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  1. #11
    Senior Member Spectre's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Deadpan View Post
    Have not gotten that impression at all.
    Hmmm perhaps we have different sources.

    I am thinking of two videos with Richard Rohr.
    YouTube
    YouTube

    In them he gives the impression that the 4w5 are unproductive narcissists and the 5w4 has some kind of virtue of leaping the gap to combine head and heart.
    In my opinion the 4w5 leaps over the gap just as well.
    Overall he talks very negative of both the 5 and the 4.
    Perhaps I have misinterpreted the videos...

  2. #12
    phallus impudicus
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spectre View Post
    Hmmm perhaps we have different sources.

    I am thinking of two videos with Richard Rohr.
    YouTube
    YouTube

    In them he gives the impression that the 4w5 are unproductive narcissists and the 5w4 has some kind of virtue of leaping the gap to combine head and heart.
    In my opinion the 4w5 leaps over the gap just as well.
    Overall he talks very negative of both the 5 and the 4.
    Perhaps I have misinterpreted the videos...
    That's an extremely black and white perspective.
    I think these two types are some of the most complex and pained people there are. Sure, they can be narcissistic as a coping mechanism, but I would hardly title them the most narcissistic of the Enneagram.
    I think self-contained is a better term. Withdrawn. Removed. Crippled, even.
    Yes, with 4 comes a certain superiority/inferiority complex, and both of these types can be unproductive potentially, but I'm not sure "unproductive narcissist" is the proper description.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Narcissism is a measure of health. As is productivity.

  3. #13
    Senior Member Spectre's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Deadpan View Post
    That's an extremely black and white perspective.
    I think these two types are some of the most complex and pained people there are
    . Sure, they can be narcissistic as a coping mechanism, but I would hardly title them the most narcissistic of the Enneagram.
    I think self-contained is a better term. Withdrawn. Removed. Crippled, even.
    Yes, with 4 comes a certain superiority/inferiority complex, and both of these types can be unproductive potentially, but I'm not sure "unproductive narcissist" is the proper description.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Narcissism is a measure of health. As is productivity.
    I absolutely agree with the bolded part.

    True, not everybody needs to be "jolly" figures, but - at least where I live - these words you use are not something positive by any stretch.
    Well at least if your looking for a job.

  4. #14
    Phase-shifted beam Coriolis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spectre View Post
    I am an enneagram 5w4 so I will comment on 5w6.
    They strike me as having an easier time fitting in and "playing the game" that is so important in society.
    On the negative side, they seem to be harder to get know deeply.
    I can't comment on the broader question, as I am not sure of the enneatypes of most people I know, so cannot compare. I can say as a 5w6 that we do tend to be hard to get to know, especially with any depth. We can be quite good at professional interactions, but once people have started to get to know each other, I suspect 5w4 are more willing to share on a personal level. As for "playing the game", it may be easier for us because we are better able to stay detached from the situation and avoid emotional investment.
    Three things cannot be long hidden: the sun, the moon, and the truth. ~ Buddha
    Likes Tilt, Spectre liked this post

  5. #15
    Complex paradigm Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spectre View Post
    4w5 seems to have a bad rep. Overall it seems one "should" not occupy the bottom of the enneagram like the 4w5 and 5w4 does. Although I have a feeling that the 4w5 gets more flak than the 5w4 for some reason. I wonder why that is.
    Drama and playing the "being different", people don't like that for the most part.
    While 5w4 is more like "whatever" around most people.

  6. #16

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    I have noticed that 1w9's are much "quieter" and to withold their opinions a lot more than us 1w2's. As a result they seem more prone to passive aggression.

  7. #17
    Senior Member Spectre's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Virtual ghost View Post
    Drama and playing the "being different", people don't like that for the most part.
    While 5w4 is more like "whatever" around most people.
    I think you are right.

    Come to think of it, I reckon the 5w4 comes across as indifferent often times.

  8. #18
    Senior Member deathwarmedup's Avatar
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    The 6w7s are just lighter and take themselves less seriously. More candid about their need for people. More about moving towards others to quell anxiety rather than self-isolating. They're not more phobic per se (that's a matter of stack; sp/so). They can be distinctly counterphobic.

  9. #19
    Senior Member misfortuneteller's Avatar
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    I am growing to really dislike 9w1s practically since the main enneagram 9 group is filled with them. I especially dislike how they try to deny their 1ness constantly when they constantly exhibit it. They probably don't see their covert holier than thou attitude as 1ness for some reason.
    Likes Luigi, notmyapples liked this post

  10. #20
    Member bundleofsunshine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spectre View Post
    4w5 seems to have a bad rep. Overall it seems one "should" not occupy the bottom of the enneagram like the 4w5 and 5w4 does. Although I have a feeling that the 4w5 gets more flak than the 5w4 for some reason. I wonder why that is.
    You must be trolling? 4w5s and 5w4s are the most overrated types on the internet. Countless 6s and 9s are posing as these types.

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