[Type 4] Why Are So Many INFJs Type 4s?

[Opal Star]

I wonder why so many INFJs are Type 4s on the enneagram? Enneagram 4 seems very Fi. I expected more INFJs to be 1s, since many INFJs live up to the moralistic perfectionist that carries out their ideals. Why are INFJ 1s kind of rare (approximately 5-12% of INFJs).

 

[Morpeko]

I'm gonna say that a lot of them are probably mistyped, or typing as a strong fix.

 

[Frosty]

4s arent real.

a joke

no one kill me

 

[RadicalDoubt]

In general, 1 is considered to be one of the rarest types in the enneagram system statistically (at least by some sources; it's usually on the low end of things if I'm remembering correctly). With multiplicative probability, with INFJs also being one of the most uncommon enneatypes, the percent chance of finding a person who is both is somewhat low. If we are going by theory, while 1 is quite fitting of Ni's idealism, in general the competency types, which are inclined to devalue emotionality, are less likely to be feelers statistically, which would also push that number down.

With 4, everyone mistypes as a 4 somewhere down the line unless you really don't value individuality or are like... Drastically optimistic. Almost any type can and will mistype as a 4, but it is especially common for 6s, 9s, and 3s to mistype as 4 in particular and all three of those are incredibly common types among all mbti types (except for 9 being not super common among ExTJs and 3s not being super common among IxFPs maybe). Being a somewhat rarer type though, there is a bit of a tendency for 4s to relate to some of the core themes of 4 regardless of whether they are or not and they have often have the idealism characteristic of type 4.

 

[Red Memories]

I think when you read stereotypical descriptions of E4, many people will believe they are E4 if they value individuality or creativity in any way. If you understand the roots of E4, you'll likely find yourself mistyped.

 

[Indigo Rodent]

I wonder why so many INFJs are Type 4s on the enneagram? Enneagram 4 seems very Fi. I expected more INFJs to be 1s, since many INFJs live up to the moralistic perfectionist that carries out their ideals. Why are INFJ 1s kind of rare (approximately 5-12% of INFJs).

Why very Fi?

 

[Red Memories]

Why very Fi?

E4 is about authenticity, finding missing pieces internally, etc. and Fi is centralized focus into internal value systems and authenticity. So it seems to me that 4 is the more Fi heart type while 2 and 3 would be more Fe-like heart types. but of course any type can experience any tritype combination.

 

[Vendrah]

I wonder why so many INFJs are Type 4s on the enneagram? Enneagram 4 seems very Fi. I expected more INFJs to be 1s, since many INFJs live up to the moralistic perfectionist that carries out their ideals. Why are INFJ 1s kind of rare (approximately 5-12% of INFJs).

Ok, I may have an answer different than 'its just mistype', buuutttt... I don't know if it is worth the problems of sharing it =(.

 

[Red Memories]

Ok, I may have an answer different than 'its just mistype', buuutttt... I don't know if it is worth the problems of sharing it =(.

I wanna know your thoughttttsssssss

 

[Indigo Rodent]

E4 is about authenticity, finding missing pieces internally, etc. and Fi is centralized focus into internal value systems and authenticity. So it seems to me that 4 is the more Fi heart type while 2 and 3 would be more Fe-like heart types. but of course any type can experience any tritype combination.

E4 sounds more like a special snowflake type, though, than as expression of Fi. I think that E4 are more likely to be mistyped as Fi-doms, even when they are INTPs, ENTJs, INFJs, etc.

E1 type is about relation to authority in childhood - weak or overcritical authority.

E4 type is about alienation from ones parental figures. There's a lot of people on youtube LARPing INFPs and I think they E4s are just thinking they are Fi-doms because of relation with their parents.

The problem with enneagram tests is that results get heavily tainted by one's MBTI type, because it examines behaviour instead of core motivations.
There's a difference between experiencing despair and alienation because of living in corrupt environment and experiencing despair and alienation because of feeling different from parents later projected on all relationships in life.

Lots of supposed INFP E4s are thinkers that get mistyped as Fi-doms because they are tormented by their enneatype, including a ton of ENTJs and *NTPs.

 

[violet_crown]

Because of the horror of it all.

 

[indra]

 

[mancino]

First of all, you have the mistypes. INFJs are a difficult type to pin, and the simple math is against having a right MBTI-E.type combo. If you assume a 30% mistype in each system, you get only 49% of correct pairs; with 50% mistypes, correct pairs go down to just 25%. Looking at averages, that effect could be irrelevant, just a random blurring, scattering MBTI types across the Enneagram. Although I suspect there are common mistypes that repeat themselves systematically and skew the analysis.

Regardless of mistypes, about E4 being Fi, I could agree to some extent, but then you have to remember that INFJ are strong in Fi, it's just that it's a shadow function, but their strongest, even stronger than Fe, actually. It's just "shadowed" by Ni. You can easily see it by comparing INFJ's Ni vs INTJ's: the former is Ni dom with shadow Fi, the latter Ni dom with shadow Ti, a very different beast. Think about them as being Ni(Fi) dom vs Ni(Ti) dom and you'll see how much it matters.

The comments about emotions are spot-on. E4 are usually volatile and withdrawn, high in neuroticism in Big5. They are usually introverts; although can fake E in social situation, they are low energy and low enthusiasm in life in general, with a tendency to Borderline personality disorder. On the other hand, E1 are gut types: they are very concerned by social structures/hierarchies and power, and have the drive (read: urge) to foster change, lead by their moral vision, for the "good" they feel is right, in a healthy or unhealthy way. Very high in conscientiousness, probably not a clear introvert, with a tendency toward Obsessive-Compulsive personality disorder.

N is another tell-tale sign: INFJ are strongly N, not so much E1. E1 can be intelligent, but then in a thinking type fashion, especially Te; so, practical ordering of the world according to a preset scheme. I can see a INTJ there, but with strong Te, a sort of abstract ISTJ so to speak, not a speculative INTJ, strong in Ni, who is typically in E4-5-6 region. It's even less fitting for an INFJ.

INFJs are typically fond of art and beauty of any kind, for the sake of aesthetics, usually creative in some way, for self expression; E1 are all in for the "good", driven by the superego, not the self, which seldom equates to "beautiful".

So, INFJ - E1? Not really.

 

[Vendrah]

First of all, you have the mistypes. INFJs are a difficult type to pin, and the simple math is against having a right MBTI-E.type combo. If you assume a 30% mistype in each system, you get only 49% of correct pairs; with 50% mistypes, correct pairs go down to just 25%. Looking at averages, that effect could be irrelevant, just a random blurring, scattering MBTI types across the Enneagram. Although I suspect there are common mistypes that repeat themselves systematically and skew the analysis.

Regardless of mistypes, about E4 being Fi, I could agree to some extent, but then you have to remember that INFJ are strong in Fi, it's just that it's a shadow function, but their strongest, even stronger than Fe, actually. It's just "shadowed" by Ni. You can easily see it by comparing INFJ's Ni vs INTJ's: the former is Ni dom with shadow Fi, the latter Ni dom with shadow Ti, a very different beast. Think about them as being Ni(Fi) dom vs Ni(Ti) dom and you'll see how much it matters.

The comments about emotions are spot-on. E4 are usually volatile and withdrawn, high in neuroticism in Big5. They are usually introverts; although can fake E in social situation, they are low energy and low enthusiasm in life in general, with a tendency to Borderline personality disorder. On the other hand, E1 are gut types: they are very concerned by social structures/hierarchies and power, and have the drive (read: urge) to foster change, lead by their moral vision, for the "good" they feel is right, in a healthy or unhealthy way. Very high in conscientiousness, probably not a clear introvert, with a tendency toward Obsessive-Compulsive personality disorder.

N is another tell-tale sign: INFJ are strongly N, not so much E1. E1 can be intelligent, but then in a thinking type fashion, especially Te; so, practical ordering of the world according to a preset scheme. I can see a INTJ there, but with strong Te, a sort of abstract ISTJ so to speak, not a speculative INTJ, strong in Ni, who is typically in E4-5-6 region. It's even less fitting for an INFJ.

INFJs are typically fond of art and beauty of any kind, for the sake of aesthetics, usually creative in some way, for self expression; E1 are all in for the "good", driven by the superego, not the self, which seldom equates to "beautiful".

So, INFJ - E1? Not really.

I wouldn't explain it that way but that is a fine answer.

 

[Vendrah]

Since I had explained this on another thread, I should come here to give my answer.

If you just stop thinking about cognitive functions for a second, INFJ is Introverted, Intuitive, Feeler and Judger. Being Intuitive, Feeler, Introverted, does relates to 4 things like the 'romantic' part, the introspection part and some other aspects of type 4, but I am just answering in short. So, dichotomy speaking, understanding how Type 4 is the most common type for INFJs is easy when you think in terms of dichotomy, the explanation of cognitive function is way more complicated.

PS: There are some changes from countries and culture that does impact the enneagram and MBTI types combinations, although I have a really hard time imagining a context where 1 is the most common enneagram type for INFJs, that is highly unlikely specially taking into account that we have connections with 9 and 2 as well.