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  1. #1
    Almöhi Stephano's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    4w3 so/sx

    Default Can you give me a description for INFP 5w4 sx/so?

    Hi there,
    I am looking for a description of INFP 5w4 sx/so. I typed myself as this and feel comfortable with it. But I'm still not sure if this fits me best. INFP is clearly the best one to describe my personality and i'm definitely a mix between Enneagram 4 and 5. Sx/so maybe fits, tough it could be something else. So, I am not that experienced with Enneagram types, therefore I need some help in making a description of the whole thing. Hope someone's going to help me


  2. #2
    Away with the fairies Southern Kross's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    4w5 so/sp


    You can't find one for that level of specificity. And I don't think I've found one description of any one of those types that's perfect either. You sort of have to take bits and pieces from a range of them.

    Here's some half decent descriptions. I hope they help:

    People with INFP preferences have a great deal of warmth, but may not show it until they know a person well. They keep their warm side inside, like a fur-lined coat. They are very faithful to duties and obligations related to ideas or people they care about. They take a very personal approach to life, judging everything by their inner ideals and personal values.

    They stick to their ideals with passionate conviction. Although their inner loyalties and ideals govern their lives, they find these hard to talk about. Their deepest feelings are seldom expressed; their inner tenderness is masked by a quiet reserve.

    In everyday matters they are tolerant, open-minded, understanding, flexible, and adaptable. But if their inner loyalties are threatened, they will not give an inch. Except for their work's sake, INFP have little wish to impress or dominate. The people they prize the most are those who take the time to understand their values and the goals they are working toward.

    Their main interest lies in seeing the possibilities beyond what is present, obvious, or known. They are twice as good when working at a job they believe in, since their feeling puts added energy behind their efforts. They want their work to contribute to something that matters to them--human understanding, happiness, or health. They want to have a purpose beyond their paycheck, no matter how big the check. They are perfectionists whenever they care deeply about something.

    INFPs are curious about new ideas and tend to have insight and long-range vision. Many are interested in books and language and are likely to have a gift of expression; with talent they may be excellent writers. They can be ingenious and persuasive on the subject of their enthusiasms, which are quiet but deep-rooted. They are often attracted to counseling, teaching, literature, art, science, or psychology.

    The problem for some INFPs is that they may feel such a contrast between their ideals and their actual accomplishments that they burden themselves with a sense of inadequacy. This can happen even when, objectively, they are being as effective as others. It is important for them to use their intuition to find ways to express their ideals; otherwise they will keep dreaming of the impossible and accomplish very little. If they find no channel for expressing their ideals, INFPs may become overly sensitive and vulnerable, with dwindling confidence in life and themselves.
    4w5s have a harsher edge than 4w3s and are the true outsiders of the enneagram. They tend to be more intellectual and introspective. They are more likely to philosophize their inner reality. Many 4w5s have an unflinching "this is me so deal with it" persona that's harder and crustier in comparison to 4w3s. They tend to be absurdly original or profoundly eclectic. Either way they have a more "take it or leave it" attitude and are more likely to direct a critical edge at others. Their persona serves more to redirect their shame away from their vulnerable self behind it in contrast to the 4w3 whose more shapeshifting persona facilitates relating to people. The more shame a 4w5 feels the more they implode, or in some cases amplify their persona as a countershame response. As a result 4w5s are more likely to present a more bizarre and even grotesque image in some instances that reflects their feelings of defectiveness combined with a fascination for the macabre that their five wing brings.

    4w5s have a great pride in staying "true to themselves no matter what" amidst what changes in the world around them. They accept being isolated from others and are personally invested in their self-image enough to stick with it through thick and thin. They are equally proud of suffering for their weirdness as paying the price for being who they are only makes them feel even more authentic about themselves. It illustrates how they are too complex to be understood by the unworthy who lack the perception to decode their many layers to understand the real them.

    Suffering for their internal self-image serves to reinforce their authenticity. The more they suffer for it the more they cling to their internal self-image and 4w5s wear their lack of compromise as a badge of honor for being true to themselves. "I'm completely true to myself and no one can take that from me." They mythologize their own personal tragedy. On the flip side being double-withdrawn they have less of a will to deal with the world and feel more overwhelmed by it. Despite seeking meaning in everything they are more likely to tend towards nihilism. Combine that with being even more true to themselves in response to their suffering and they become more and more disconnected from the world. In a self-destructive cycle the 4w5 holds his head high at never selling himself out like others, but ironically has little to nothing to show for it since he's actualized his identity with futile concepts that have no basis in reality. A feeling of hopelessness sets in and he withdraws from the world more permanently.
    5w4s are more fantastical [than 5w6s] and mythologize about how they aren't human. They are natural iconoclasts and disidentification is central to their self-image. Seeing things the normal way that everyone else does just seems "wrong" to them. They don't get as openly awed and apalled as their 5w6 siblings since worldly reality often pales in comparison to the reality of their internal experience. They are both more "cloaked" and also more emotionally immersing than 5w6s. They indulge in epic language to relive their feelings as anything less would seem too trite for the richness and significance of their internal experience. They tend to be less argumentative than 5w6s and would rather be convinced than convince others. They are more sociable and whimsical than 5w6s and want to show you there's more to them than meets the eye.

    The 5w4 inner landscape has a certain richness that's both a blessing and a curse. From being both in awe and terrified of just about everything they've contemplated their minds are anything but "normal" in the way they perceive things. They think they will always know more about others than others will ever know about them. They feel they are impossible to get to know and the most one can see is whatever persona they exhibit. Similar to core fours they transform this into their own brand of elitism.

    5w4s being iconoclasts force their way to the bottom of things to find meaning, safety with the known and familiar be damned. They have a "counter" mentality in how they focus on the undersides and opposites of things: "It was so dark it became light"..."that abhorrent yet fascinating person". Paradoxes, illusions, the twists and turns of fate, and unexplainable phenomena are representative of "something" that underlies and supercedes current reality and makes it richer. The unseen is more important than the seen. What is intangible matters more than what is tangible. What isn't obvious matters more than what is obvious. What is counterintuitive and fits is more aesthetic and elegant and therefore more significant than what is intuitive and fits. If the pieces fit when they shouldn't it's "anything but coincidental" and can be traced to something meaningful. When something is counterintuitive and makes sense it feels like a deep insight that was divinely revealed to them, a rare and special treasure that shows itself once in a blue moon. Something that's intuitive and makes sense is a dime a dozen that can only pale in comparison.

    5w4s tend to be more subjective than 5w6s. Their thinking process is less incremental and has more "illogical leaps". They search for that one angle of looking at things that magically makes everything make sense to them. They have a bias towards seeing underlying patterns that fit together aesthetically and elegantly as more real and therefore closer to the truth. They see a plethora of nonrandom things that just happen to line up towards a single conclusion as evidence of some "higher meaning" to support their conclusion, or even an indication of fate. Such a lining up of tells amidst random chaos couldn't be chance or random. There must be something there that isn't obvious but no less significant if not more so. This makes 5w4s more likely to see things that aren't there than miss things that are there. They tend to have occultic and esoteric areas of interest.

    Motivation: To impact others, question assumptions, challenge convention.

    This is the type that exudes the most raw charisma and sexual energy. They may identify so strongly with whatever they're involved with that they often become the symbol of its core essence, and sometimes its lead agent for change. Hardly content with the status quo, this subvariant seeks to alter the fundamental structure of something while at once embodying it's purest or most extreme form. Possibly attracted to radical views on politics, philosophy, spirituality or creativity that reflect their penchant for testing boundaries. They enjoy pushing other's buttons, especially those resistant to their modes of expression. It's not uncommon for them to have a pet social, political or spiritual cause which they're able to support with heartfelt conviction. May exploit and seek to redefine sexuality to reflect their own colorful and uncertain understanding of it. While prone to exhibitionism, they are strongly attracted to grounding influences which can anchor them and provide stability. Failure to satisfy an especially intense desire for connection may cause this subvariant to spite others at the risk of jeopardizing the need for an equal, stabilizing force. Can feel pulled between wanting a life of maximum intensity and reassuring episodes of peaceful convention.

    Energy: intense energy expressed outwards, assertively
    Mindset: "If I can maintain position and inclusion in the group/world, I can keep up and escalate all this merging/intensity."
    Blind spot: Likely to neglect their desire to build their sense of personal value, accomplishment, and security of place with others for the sake of their primary concern of seeking intense connections and experiences, in average-healthy levels. May not have an awareness of the body's need for food or sleep, or of the need to accumulate wealth for reasons of security, or of the need to manage time or resources to establish an orderly lifestyle.

    Examples of sx/so: Madonna, John Lennon, Yukio Mishima, Robin Williams, Drew Barrymore, Richard Simmons, Elvis, Bono, George Michael, Sinead O'Connor, Joan of Arc.
    You could also try talking to @Seymour. He's a INFP 5w4 and I think he's a Sx-first too.
    INFP 4w5 so/sp

    I've dreamt in my life dreams that have stayed with me ever after, and changed my ideas;
    they've gone through and through me, like wine through water, and altered the colour of my mind.

    - Emily Bronte

  3. #3
    Almöhi Stephano's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    4w3 so/sx


    Yes, the descriptions helped, thx a lot for the research. But 4w5 and 5w4 could both fit: That's my main problem. I'm going to take 5w4 because I identify myself more likely to be a 5 than a 4. Maybe I got a strong 4 wing since i'm not sure if 4w5 or 5w4 is my type.
    Instinctual variants: Im pretty sure that I'm not sp if it is right that they are more practically and not spontaneous. So it has to be some mix between sx and so.

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