[Type 4] INFJ 4s

[nightwatcher]

The conventional type theory formula for INFJs is INFJ=Ni primary + Fe auxiliary. But many INFJs are Enneagram 4’s and there is little Fe about 4, which is a mix of introverted feeling and introverted intuition. The INFJ 4 (or INFJ with heavy 4 wing) is a different kind of INFJ, the kind more likely to be described as “strange” and “mysterious” because they're dom functions are Ni and Fi rather than Ni and Fe like other INFJs. Using myself as an example, I’m either an INFJ or close to it because I score high in Fi on the functions test, which is about equal to my Te function, and which corresponds to my heavy 4 wing. My Fe score is the second to lowest. So if I’m an INFJ, it’s because of high Fi, not high Fe. This is very different from an INFJ who fits the convetional Ni + Fe formula, who I imagine would seem more like a “normal” person.

I’d like to know how INFJ 4s here score on their Fi/Fe functions.

 

[redacted]

Ni expressed through Fe can look a lot like Fi. but there is no such thing as an INFJ with Ni and Fi -- that would be INTJ...

enneagram type 4 makes sense for INFJs because Ni provides an individualistic stream of data that is acted out through Fe. Fe itself conforms to the feeling sentiments of the current environment, but since Ni dominates, the viewpoints expressed are often unique ways of viewing those feeling standards...

it does not take Fi to be individualistic.

 

[cascadeco]

I'm an INFJ type 4w5, and on functions tests my Fi has always been quite high. It does depend on the day I take it, but on a few occasions it was the highest function, followed by Ni. In fact the cognitive function test that is thrown around on this site the most has always typed me as INFP, with INFJ only once.

I am always striving for growth and self-actualization and all of that. And for a type 4, the self-actualization/individualist thing is our prime motivator. To try to achieve that self awareness, one does have to have a good grasp of Fi (and other cog. functions assist with that too).

But even if Fi is high for me now, it hasn't always been so. I think my Fi has only really become strong in the past 4 yrs or so -- I don't think I was terribly emotionally aware prior to that. I stifled all of it, and didn't readily recognize my own needs or desires. I'm consciously paying attention to my emotional state these days, and have more of a balance between the Fi/Fe (well, I think I do!), and because I'm focusing on the Fi stuff more, I'm positive that's why I'm testing the way I am.

I also think there's a distinction between Fi things that I recognize in myself, and personally think are strong, vs. dominant Fi in action. I think there's probably a large difference between the two -- the Fi I pay attention to and value within me, vs. Fi in someone who really has it as a backbone of their perceptions and approach to life.

 

[jackandthebeast]

Ni expressed through Fe can look a lot like Fi. but there is no such thing as an INFJ with Ni and Fi -- that would be INTJ...

Could you explain why Ni+Fi is INTJ? I haven't taken the socionics test yet, but I've tested close to the border on INFJ and INFP, and Ni and Fi are definitely my most used functions. How could Fe manifest itself as Fi? Wouldn't that make it Fi? Also if Ni and Fi were your first two functions, what would be the order for the other six? Thanks.

 

[jackandthebeast]

Wait, is it the socionics test that tells you the order of your cognitive processes? If not, what test does?

 

[redacted]

Could you explain why Ni+Fi is INTJ? I haven't taken the socionics test yet, but I've tested close to the border on INFJ and INFP, and Ni and Fi are definitely my most used functions. How could Fe manifest itself as Fi? Wouldn't that make it Fi? Also if Ni and Fi were your first two functions, what would be the order for the other six? Thanks.

An INTJ with Ni 1st and Fi 2nd would still act things out through Te. (Just like me, but with Ni 1st and Ti 2nd acting things out through Fe.)

Also, you can't trust processes tests to tell you the strength of your processes. You have to do your own research/introspection.

 

[527468]

This shit makes functions sound too limited, and you can be an INFJ with Fi and Fe tied. Not too accepted though.

 

[jackandthebeast]

I'm pretty sure my thought is internalized as well though. The only one I can't figure out is my Inferior Function. How do I determine if it's Si or Se? The descriptions online aren't a lot to go on since I don't use either that much.

 

[jackandthebeast]

Actually, I've been looking at the cognitive processes a lot these past several days, and I don't fit any of the patterns, per se. I developed both Ni and Fi extensively (at a young age), and Fe and Ne somewhat later and to a lesser degree. I also just realized that I am not very developed logically or sensually, although I do have the preferences of Ti and Si over Te and Se. I know I am not developed in these areas because I don't think linearly (I kind of jump from thought to thought- and this limits my capacity to express myself in both my speech and in my writing) and I also have poor short term memory when it comes to what actually took place in certain scenarios (while having strong long term memories of the significances and emotional values of certain events). My question is, since I began developing the processes for two separate patterns, and I guess am overdeveloped with regard to intuition and feeling, to what extent would I have the capacity to develop Ti and Si?
I know this is totally a matter of speculation, but for those who are well-read about the processes, I'm eager to hear your opinion.

 

[tony12]

its its really very constructive discussion

 

[BlackCat]

What I want to know is how is type 4 a mixture of Fi and Ni? Explain the INTP 4's... ISFJ 4's... ENFJ 4's etc.

 

[Little_Sticks]

If you want to use socionics then having Ni+Fe as the two strong conscious functions will give Ne+Fi as strong unconscious functions. Maybe some see this as a way of making everything broader to escape more mistakes than MBTI, but either way you get to make that choice.

 

[Reverie]

The conventional type theory formula for INFJs is INFJ=Ni primary + Fe auxiliary. But many INFJs are Enneagram 4’s and there is little Fe about 4, which is a mix of introverted feeling and introverted intuition. The INFJ 4 (or INFJ with heavy 4 wing) is a different kind of INFJ, the kind more likely to be described as “strange” and “mysterious” because they're dom functions are Ni and Fi rather than Ni and Fe like other INFJs. Using myself as an example, I’m either an INFJ or close to it because I score high in Fi on the functions test, which is about equal to my Te function, and which corresponds to my heavy 4 wing. My Fe score is the second to lowest. So if I’m an INFJ, it’s because of high Fi, not high Fe. This is very different from an INFJ who fits the convetional Ni + Fe formula, who I imagine would seem more like a “normal” person.

I’d like to know how INFJ 4s here score on their Fi/Fe functions.

My Ni and Ne are highest. Ni highest of all functions, then Fe and Fi, after that low Ti and Te, followed by very weak Se and no Si. I recently read an interesting post where the MBTI test was criticized for the questions measuring Fe not being so good...I wish I could remember where I read it...
I think it's pretty revealing to look at the proportions. INFJs are predominant Intuitives whereas INFPs are predominant feelers. Scoring mostly F followed by N and being an introvert I'd stick into the INFP pile, scoring high N reading with lower F and being an introvert it's the INFJ pile for you. It get's more confusing when you bring the judgey-perceivery thing into play as Ni is actually a perceiving function and Fi a judging function. The neatness of your sock drawer is no indication of either. The organization of your mind is probably more the key, INFJs being more like a huge filing system and INFPs an organic sprawly bush (someone put my analogies out of their misery... ;D ) but it's hard to compare minds.
I found it useful when figuring out my enneagram to delve into what is your primal fear. For me it was clear cut as I had a profound fear of not having an identity when I was a child. I don't know if MBTI and enneagram are compatible systems. Judging by the vast variety of MBTI types that are 4 I'd say no. I thing judging what your enneagram type is (or MBTI for that matter) is always best left to the individual because no stranger can tell what it looks like inside you and what your greatest fear is.

 

[Vasilisa]

I'd like to know how INFJ 4s here score on their Fi/Fe functions.

I relate most to INFJ 4w5, but I'm not married to any typological category, really. As far as how I "score" it varies quite a bit depending on the test, among other things.

Winter
Ni - 37.4
Fe - 33.5
Si - 29.5
Ne - 29.4
Ti - 28.5
Fi - 28.4
Te - 28.4
Se - 25.5

Spring
Ni - 39.9
Ne - 35.9
Fe - 31.1
Fi - 30
Si - 28.1
Te - 26.9
Ti - 25.7
Se - 22.8

Summer
Ni - 39.2
Fe - 36.6
Ne - 35.3
Fi - 33.4
Te - 30.2
Si - 26.6
Ti - 22.9
Se - 16

Your cognitive functions are, in order of preference:
Fe - Ne - Ni - Te - Si - Fi - Ti - Se​

(Fe) ||||||||||||||||||||||||| 11.91 very developed
(Ne) |||||||||||||||||||| 9.46 moderate
(Ni) ||||||||||||||||||| 8.95 moderate
(Te) |||||||||||||||||| 8.47 moderate
(Si) |||||||||||||| 6 moderate
(Fi) ||||||||||||| 5.79 moderate
(Ti) ||||||||||| 4.76 moderate
(Se) |||||| 2.03 poorly developed

Based on your cognitive functions, your type is most likely: INFJ
or Second Possibility: ENFJ
or Third Possibility: ENTJ​

Your cognitive functions are, in order of development:
Ni - Fe - Te - Fi - Si - Ti - Se - Ne

Introverted Intuition (Ni) |||||||||||||||||||||| 10.34 very developed
Extroverted Feeling (Fe) ||||||||||||||||||||| 9.91 very developed
Extroverted Thinking (Te) ||||||||||||||| 6.93 moderate
Introverted Feeling (Fi) ||||||||||||| 5.94 moderate
Introverted Sensation (Si) ||||||||||||| 5.93 moderate
Introverted Thinking (Ti) ||||||||||| 4.99 moderate
Extroverted Sensation (Se) ||| 0.57 low
Extroverted Intuition (Ne) || -0.24 poorly developed

Ne (Extroverted Intuition) (64%)
Ni (Introverted Intuition) (56%)
Ti (Introverted Thinking) (54%)
Fe (Extroverted Feeling) (53%)
Fi (Introverted Feeling) (53%)
Si (Introverted Sensing) (43%)
Te (Extroverted Thinking) (37%)
Se (Extroverted Sensing) (30%)

based on your results your type is likely - entp

Ni (Introverted Intuition) (58%)
Ne (Extroverted Intuition) (57%)
Fi (Introverted Feeling) (54%)
Fe (Extroverted Feeling) (48%)
Ti (Introverted Thinking) (47%)
Te (Extroverted Thinking) (45%)
Si (Introverted Sensing) (38%)
Se (Extroverted Sensing) (28%)

based on your results your type is likely - infj

 

[CuriousFeeling]

I'm an INFJ 4w5 with a heavy 5-wing. Usually my functional order varies between Ni-Fe-Te, Ni-Te-Fe, Ni-Fe-Ti, or in some tests I end up getting Ni-Fi-Te. Being involved with both the arts and sciences exacerbates type 4 creativity traits, I think. I have a tendency to romanticize theories, even though one shouldn't fall in love with hypotheses since they haven't been proven yet. I greatly enjoy music, composing and performance, as well as drawing, dance, a bit of acting, photography, and the like. I take science as an artform of its own, not only just studying it for the information, but seeing beauty in the theory. If anything, people that know me well know that I am a Romantic to the core, so the Type 4 traits work. Heavy 5-wing tends to give it a bit of the geek girl style to it.

 

[wildflower]

i am definitely an infj type 4 but i don't think i've ever taken a cognitive functions test. i also admit i don't really understand much of this cognitive functions stuff as i learned about type from kiersey and some mbti tests i have taken. i think i come at it a bit more holistically whereas the functions seem to parse it all into little bits. maybe this is why people change type so much on this site? i've wondered why i see that so often here. (btw, that isn't a criticism but just an observation.) so, i just took a test at similar minds and here are the results. i'll let you guys tell me what it all means.

Extroversion (46%) / Introversion (47%)

Sensation (24%) / Intuition (57%)

Thinking (48%) / Feeling (51%)


Te (Extroverted Thinking) (39%)
your valuation of / adherence to logic of external systems / hierarchies / methods

Ti (Introverted Thinking) (61%)
your valuation of / adherence to your own internally devised logic/rational

Ne (Extroverted Intuition) (55%)
your valuation of / tendency towards free association and creating with external stimuli

Ni (Introverted Intuition) (43%)
your valuation of / tendency towards internal/original free association and creativity

Se (Extroverted Sensing) (31%)
your valuation of / tendency to fully experience the world unfiltered, in the moment

Si (Introverted Sensing) (32%)
your valuation of / focus on internal sensations and reliving past moments

Fe (Extroverted Feeling) (49%)
your valuation of / adherence to external morals, ethics, traditions, customs, groups

Fi (Introverted Feeling) (49%)
your valuation of / adherence to the sanctity of your own feelings / ideals / sentiment

//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
based on your results your type is likely - intp

i find it weird that they didn't test for j/p and yet tell me i'm an intp which i can relate to on occasion but know i'm not.

 

[Elfboy]

- Maria Callas
- Prince
- Edgar Allen Poe
- Nathaniel Hawthorn

 

[Speed Gavroche]

- Prince

ISFP!

Type 4 INFJs:

4w3 so/sx Cate Blanchett http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XJvYyAxpmm4
4w5 so/sp Marylin Manson http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i3ue6JLPQLA
4w5 so/sp Iris Murdoch http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_-9fsZW_OZI

 

[SilkRoad]

It seems the majority of INFJs on this, and most, MBTI sites type as 4. I'm sure many are, but I've also expressed my thoughts here and there about how many may not be.

 

[Siúil a Rúin]

I'm either a 4w5 or 5w4. My highest function scores are Ni, Ne, Ti, and Fi. They are all at the high end of the spectrum, so my only extroverted function that makes a real showing is Ne. My Fe is moderately low on scores and in descriptions I'd have to say I don't have the regular sort of Fe. What Fe is to me is the ability to internalize emotions and thoughts from people outside myself. It isn't keeping track of social niceties, rules, and social structures or hierarchies. I'm lost with those skills and cope socially by smiling at people and not saying much besides a few compliments, listening to them and especially avoiding rude statements. I have a strong external component for empathy and responding to external emotional cues, but it is based on one individual at a time. Groups overwhelm me with too many emotional/cognitive cues so much that I had to quit teaching in a classroom setting and find employment where I could work with one at a time.

Parts of the E4 fit with me, and technically I might actually fit the category of "highly sensitive personality type", but I don't want that as my identity because even though I have heightened reactions to things, I feel I am tougher than average because of it. I take a medication to quiet nerve function because I tend to have chronic pain and anxiety, and I know I don't fit the "norm" for thinking and behavior, but I'm not sure how to describe what it is. My world is primarily internal, but it is a big world because I internalize everything I encounter, so it isn't like I just ignore or reject the external world and the people in it, but just have to process it inside in order to make sense of it.

Edit: this may be TMI, but I was recently having a conversation with an individual in the creative arts (well established and brought in to present) and he said that I seemed extremely inward like I was solely in my mind. He asked if I had a deeply subjective experience that influenced my work and thinking because he noticed something about my face being highly expressive. He also said I was "strange", but he meant it as a compliment and English was not his first language. He was an elderly man and extremely intuitive. It embarrassed me a little because it felt like my cover was blown. I think most people see me in a very conventional way because I am so quiet and don't try to shock or confuse, so it was a surprising feeling to have someone see through it and verbalize it to me.