain requires boredom to relax), Ready meals (Full of trans-fat, saturated fat and other things the human body isn't designed to regulate properly), excessive noise and light pollution (This is actually causing some birds to stress their vocal cords to reach 100dB [roughly one Jackhammer] just to be heard across streets), pollution (found to cause asthma, and believed to cause obesity [mice exposed to pollution produced more fat cells than those who where not exposed, despite both receiving the same amount of food]) and lastly- the one that we can't blame on other people or things we deem "beyond our personal control": EXERCISE. It's proven to reduce stress and anxiety (and in some cases rid people of both), yet we always try to make excuses not to at least give it a go.

I admit that I'm guilty of some of these , However I have recently started walking down the "natural" path (that's basically asking myself "What did we do about _____ before technology/convenience?", the answer is usually simple and effective: Eat better, eat less, do some yoga, avoid things you think are bad, enjoy silence etc. Since I started living more simply I've felt less stressed and as for anxiety? Well seeing more than 30 faces in a room still freaks me out but I've started to learn to ignore what I can't see, Just as long as it's not too loud I can cope without running off.

As a species we need to stop making things so easy (Unlike Parts of America, in England you're never more than 5-10 minutes away from a 24 hour shop), stop places other than emergency services being open past 3am, and learn that talking on a phone/computer doesn't equal socialising on ANY level. I view any message via technology as an informational exchange rather than true social interaction.

Sorry for the rant, if someone tl;dr's me I won't blame them!

for someone who has suffered from severe clinical depression I can say with out a doubt simply eating better and doing yoga doesn't take away the depression. I ask the oq because a lot of people who have been diagnosed with depression have been able to pretty much over come through life style changes. while there's a few people that life style changes do zilch. I guess it comes down to situational vs chemical. I can see situational not being over diagnosed, but I have my suspicions that chemical might be. JMO

 

[empertet]

for someone who has suffered from severe clinical depression I can say with out a doubt simply eating better and doing yoga doesn't take away the depression. I ask the oq because a lot of people who have been diagnosed with depression have been able to pretty much over come through life style changes. while there's a few people that life style changes do zilch. I guess it comes down to situational vs chemical. I can see situational not being over diagnosed, but I have my suspicions that chemical might be. JMO

I too have had severe depression (I was removed from high school for two and a half years after I made a slip-up and my mother had the misfortune to witness the bullying I had been putting up with since I was a child), and I concur, as I said "bar people who have been exceptionally screwed over" That depression is vastly different from more simple depression caused by vague feelings like loneliness, poor life quality and the feeling of just "lacking that something" I know both quite well and I (hope) I can tell which I have at any given time. The latter seems like lifestyle changes are key, the only cure for the former is to move where no one knows who you are and start fresh. :/

 

[prplchknz]

I too have had severe depression (I was removed from high school for two and a half years after I made a slip-up and my mother had the misfortune to witness the bullying I had been putting up with since I was a child), and I concur, as I said "bar people who have been exceptionally screwed over" That depression is vastly different from more simple depression caused by vague feelings like loneliness, poor life quality and the feeling of just "lacking that something" I know both quite well and I (hope) I can tell which I have at any given time. The latter seems like lifestyle changes are key, the only cure for the former is to move where no one knows who you are and start fresh. :/

really? because I did the whole geographical cure and it made it worse.also no offense, but if moving away took care of the depression for you, it sounds more like severe situational depression rather than severe chemical depression. for me the only thing that keeps depression at bay is taking a mood stabilizer, I've tried going off it a few times and even after the withdrawl had passed in 2-3 months I would end up suicidal. even though my situation hadn't changed and really wasn't that bad

 

[skylights]

I don't think it's overdiagnosed, but like you pointed out, prpl, there's a difference between a single episode and chronic. I do though remember learning in my Abnormal Psych class that of people who have had one depressive episode, about 80% of them will have two or more depressive episodes total in the course of their lives. So while some people may easily pull out of an episode, it is likely that they will fall into one again.

I think in general mental health is stigmatized and underdiagnosed, if anything, because of people's fears of how the diagnoses might impact their lives. To some extent this is understandable - the height of stupidity IMO is that in the US, a psychiatrist cannot be seen by another doctor for any mental health struggles or they are liable to lose their license to practice. While certainly their mental health should be taken into consideration when licensing, psychiatrists of all people should know that a mental health disorder does not necessarily equate to inability to perform one's job well.

[MENTION=20726]empertet[/MENTION] listed some good reasons we make ourselves more susceptible to unhealth in general, although also for the most part I seem to remember that most mental health disorders whose pathology is understood have at least a genetic component, if not a significant hereditary basis. Many seem to operate on the stress-diathesis (also called diathesis-stress) model, where environment can trigger genetic predisposition to mental health issues to be expressed. Alcoholism and schizophrenia are both believed to be disorders that work in that way: someone with alcoholic genes who regulates their drinking may never become alcoholic, while someone with schizophrenic genes whose home environment is stable may never become schizophrenic. Stressful events can also impact the timing of manic-depressive swings in bipolar disorder. So, environment can certainly play a large role in manifestation of an illness, and ironically the stigmatization of mental health makes it more likely that people will be more mentally unhealthy and not seek treatment.

Fortunately the historical trend is increasing acceptance so I am hoping that continues and I try in my life to be an advocate.

 

[empertet]

really? because I did the whole geographical cure and it made it worse.also no offense, but if moving away took care of the depression for you, it sounds more like severe situational depression rather than severe chemical depression. for me the only thing that keeps depression at bay is taking a mood stabilizer, I've tried going off it a few times and even after the withdrawl had passed in 2-3 months I would end up suicidal. even though my situation hadn't changed and really wasn't that bad

I suppose it depends on the original cause, do you even remember what started the spiral? I know I have difficulty remembering what starts mine one I've gone too far into the abyss .
It actually took a couple of years after moving to "clean out" my head. I needed rid of the reminders for long enough to come to terms with the past and clear out my head by accepting what happened and how I wont let it happen again. Unfortunately I still have yet to say the words "I trust you" and mean it (to a second person, one doesn't sound like enough).
I actually stopped trying to commit suicide as I could never do it right. I figured I deserved to live with the misery. :/

I won't lie, I'm kind of cheating by taking high doses of 5HTP and 6000iU of vitamin D to stabilise the dark thoughts. Once you've had a mental breakdown I think two things happen:
the first is that once you know that abyss you can never un-know it. (Pretty dark but I think it's true)
The second is that nothing really matters. But the second one is actually better than people think, sure saying "nothing I do really matters" sounds dark and depressive when you first look at it but it also holds a secret potential: Nothing I do matters, I'm free. Truly free. I don't have to worry any more because nothing I do matters so why would anything anyone else does matter either? I can do what I want because I've been though things far worse than what any single human can do to me now. I know the pain so I am above it.
I am bulletproof to insults and mockery. Only I have the right to judge me.

Sorry, went off on one :/
That's sleep deprivation for you...
Have you tried a more natural cure? Vit D, 5HTP, etc?
[MENTION=10496]skylights[/MENTION]: My sister is bipolar, (not on my side genetically) and I admit I tend to make sweeping generalisations (there are lots of asterisks I'm adding mentally as I go along XD), I completely blanked on genetic predisposition. Even so, for those genes to be passed on people have to want them. To me that says no amount of predisposition to genetic depression is truly severe enough to be hopeless or else those genes wouldn't be there in the first place? I'm also going to go out on a limb here and say that the brain always balances out: With great lows come great highs (you just have to get out and live a little to feel them).

 

[prplchknz]

yes that's exactly how mental illness works, you just have to will it out. yes I ultimately chose to be mentally ill.

btw i was dx schizoaffective but I was doing lots of drugs and recently went of my meds and the mood stuff kicked back up, but the psychosis and that stuff hasn't kicked back up, really.

 

[Totenkindly]

I think its actually to do with the amount of people that actually do have anxiety or depression disorders. I attribute it to the fast-paced civilization we live in today, to where if anybody falls behind, they are utterly lost and displaced. In today's society, there are all of these little events that are said to be "life-changing" and that if one were to miss those opportunities or mess up, then they would not be successful. Who wouldn't be anxious in a system like this? But it intensifies if the person in question already had above average anxiety levels. Depression follows the same route, if these crucial decisions or small events are performed poorly, then society has ingrained that those people are average citizens with nothing left to look forward to except the successes of others.

There are issues such as those, and also a loss (at least in Western civilization) of a cultural narrative where if you just do the right things and believe the right things and play your part, you will be taken care of and life will work out for you somehow. We've moved into the postmodern view, where there are not necessarily universal values and truths to guide us and there is not a reassurance that things will work out / something is watching over us.

I also do think there were depressed and anxious people before (due to people being jammed into the social structure regardless of whether they fit), but the cultural expectation was to not talk about it or face it squarely and accept it. So part of the glut of the depressed and anxious comes from it being underdiagosed or dismissed out of hand before. There was a time when it was embarrassing culturally to admit you were seeing a therapist and/or were clinically depressed (along with a host of other mental issues).

All that being said, I still think we haven't yet found that balance between anxieties/depressions that should be treated medically vs the typical natural stresses of life that can be compensated for by perserence and commitment. I think we have forgotten in today's culture that life sometimes does involve aches and pains, and how to distinguish between those types of natural pains (sometimes part of the growing process) vs the types of pains that are more serious and need readjustment and/or treatment.

 

[skylights]

[MENTION=10496]skylights[/MENTION]: My sister is bipolar, (not on my side genetically) and I admit I tend to make sweeping generalisations (there are lots of asterisks I'm adding mentally as I go along XD), I completely blanked on genetic predisposition. Even so, for those genes to be passed on people have to want them. To me that says no amount of predisposition to genetic depression is truly severe enough to be hopeless or else those genes wouldn't be there in the first place? I'm also going to go out on a limb here and say that the brain always balances out: With great lows come great highs (you just have to get out and live a little to feel them).

Well, what do you mean by hopeless? Certainly someone can have bipolar and with medication and environmental regulation can go far to improve the quality of their life. They may never be free of the condition, but at least one can hope to relegate it to a position where it is not controlling one's life. I don't think it's realistic to think that the average person can be completely rid of their disorders, but I absolutely do think everyone has the ability to live a fulfilling life regardless of their circumstances. Some are certainly more predisposed to struggle internally than others, but we have to deal with what we're given.

I don't know if it's true that for genes to be passed on people have to want them - I don't know that most people are really aware how genes work, short of really basic heredity, especially in less developed areas. That the person who passed on the genes was able to reproduce isn't really a guarantor of anything... the pregnancy may well have been completely unintentional...

Though I would agree that there is no predisposition that makes things hopeless - there is always hope.

 

[Randomnity]

hey guys - we're going to lock down the thread for now. Mods are still discussing it but for now I'll say that the forum is not an appropriate place to discuss mental health questions that need to be handled by professionals. While we understand that everyone's intentions are good, we feel that this kind of discussion causes more harm than good. You need to be talking to your therapist/psychiatrist/other mental health professionals about this stuff in person, not getting suggestions from regular people on the forum. We don't want to see scenarios where people are using the forum as a sounding board to avoid talking to professionals.

Discussing these kinds of things in the abstract is fine, and sharing personal experience is fine, but we would like to discourage personal advice/medication suggestions/"diagnoses"/etc involving serious mental health issues. We've been talking about adding a line to this effect in the FAQ and this thread has reminded us of that, so stay tuned. Thanks