Jealousy: It shows you care

[sammy]

No they're Japanese, she meant Hashshashin.

Funny, I was reading that wiki page around february time, I think. Those crazy shias. tsk tsk

I do like swords.

But I think if I pulled one out on a man who cheated or defiled my honor in some way as a way to intimidate, I'd still be viewed as a joke.

Anyway, I think showing a bit of jealousy is healthy for a relationship.

 

[Kasper]

Anyway, I think showing a bit of jealousy is healthy for a relationship.

In what way do you see it as healthy?

 

[LEGERdeMAIN]

read more about hassan i sabbah, i first read about him in science fiction novel.

i think showing a bit of jealousy is good too. i would never tolerate a woman flirting or talking to another man, must always wear burqa in public too.

 

[Sniffles]

Funny, I was reading that wiki page around february time, I think. Those crazy shias. tsk tsk

Yup. Although they did manage to successfully sneak into Saladin's camp several times and place daggers right next to his bed as a warning. So they did have some skill. Probably could break out some of the sources I have on them if you want.

Oh well - enough derailing this thread.

 

[Kasper]

You're drunk/drugged, right Marduk?

 

[sammy]

In what way do you see it as healthy?

When both people have a balance and similar idea of what they are comfortable with allowing and implementing that into practice. Not being hypocritical helps.

If the guy can't flirt with random girls, nor should the girl with random guys, etc.

Establish some boundaries so that people are on the same page.

 

[sammy]

You're drunk/drugged, right Marduk?

Yeah, he's learning what it's like to be loved by an ENTP. You know what that does to mortals!

 

[Kasper]

When both people have a balance and similar idea of what they are comfortable with allowing and implementing that into practice. Not being hypocritical helps.

If the guy can't flirt with random girls, nor should the girl with random guys, etc.

Establish some boundaries so that people are on the same page.

Sure, that's all fine, but what does setting consistent boundaries have to do with jealousy being healthy? Surely it's the boundaries and understanding of what is and isn't acceptable that's the healthy part?

 

[Kasper]

Yeah, he's learning what it's like to be loved by an ENTP. You know what that does to mortals!

Poor, poor man *shakes head sadly*

 

[Thalassa]

Sure, that's all fine, but what does setting consistent boundaries have to do with jealousy being healthy? Surely it's the boundaries and understanding of what is and isn't acceptable that's the healthy part?

Because some people are okay with it...as long as both parties are okay with it, and even see a bit of jealousy as a good thing...then these are healthy boundaries, the jealousy can be expressed in a healthy manner because they understand each other, and aren't going to do things to provoke one another, either.

Jealousy is a normal human emotion just like happiness, sadness, lust, anger, love, etc. and calling jealousy "bad" or "unhealthy" is really ridiculous, because emotions JUST ARE. It's what you choose to do with those emotions that makes all of the difference between a thinking person and one that doesn't think. It is BEHAVIOR not FEELINGS that make the situation healthy or unhealthy.

Jealousy is a symptom of desire, and I don't see the problem with it, especially in the early stages of a relationship where you're not yet totally sure of each other.

I guess some people do jealousy, and some don't. It's really ultimately up to the couple.

I think the point in which it becomes unhealthy is if it's excessive and unfounded, and begins to spiral into abusive behavior.

 

[Mole]

What is interesting are the more sophisticated uses of jealousy.

Such as deliberately making someone jealous.

This might be done for revenge.

Or it might be done to spice up a relationship.

Or it might be the pure manipulation of a narcissist or psychopath.

All these things are possible for jealousy is involuntary.

So if you can find what triggers someone's jealousy, you got 'em.

 

[21%]

Because some people are okay with it...as long as both parties are okay with it, and even see a bit of jealousy as a good thing...then these are healthy boundaries, the jealousy can be expressed in a healthy manner because they understand each other, and aren't going to do things to provoke one another, either.

Jealousy is a normal human emotion just like happiness, sadness, lust, anger, love, etc. and calling jealousy "bad" or "unhealthy" is really ridiculous, because emotions JUST ARE. It's what you choose to do with those emotions that makes all of the difference between a thinking person and one that doesn't think. It is BEHAVIOR not FEELINGS that make the situation healthy or unhealthy.

Very well said!

 

[Tradewind]

I may feel a tinge of jealousy but I just tell myself I have so much to offer.

But, if you do feel this in an established relationship its probably a sign of something bigger. This would tell me to lay the foundations of increased trust and to try to better meet my partners needs. It doesn't have to be a bad thing but it can be.

 

[JocktheMotie]

I'm part of the "a little jealousy is healthy" camp. Expressed jealousy, or perhaps, territorial protectiveness from her I find flattering because it's simply another way she shows I'm wanted and I am valuable to her. I think with any kind of emotion, there are healthy and unhealthy ranges along the spectrum, and it's up to you to decide what you will tolerate and accept.

For me, the presence of jealousy might trigger some introspection on my part to see if there's an insecurity anywhere, or something in my relationship not being satisfied. That's usually the only time I'm jealous in what I'd consider a destructive manner, but then it's useful because I can fix the problem.

 

[Randomnity]

I think no jealousy regardless of the actions I took would make me think they didn't care about monogamy. Jealousy (at healthy levels) can be sort of a sign for when things start to approach the line, I think. Or at least a sign that you don't like something about the situation, for whatever reason.

Shouldn't be a common presence though, in mundane situations or too strong.

 

[Arclight]

I generally don't get jealous and when I do, I tend to keep it to myself..

No wonder my relationships fail.

 

[gromit]

I'm part of the "a little jealousy is healthy" camp. Expressed jealousy, or perhaps, territorial protectiveness from her I find flattering because it's simply another way she shows I'm wanted and I am valuable to her. I think with any kind of emotion, there are healthy and unhealthy ranges along the spectrum, and it's up to you to decide what you will tolerate and accept.

For me, the presence of jealousy might trigger some introspection on my part to see if there's an insecurity anywhere, or something in my relationship not being satisfied. That's usually the only time I'm jealous in what I'd consider a destructive manner, but then it's useful because I can fix the problem.

I think no jealousy regardless of the actions I took would make me think they didn't care about monogamy. Jealousy (at healthy levels) can be sort of a sign for when things start to approach the line, I think. Or at least a sign that you don't like something about the situation, for whatever reason.

Shouldn't be a common presence though, in mundane situations or too strong.

I can see this. Jealousy as an indicator that something is wrong with the situation or to help spur introspection...

 

[Siúil a Rúin]

That I can appreciate, although I'd see it more as my partner stepping in to make it clear to the person attempting to hit on me that I'm not there alone like you said, sure I can tell them to rack off on my own but it seems like quite a number of would be flirters at bars don't believe you when you say you have a boyfriend, or don't care and proceed to sleaze all over you anyway, so him (or any male friend) getting in the picture expedites the departure of those who are only interested in conversation with benefits. I would only see jealousy being part of it if I was engaged in good conversation and he interrupted because he was insecure, not because I was uncomfortable. In your situation, well I say that's just gentlemanly (or whatever the female equivalent is when it's done the other way around).

Well said. I was starting to think people might be picturing a variety of behaviors and feelings when they use the word, "jealousy". The following are a variety of problems I could have with a complete lack of it from a partner, and the following represent different types of partners, but they are all at odds with the ideal that pure love - no jealousy:

Presumption - the ultra-confident partner who is sure they have you regardless of how invested they are in your well being or treatment. If they leave you lonely, still there is no worries about the attention of other men because they are so proud that their sense of self thwarts reality. The truth is it is normal for people to have times in their life when they feel lonely or unvalidated, even with a partner. Others see it and can move in. To feel there could never be a threat regardless of personal investment and behavior is unrealistic. To then take the position that the person would have to be trash to cheat on someone as fabulous as oneself is just more of that imaginary, irresponsible worldview.

Apathy - to be with a partner and simultaneously okay with the loss of that partner can imply a half investment in the relationship. A person might not feel jealousy because inside they aren't entirely invested or sure they want the responsibility of the relationship, but they also don't want to initiate change. In this way the relationship might continue or end without investment. This offers a way to somewhat enjoy the moments in the relationship but with minimal risk to self. Just don't get too attached and then there are no hassles of jealousy or hurt.

Denial - one can also live in a rosey world where any behavior or situation is free of threat and problem. There is no reason for jealousy because we have a perfect trusting relationship that is above and beyond those selfish problems. There is never a reason for a threat because love transcends everything and trust is bliss.

Every relationship can deteriorate if taken for granted. The problematic jealousy imposes that risk of loss onto reality when it isn't there. It is the partner who interrupts a conversation between platonic friends because they are sure of competition and loss. My question for the non-jealous types is how do you deal with it when there is a threat to the relationship? What about when you have been away for work for a year? Or when you have played golf every weekend for five years and haven't realized that your partner feels isolated and alone? What about the presumption that can take place that blinds people to their partner's emotional needs that someone else starts filling? How do you react when that partner tells you they feel isolated and others are paying attention which is confusing them? No jealousy? Then when it all falls apart it becomes easy to blame the estranged partner as being worthless because you "trusted" them and look at what a horrible person they turned out to be, etc.

 

[Tallulah]

Ooh, nice thoughts, toonia. I am interested to hear responses, too.

 

[Totenkindly]

(uggh, just lost my post -- oh well, here goes another shot)

Sticking just with the OP right here (although I'd like to see responses to Toonia's stuff!), I think a little bit of jealousy shows some sort of connection, and indifference is not necessarily good. If someone matters to you, their absence will feel like a loss to some degree. And jealousy seems to me to be tied to a sense of loss or, maybe more realistically, a fear of future loss.

I miss my kids when I am not with them because I love them, and I can be jealous if they spend all their time with their friends. And when I'm in a committed relationship, I miss my SO when they're not present... and if they consistently choose something other than me as the object of their affections, I'm going to feel jealousy on some level ... even if I can rationalize it and understand that what they are doing at the time is necessary. I firmly believe everyone should have the choice to come and go as they please in a relationship, you can't force someone to be with you or do what you want; but at the same time, I am not obligated to give more of my heart to someone than what part of their heart they give to me. So while you cannot shackle someone to your side, you can offer stipulations of what you're willing to invest and what you expect in return, and negotiate the expectations of the relationship.

Like Marm says, it's not necessarily the feeling but the behavior that is right or wrong. You can either respond to jealousy to control someone else or you can choose to free them and free yourself. I also think being apart is not a bad thing, because it gives both partners things to bring back to the table. I might have missed my kids when they went to school all day or went away for a week to camp or to visit friends, but it was enriching to the relationship when they brought back new ideas and experiences to share.

After ending a relationship recently, I was sort of surprised to experience jealousy when my ex told me about things he was doing with mutual friends of ours who happen to live closer to him than to me. Yet, at the same time, I was happy he was finding ways to fill his time and other relationships to be involved in, instead of floundering and feeling alone. I saw my feelings as more of a positive, since it meant I did actually care about him, missed him when he was gone, and valued what we had together even if we'd ended it. (Did I tell him about how I felt? No. I figured it was just something I needed to deal with right now.)