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[Type 4] Happiness for Enneagram Type 4 video!

hjgbujhghg

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I just watched this video and it was amazing! He really described a type 4 in such a great way and I can totally relate to everything he's saying.
 

OrangeAppled

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Some interesting points.

I admit I had a hard time getting through it because it emotional demonstrations were too cheesy & cliche. It made me cringe and I couldn't identify with that level of, er, shallow.
 

Tiltyred

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So, 4s are all bipolar? :D
 

Noll

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It was alright.
 

Amargith

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I recognise it, but it's not complete. It just outlines my worst moments ,and those don't feel right - I KNOW that I'm deceiving myself when I get that way. His solution does work, but its incredibly hard to do when you're already down and wallowing in self-pity. You need someone to help you out and believe in you or you need to find the energy to get angry at being in that situation in the first place. It's one of the reasons I have a knee-jerk reaction to always try and see a situation for the potential and opportunities it offers, even when it sucks, coz I know it'll just drag me down and it's not going to help me one bit.

And yes, his acting is a bit off at times :laugh:
 
B

brainheart

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Seems like an extrovert or an extroverted feeler. Overall, I'm going to say it's cool, but his way of dealing was different than mine. What helps me is to either a. detach and observe my feelings and in that detachment recognize that they are passing, that this has happened before and I will get through it again or b. go as deeply into my feelings as possible but express them through art. I think the second option works the best. It's tremendously cathartic and then I also have something to show for my pain.

I don't think feelings are so either/or: happy vs sad, for example. When at my best I'm feeling the scope and complexity of all feelings, and they are often mixed. I feel like I could explode with all that feel, but in a good way. This is when I love my life the most, when I am honoring feelings for what they are, truly and completely. I also feel like this is my strength, what I can give to others- helping them to recognize the importance of the full range of feeling (not just good or happy), and how this is what makes us human.
 

OrangeAppled

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Seems like an extrovert or an extroverted feeler. Overall, I'm going to say it's cool, but his way of dealing was different than mine. What helps me is to either a. detach and observe my feelings and in that detachment recognize that they are passing, that this has happened before and I will get through it again or b. go as deeply into my feelings as possible but express them through art. I think the second option works the best. It's tremendously cathartic and then I also have something to show for my pain.

I don't think feelings are so either/or: happy vs sad, for example. When at my best I'm feeling the scope and complexity of all feelings, and they are often mixed. I feel like I could explode with all that feel, but in a good way. This is when I love my life the most, when I am honoring feelings for what they are, truly and completely. I also feel like this is my strength, what I can give to others- helping them to recognize the importance of the full range of feeling (not just good or happy), and how this is what makes us human.

YES. Nuance of emotion is in such fine shades that there is no clear line between good & bad emotional feelings. I seem to experience more in terms of intensity, which is why "calm" (internally, I mean) can be something I don't particularly aim for, as it can register as bland or dead to me. I don't want to be upset or thrilled all the time either, but some kind of magical merging with reality, where I'm no longer alienated or disconnected. I agree that artistic/creative outlets are often the closest I can purposely create this for myself.

The video does touch on how 4s aren't seeking internal peace, but intense feeling, and I suppose it just uses very black & white examples to illustrate that point.
 

pinkgraffiti

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Some interesting points.

I admit I had a hard time getting through it because it emotional demonstrations were too cheesy & cliche. It made me cringe and I couldn't identify with that level of, er, shallow.

i showed it to my type4 girlfriend, she thought the same as you. but it is to be noted that he's a type 4, so no way he's talking without personal experience.
 

Chad of the OttomanEmpire

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Lots of thoughts.

- I thought his take was interesting, and that it comes from a co-4 reassures me.

- I wish he would have included a word on feeling rejected, like an outsider, and unable to be a "normal" human; feeling revolting and disgusting and all, but I suspect this guy was a 4w3 so the issues may not apply there. Still, this is the crux of the issue for me.

- I strongly identify with the "mission in life" phenomenon he describes more than I've identified with any other description of it--though I'd note that it doesn't have to be an artistic mission. I am very skillful with arts and aesthetics, but my own sense of destiny has revolved far more around exploring the world and its mysteries, traveling, building something great, and witnessing great (but unspecified) events in world history (for which the world news serves excellently).

- I remember the "original connection", though it's only as an adult that I became fully aware of this as an issue. I'm glad he brought that in, though, and connected it that way.

- I would have skipped the whole sobbing in the corner about how much my life sucks, though--no matter how bleak my despair, I've seldom been reduced to tears about my shitty life. Yes, I've pondered whether my useless life has been worth continuing, but that's been more of a general brooding than anything else. Moreover, it usually has to do with me being bored than actually having a shitty life. I kind of resent how his acting enforces the whole "all 4s are crybabies" thing, but that might just be me.

- What bothered me more than the acting, though, is the question of Why is the backdrop a Palestinian headscarf? It seems an odd choice.

OK, well I'm making this sound more critical than intended--I actually liked the video a lot, and it touched on the envy and longing in ways that most descriptions have not done for me. I give the OP thumbs up!

As a side note, I wonder if he is 7-fixed? He's making it sound like 4s should integrate to 7 rather than 1, and I am wondering if a 7-fix is why he finds that "gratefulness" work is beneficial? I can understand why other 4s might resent being told this--it's like, Sure, just change the subject here.

I have found, however, that it does help to use another fix--I've been at my best and most grateful undertaking entrepreneurial efforts, out struggling against the Real World, fighting for survival, and getting involved with community politics. These are the things that really have built self-esteem, and I don't think it's a coincidence that I have 8- and 6-fixes.

EDIT: While on this subject, I might as well add that I have found it beneficial to develop qualities of my other wing as well.

Just my thoughts.

PS--yes, I've been told I'm bipolar by my family. I disagree--this is just my emotional flow, and I've never seen the problem with it.
 

Standuble

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[MENTION=18576]Sanjuro[/MENTION] - The guy is a 4w3. He says so at the beginning of his e3 video. Btw did he remind anyone else of Dr. Brian Cox?

I thought the video was all right but I didn't finish it and I'm not sure that I should bother. A lot of the acting seemed a little superfluous, he could have sit still and explained without risking alienation. I suspect though that its an important area to him and part of the whole "acting" is the expression of something he really cares about/really enthusiastic about.

In regards to the above - I don't mind feeling calm (usually anyway. It can cause problems if I need to enthuse pure emotion into a creative outlet). I find you can still feel the emotion that exists in a state of calm and can still reflect, fantasise and dream whilst in this state (without the risk of intrustive thought). It is especially helpful if it involves a character of mine reflecting upon their situation or their world - especially if the place in question is a place with a great city which has now fallen silent e.g. the ruins of an ancient city.

The void aka when you feel "nothing" is the part I dislike. That point where you feel little and cannot dream or reflect. It's some food for thought if such a state is actually the embodiment of the meditative calm found in Eastern spirituality.
 

Galena

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Got halfway through. He vibes as a good guy, but I just can't.

Content-wise, he hits the main points but with a total lack of the questioning of his own affect that is central to my own experience of the type. This is what embarrasses me about his portrayal and quashes my suspension of disbelief. I've had some pretty desolate moments, but the metacognition never is swept away by the emotion (they can even play off each other). Consciousness itself is the act of questioning my own stories. People who don't do it appear 2D.

I also do not relate to longing for the joyful origin. The origin isn't defined by a particular feeling or intensity of feeling for me. What I'm after is understanding of myself, no matter what the tone. If the truth is joyful, so it is. If the truth is darker, I want it as much. If the truth is tepid, bring it. As long as the pieces all fit together, I'm ready for the experience of recieving it.
 

ayoitsStepho

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I also do not relate to longing for the joyful origin. The origin isn't defined by a particular feeling or intensity of feeling for me. What I'm after is understanding of myself, no matter what the tone. If the truth is joyful, so it is. If the truth is darker, I want it as much. If the truth is tepid, bring it. As long as the pieces all fit together, I'm ready for the experience of recieving it.

This is how I view it as well. The desire to just understand myself and then the things around me is what gets me going. Why have happiness if it's based off lies?
 

uumlau

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He seems to be describing moving through integration levels 4-9 as described by Riso/Hudson. He doesn't even begin to approach levels 1-3, where level 1 is realizing that trying to figure out "who you really are" is leading to creating false images of oneself to live up (or down) to. The reason why creative activity helps 4s connect to themselves is that when they do so, then for just a moment, they aren't trying to "discover" themselves, they are being themselves. The irony for 4s is that they refuse to be limited by being labeled, but spend most of their lives trying to effectively label themselves (but on their own terms, not others' terms!). 4s are classified as withdrawn precisely because of this high degree of introspection.

The "way out" is not finding that right emotion, as this guy says, or even discovering yourself, as others have suggested. The "way out" is by being yourself and watching what happens from there! Introspection is still OK, but just as it is true that the unexamined life is not worth living, it is also true that the unlived life is not worth examining.

(FWIW, this is the "way out" for all Enneagram types. The difference is that each type finds itself in a different hole to climb out of.)
 

Animal

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PS--yes, I've been told I'm bipolar by my family. I disagree--this is just my emotional flow, and I've never seen the problem with it.

Interesting, I was pre-emptively diagnosed as a possible Bipolar 2 by two different psychiatrists who changed their mind later, realizing I'm not bipolar at all, but they had considered it a possibility based on intense mood swings and changes in vitality and energy that can last for long periods.
 

Animal

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I watched the video. Mixed feelings but nothing that hasn't been said here.

I don't see myself as a victim. I was laughing my ass off at the part where he talked about "I love you so much" "Now I hate you" ... this is relatable, though I don't usually express either sentiment to the lover directly. As for returning to the feeling of joy... I definitely have those moments of connectedness but it's not what I'm chasing either. My creative work is a mirror in which I see myself, and ideally, I want others to see themselves in it, rather than seeing "me." This, to me, is connectedness. And I am never fulfilled because there's always more creative work to do, more projects or old projects to finish. The day I am content with my work is the day I'll lay down on my death bed like Yoda and peacefully fade away. The drive to express myself is what I live for and I don't see much else to make me feel like I'm living rather than surviving, aside from physical indulgences.
 

Chad of the OttomanEmpire

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Interesting, I was pre-emptively diagnosed as a possible Bipolar 2 by two different psychiatrists who changed their mind later, realizing I'm not bipolar at all, but they had considered it a possibility based on intense mood swings and changes in vitality and energy that can last for long periods.
Same. I lie around doing nothing for days on end, or I'm totally high energy and can't come to a stop. My moods are volatile and shift like every 15 seconds. For some reason, this alarms people.

It's got more to do with inertia and, I think, Ne, rather than an inherent problem. I'm not tormented by this, anyway...it's just the nature of the beast.
 

Animal

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Same. I lie around doing nothing for days on end, or I'm totally high energy and can't come to a stop. My moods are volatile and shift like every 15 seconds. For some reason, this alarms people.

It's got more to do with inertia and, I think, Ne, rather than an inherent problem. I'm not tormented by this, anyway...it's just the nature of the beast.
Same! I actually enjoy the shifts.
 

Tiltyred

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Ok, you won't believe this, but guess what. I've been diagnosed Bipolar.
 
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