The Trouble with Typing (Tom Condon)

[Mal12345]

The Trouble with Typing

This article reminds me of the abuse leveled against type 3s back in the day. Even Don Riso wouldn't admit that he had a 3-wing.

Excerpt:

Try to imagine instead a therapist who describes his current group of clients this way: “I have two Germans, a Kenyan, a Chinese, not to mention the Vietnamese couple. It’s good; I always get along with Germans, and Kenyans are easy to change, too. Chinese baffle me, of course, but at least I don’t have any French clients – God, those people get on my nerves! Next week I start working with an Egyptian. Now that should be a challenge.”

 

[Starry]

You know, I'm actually a fan of Tom Condon but this is absurd. I almost feel like this article should be renamed "The Trouble with Tom Condon Acting Like More Than 1% of the World's Population Even Knows What the Enneagram Is Let Alone Gives a Shit About It"


Before we start talking about the abuse people suffer at the hands of "Enneagram Bigotry" (I can't even believe he used this phrase)... I would at the very least like to see the word 'Enneagram' recognized by spellcheck.

To suggest a label like "3w2" has the same recognition and significance as "Egyptian" or "Chinese" or hell...even "Leo" or "Virgo" for that matter is embarrassing.

 

[Mal12345]

You know, I'm actually a fan of Tom Condon but this is absurd. I almost feel like this article should be renamed "The Trouble with Tom Condon Acting Like More Than 1% of the World's Population Even Knows What the Enneagram Is Let Alone Gives a Shit About It"


Before we start talking about the abuse people suffer at the hands of "Enneagram Bigotry" (I can't even believe he used this phrase)... I would at the very least like to see the word 'Enneagram' recognized by spellcheck.

To suggest a label like "3w2" has the same recognition and significance as "Egyptian" or "Chinese" or hell...even "Leo" or "Virgo" for that matter is embarrassing.

Type 3s have been abused because they have been deemed shallow. It is, literally, as bad as being called an American.

 

[Starry]

Type 3s have been abused because they have been deemed shallow. It is, literally, as bad as being called an American.

I’m not sure if you are presenting this information... including the above claim straightforwardly in earnest or in an effort to make some other point...but it makes a mockery of people’s legitimate experiences with intolerance and hatred.

Just to be clear in what you are saying though...

As someone that has traveled all over the world I have been in 3 or 4 instances (that I am aware of) where in no uncertain terms my life was in danger for one reason and one reason only... I was forced to reveal my status as an American citizen. By either being required to handover my passport or in a couple of those...literally having my handbag ripped from my person and the contents including my passport dumped out onto the ground. I’ve been pushed...jabbed...robbed...ridiculed...even detained twice in jail cells with nothing...all of my stuff...my phone, money, water, snacks, etc. withheld from me because I was an American...period.

When you use the words “abuse” and “literally” above are you honestly attempting to suggest an e3 would be in the same danger?

 

[Mal12345]

I’m not sure if you are presenting this information... including the above claim straightforwardly in earnest or in an effort to make some other point...but it makes a mockery of people’s legitimate experiences with intolerance and hatred.

Just to be clear in what you are saying though...

As someone that has traveled all over the world I have been in 3 or 4 instances (that I am aware of) where in no uncertain terms my life was in danger for one reason and one reason only... I was forced to reveal my status as an American citizen. By either being required to handover my passport or in a couple of those...literally having my handbag ripped from my person and the contents including my passport dumped out onto the ground. I’ve been pushed...jabbed...robbed...ridiculed...even detained twice in jail cells with nothing...all of my stuff...my phone, money, water, snacks, etc. withheld from me because I was an American...period.

When you use the words “abuse” and “literally” above are you honestly attempting to suggest an e3 would be in the same danger?

If you're saying that type 3s haven't been cavity-searched before being let in the door to an enneagram convention, I agree there is no evidence of that. Was "abuse" too strong a word in comparison to your experiences? Absolutely? Have type 3s been, let's say, ridiculed for being shallow and conventional? Yes.

 

[Starry]

If you're saying that type 3s haven't been cavity-searched before being let in the door to an enneagram convention, I agree there is no evidence of that. Was "abuse" too strong a word in comparison to your experiences? Absolutely? Have type 3s been, let's say, ridiculed for being shallow and conventional? Yes.

I have a dream now of someday going to a seminar on the enneagram where only the 3s are cavity searched at the entrance.

 

[Yara the Corpse]

Wow, this is actually more revealing than actual enneagram descriptions.

I could very clearly type myself as 946 from this.

 

[Peter Deadpan]

Tom Condon is Mole, confirmed.

 

[rav3n]

Meh, his analogy sucks worse than a jet engine. Race and behaviour are distinct issues where Enneagram includes a substantial behavioural component.

I'd retitle the article to 'The Trouble with Tom Condon and Hasty Generalizations'.

 

[Bush]

That particular analogy's pretty bad, and it's too bad that it's sprinkled all throughout the article. Because aside from that, most of the article's pretty insightful. The Sorcerer's Apprentice analogy definitely holds: it's a great description of what "knowing just enough to be dangerous" looks like.

And he's basically cautioning against how a sorcerer's apprentice might use the system. The article's essentially another framing of the point "don't take type to the extreme," and more specifically "look at the individual first." Not that that's a bad thing, because it's describing that whole idea from yet another angle. It's nothing particularly new to 'veterans' well-versed in typology, but it's a decent read for newcomers.

 

[Population: 1]

How the hell do you effectively discriminate against enneagram types? Oh look behind his left ear Dan, it’ll say. Aha a 3! Get my gloves Jose.

 

[Mal12345]

I have a dream now of someday going to a seminar on the enneagram where only the 3s are cavity searched at the entrance.

As for what is abuse, and making comparisons between ridiculing type 3s and having your purse dumped out: there is a lady in this town who walks with a cane because her husband beat her so severely in the past. (They are still together.) So I guess "abuse" depends on your perspective.

 

[Starry]

As for what is abuse, and making comparisons between ridiculing type 3s and having your purse dumped out: there is a lady in this town who walks with a cane because her husband beat her so severely in the past. (They are still together.) So I guess "abuse" depends on your perspective.

Yah I didn’t understand that you were referring back to a microcosm.

 

[Bush]

How the hell do you effectively discriminate against enneagram types? Oh look behind his left ear Dan, it’ll say. Aha a 3! Get my gloves Jose.

Build it, and they will come.

You can't discriminate effectively, but God knows that people will try.

 

[Starry]

The interesting thing about this concept is I’ve personally seen...not bigotry that’s never going to be an appropriate comparison but perhaps some subtle type related prejudices... I’ve seen this the least with enneagram. Enneagram doesn’t let you get away with much as it is always pointing back to the elephant in your room you built an entire existence around not to see. Everyone else sees your elephant though. “Oh you have a difficult time with strong image types Starry? Well, let me show you why that is...come try to see this eyesore you’ve got in your entryway.”

It’s really humbling. It functions like a great equalizer...shoving us all onto the same boat where we belong. Like Pops...I’m not sure how bigotry would take its form.

 

[Starry]

Bush is right though assholes people will try

 

[cascadeco]

The interesting thing about this concept is I’ve personally seen...not bigotry that’s never going to be an appropriate comparison but perhaps some subtle type related prejudices... I’ve seen this the least with enneagram. Enneagram doesn’t let you get away with much as it is always pointing back to the elephant in your room you built an entire existence around not to see. Everyone else sees your elephant though. “Oh you have a difficult time with strong image types Starry? Well, let me show you why that is...come try to see this eyesore you’ve got in your entryway.”

It’s really humbling. It functions like a great equalizer...shoving us all onto the same boat where we belong. Like Pops...I’m not sure how bigotry would take its form.

This is definitely true about enneagram; if you really look into it, you realize how much all of the types equally suck. I don't think anyone who's 'properly' typed is really 'proud' of being said type, and usually I find all of the descriptions are fairly equally scathing in each types' struggles. I mean I guess there's the possibility of an individual glamorizing other types, that's true... but I would think that would point them to definitively NOT being those types they are glamorizing (I mean, for example, type 8 might sound really nice to me because they live a life that's opposite me and thus I might be envious or something about that and think it sounds way 'easier'... but ofc they have a whole different slew of issues).

 

[1487610420]

Do we have a "guess the above user's enneagram based on their username" thread yet?

 

[Peter Deadpan]

It's easy to discriminate based on subjective past experiences with particular types. I've caught myself doing this with people typed similarly to my ex-husband (basically, I've noticed an aversion to Social 3s). It's a knee-jerk reaction that takes a little effort to overcome.
In other words: It's human.

 

[1487610420]

It's easy to discriminate based on subjective past experiences with particular types. I've caught myself doing this with people typed similarly to my ex-husband (basically, I've noticed an aversion to Social 3s). It's a knee-jerk reaction that takes a little effort to overcome.
In other words: It's human.

fyp