Introverts and Praise

[wedekit]

Recently in my Conflicting Views in Psychology class we had to separate into teams and debate whether praise is harmful to children. All the members of the team I was placed on were introverts, and we had to argue "yes, it is harmful", which we had mixed feelings about.

First of all, we noticed that yes, some kids become "praise junkies" because they respond so strongly to the idea of getting a reward. The problem we had to argue about this was that praise in itself does not teach the value of good behavior, it just conditions the child to complete "good" tasks as a means to an end (not unlike training a dog). The most common way for parents to do this is to tell their child "good job!" every time they do anything the parent perceives as good. While this kind of praise is necessary for doing things like potty training your child, this in itself doesn't teach your child the value of being potty trained. We were all surprised that so many research studies favored this interpretation, mostly because this was never an issue for us as children. However, the other side argued valid counterpoints as well, but I don't wish to go into them because it doesn't have to deal with the topic of this post. (Note that I'm not arguing whether praise is harmful or not, I'm just giving you the context of the situation my teammates and I were in.)

As I have posted before (http://www.typologycentral.com/foru...580-biological-introversion-extraversion.html), the biological approach to personality works a lot with the idea of biological extraversion and introversion, which aligns nicely with the MBTI. What the approach says is that introverts are very sensitive to stimulation and are easily overstimulated while extraverts are easily under-stimulated. They have lots of research to support their theory. Because extraverts prefer stimulation, they respond well to rewards ("praise") and feel accomplished when they receive them. Introverts, on the other hand, do not respond well to rewards and often feel like they could have done better even after receiving them.

My team members and I began to discuss how all of us actually hated praise growing up and preferred to be more modest about our accomplishments. As a child I would hide all my good test grades or awards from my mom as much as I could because I hated how she made a big deal out of everything. Just recently I was elected as Vice President for our campus' Psi Chi chapter (which I admit is a big deal to some) but I didn't even tell her I was running, and I really don't plan on telling her I got it unless it comes up in a conversation. I remember being mad everytime my mom told me "good job!" when I tied my shoes. I simply wanted to learn on my own accord, and instead of her supporting me she felt a need to praise me. Support is unconditional and praise is conditional. I've noticed my ESFP little brother basks in this kind of praise that she gives, which is quite annoying to me.

So, I wanted to ask the other introverts out there what they think about this.
Did you fish for praise as a child?

 

[6sticks]

No.

 

[prplchknz]

I don't know it depends on what I'm getting praised for and whether or not I think I deserve praise. Like if I worked really hard then i get told it sucks I hate that but then when I get praised for a half ass job and I know it could have been better I hate that to, or when I don't feel the person is being sincere. In some ways it be easier not to receive praise but if the person is honest I like that. but I do like it better when the honesty is more comlimentary then insulting.


conclusion:1. I like honest praise over dishonest criticism
2.and I like honest criticism over dishonest critism
3.and dishonest praise over dishonest criticism
4.but I prefer honesty over dishonesty over all.
5. but if your going to lie to me make it a nice one.
6. I still can't decide if I like praise or not.

 

[Tallulah]

I must be a weird introvert, because I was kind of a praise junkie. But that could have something to do with my perfectionism and desire to excel. I really didn't need anyone to tell me where I needed to improve; I knew that all too well.

If I could change anything, I'd have my parents praise me less and instill in me that if I failed at something, it was okay, and I could just try again next time. I was so used to doing well at things and getting praise for them, that it would bum me out if I tried something and wasn't great at it. I'd just make a mental note that that was something I couldn't do, and move onto greener pastures. I see now that I should have just kept trying, and maybe lowered my personal expectations a bit.

 

[Atomic Fiend]

Nope, It took away from the achievment itself, and it made it seem like she(mom) was the only reason I accomplished anything.

 

[FFF]

I was thinking about an article by Alfie Kohn when I woke up this morning that said parents:rolli: shouldn't tell your kids "good job" for the reason you mentioned above. I happened to read this at the dentist's office, and later I emailed my mom to tell her I won't be needing any follow up treatment. She emailed me back saying "good job."

It's all about intrinsic and extrinsic motivation, and people are at their best when they're motivated by intrinsic motivation.

 

[Tallulah]

Isn't it all a matter of personal taste, though? Some feel like every "good job" is hollow, while others feel like if they're not getting positive feedback, they must be doing something wrong. Some aren't as good as others at determining when they actually have done a good job at a task. They'll just keep trying harder and harder, hitting their heads against a brick wall.

 

[colmena]

I can't remember. I use to attention seek a lot, and would be constantly getting lost. I expect praise is similar if not the same. And to be on topic; praise is a positive, productive and controlled way of giving a child attention.

There's a few child psychology programs on in the UK (House of Tiny Terrors and less so, Supernanny) where praise has a big role. But it comes across more as securing positive bonds between parent and child (as apposed to shouty negative bonds), with the value of right and wrong is put second place in the scheme of getting through life without a nervous twitch and lego shaped chip on the shoulder. But remember this is the children that are seemingly the devil incarnate.

As you alluded to, it probably has most to do with the requirement for stimulation in assessing Extraversion-Introversion trait. But do you think praise (presumably) through early development is the primary explanation for I/E?

 

[Seanan]

I don't respond to it in terms of inspiration. I never say to anyone "I'm proud of you" either. That would make their accomplishment all about me and place me in a position of importance that I don't relate to. I do, however, say "I'm happy for you."

 

[Kyrielle]

So, I wanted to ask the other introverts out there what they think about this.
Did you fish for praise as a child?

No. I didn't like being fawned over a lot by anyone, and I still don't like it. I did, however, need a lot of encouragement to keep going because I was always scared I would fail and disappoint everyone. Unfortunately, I was never taught that failure is just fine or that mistakes were just fine. Whenever I didn't do well my parents would be disappointed and a little upset with me, which upset me even more and made me terrified of failure. I was praised every time I did something "right" and always expected to "do my best" which, when combined, meant "be perfect."

What should have happened with me is I should have been simply told "thank you" or "not bad" when I did something right and then not heard another word about it. And if I did something incorrectly, I would be told what I had done wrong. I'm so used to that now with a few of my professors. They generally will just say "that's pretty good" and then critique me on my performance and tell me what I could have done better. It makes me feel like it's okay if I didn't do so hot, that I can always try again.

One odd thing I've discovered about myself is that if I'm directly and honestly told about something that isn't working, I'll be that much more determined to get over it so no one notices it ever again.

 

[disregard]

I've always loathed the concept of fishing for compliments. It's like, are you seriously trying to get me to unnaturally compliment you? Fuck off. When I was young, and now, if I did something I felt was worthy of praise, I would just say "Look what I did, isn't it GREAT! I KNOW!" That way, they can laugh at me if I obviously have nothing to be proud of, and they can laugh at me if I do.

 

[kelric]

If I could change anything, I'd have my parents praise me less and instill in me that if I failed at something, it was okay, and I could just try again next time. I was so used to doing well at things and getting praise for them, that it would bum me out if I tried something and wasn't great at it. I'd just make a mental note that that was something I couldn't do, and move onto greener pastures. I see now that I should have just kept trying, and maybe lowered my personal expectations a bit.

I was always scared I would fail and disappoint everyone. Unfortunately, I was never taught that failure is just fine or that mistakes were just fine. Whenever I didn't do well my parents would be disappointed and a little upset with me, which upset me even more and made me terrified of failure. I was praised every time I did something "right" and always expected to "do my best" which, when combined, meant "be perfect."

These both sound a lot like my childhood (and unfortunately, in some ways I still struggle with it sometimes). When I did something well, particularly something my parents held in high regard (school usually) it was all praise. When I didn't, there was little room for second chances, and I rarely was given any chance to explain. Teacher says that I'm "not doing homework"? (the issue was really that I was chatting in class when DONE with my work) - "that's it, we're making you quit the baseball team". Get a B+ in math in the 5th grade? (while at 7th grade level) - "we expect to see you with your math book at home every day, homework or no." C+ in 6th grade reading? Grounded for 9 weeks (excepting weekends). They knew exactly what they wanted from me, and they made sure that I turned into what they wanted - but sometimes I wonder what else I could have been, and I still struggle with expectations and fear of failure.

Bleh. That sounds overly harsh to my parents - they did what they thought was right, and I believe that their hearts were in the right place. But I'd have a hard time agreeing that it was the best way to handle a kid like me. It was *always* "do what you should" - not "what do you think?" End result? I agree that different kids handle these things different ways. My sister did much better with that kind of thing than I did.

 

[wedekit]

Nope, It took away from the achievment itself, and it made it seem like she(mom) was the only reason I accomplished anything.

I agree. My mom always made it sound like she had some kind of intimate involvement in my accomplishments when telling other people. I do stuff because I want to, not because I need some kind of reward telling me I did it right.

I was thinking about an article by Alfie Kohn when I woke up this morning that said parents:rolli: shouldn't tell your kids "good job" for the reason you mentioned above. I happened to read this at the dentist's office, and later I emailed my mom to tell her I won't be needing any follow up treatment. She emailed me back saying "good job."

It's all about intrinsic and extrinsic motivation, and people are at their best when they're motivated by intrinsic motivation.

Lol, that was the article we had to draw from. The opposing team used a rebuttal to his article, so they were at a big advantage. We ended up winning though.

Isn't it all a matter of personal taste, though? Some feel like every "good job" is hollow, while others feel like if they're not getting positive feedback, they must be doing something wrong. Some aren't as good as others at determining when they actually have done a good job at a task. They'll just keep trying harder and harder, hitting their heads against a brick wall.

Well, some would argue that children who feel like they are not doing a good job unless they receive "praise" have become dependent on it. Some assert that parents spend so much time rewarding their kids for behaviors that they fail to teach them the actual importance of the behavior. I can't even begin to describe the effect my mom's constant praise has had on my little brother. He now literally fishes for the praise by directly asking my mom for it. I've heard him (he's eleven years old, by the way) ask my mom this last year: "The ocean is blue... right mom?" He simply can't trust his own judgment; he relies on my mom's judgment instead.

I can't remember. I use to attention seek a lot, and would be constantly getting lost. I expect praise is similar if not the same. And to be on topic; praise is a positive, productive and controlled way of giving a child attention.

As you alluded to, it probably has most to do with the requirement for stimulation in assessing Extraversion-Introversion trait. But do you think praise (presumably) through early development is the primary explanation for I/E?

Well, you can divide praise into different types. Most people on the "yes" side propose a difference between "sincere praise" and "controlling praise". The best way to explain the difference is to just use examples:

Sincere Praise - "You made this card for me? Thank you so much!"
Controlling Praise - "Share your candy with your sister! ... Good job!"

The first is from authentic delight resulting from your child's actions, which in the process praises the child for their choice to do something. The second is you making your child do something and then rewarding them for doing it, which doesn't teach them why they should do it.

I don't think the amount of praise you receive determines your if you are I/E. Bio Psychologists have been able to predict I/E in young children and have found it remains fairly consistent throughout their life. I think your I/E affects how you respond to praise.

I don't respond to it in terms of inspiration. I never say to anyone "I'm proud of you" either. That would make their accomplishment all about me and place me in a position of importance that I don't relate to. I do, however, say "I'm happy for you."

I think this view is why the people on the "yes" side believe that praise is manipulative. The article we had to draw from concluded that if we are giving our child proper unconditional support, there is no need for us to tell them "good job".

 

[FFF]

I'm a big fan of Alfie Kohn's writngs. I wish I had more time to read his stuff.

I always wanted to look for video clips of him. Here's a funny one on punishment.

Alfie Kohn

 

[GZA]

I never liked praise or any kind of attention, although I'm a bit more used to it now so it doesn't bother me as much, but I still avoid it. I remember people once saw how shy I was for compliments and they reacted by WAAY overcompensating and singing me a song, and I hated it. I probably cried

Now I generally give a polite "thanks" for compliments but don't take them seriously. I don't want or need compliments to feel good about myself, I only want my own self-validation, and this is a pillar of strength for me. However, when someone gives me a sincere compliment about something I truely care about, I really appreciate it and I get really blushy, its quite embarrasing. And vice versa, if someone gives me a sincere criticism about something I care about, I evaluate it to see how I can improve. I have to be sure the compliment or criticism is sincere before I can react though.

 

[colmena]

Sincere Praise - "You made this card for me? Thank you so much!"
Controlling Praise - "Share your candy with your sister! ... Good job!"

I think this view is why the people on the "yes" side believe that praise is manipulative. The article we had to draw from concluded that if we are giving our child proper unconditional support, there is no need for us to tell them "good job".

' if we are giving our child proper unconditional support, there is no need for us to tell them "good job"'

This is idealistic. The punishment parallel conjures up images of the lax bohemian parent. Perhaps I'm cynical, and a parent will correct me, but I don't think young children will have the kind of moral framework where either sincere praise can be undermined or controlling praise is not of significant use. As I said, it's positive, bond-forming attention and generally behaviour reinforcement will make things easier. Perhaps it is even a requirement in order to learn moral etiquette beyond the potential of the homestead.

An interesting study (unsure of its formality) that'll probably harm my POV:

I remember seeing a Child of Our Time episode where they were looking at the children's relationships with their parents. The parent and child were each given ice-cream to eat. One of the children who lived with his paraplegic mother was the only one to share his ice-cream in the staged scenario of the mother dropping her ice-cream on the floor. Now despite the other children probably having been brought up on both forms of praise, they did not show such altruism, and continued to eat their ice-cream.

 

[mippus]

As a child, I had very little interest in praise. That changed later on, though...

 

[Ishida]

It's nice, but not a big deal. I don't give it out that much either, I wonder if that annoys people.

 

[bluebell]

I don't remember getting much praise for anything as a child. I tended to get straight A's but it was kinda treated by my parents as being the least they could expect of me (even though sometimes it was an effort to get those grades), and they didn't have the same expectations of my sister. I occasionally got a positive comment from a teacher or sports coach. The comments only meant something to me if it was about something very specific, otherwise I just dismissed the comments as worthless (because it felt kinda like the back-handed stuff I got from my parents) - but the comments I didn't dismiss, I treasured because they were very few and far between.

At work, I value feedback - positive or negative. The negative stuff stings a bit at the time, but I think about it and take it on board and change/learn new ways to do stuff if the comments are valid. What I dislike the most these days is zero feedback or insincerity. Insightful feedback ftw everytime - the more the better.

 

[mortabunt]

I don't like being fawned on, but I appreciate credit for something out of the ordinary I do.