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  1. #21
    Diabolical Kasper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by great_bay View Post
    The noticeable trait about 9w8 and 9w1 is their growth wing. 8 grows into 2. 1 grows into 7. There is a huge differences due to the wings.
    Huh?

    I don't relate to 2 at all. I do have elements of 7 that work for me though.

  2. #22
    Diabolical Kasper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DoctorTypo View Post
    I don't care about being bad but I'm ENTP and thinkers usually don't have those feeler worries. If it means incompetence then no, it doesn't matter much to me and not NEARLY as much as being a wimp/in someone's control bothers me. Even when people try to help me, I hate being told what to do.

    Please elaborate on inward and outward rage. When I'm angry I go "fuck this guy, he doesn't understand what to do. Fuck my boss, he's a controlling shit that needs to die" etc. I don't blame myself ever. But sometimes I can be a bit insecure and wonder if I did something wrong. Like "why does this always happen to me? Ugh, wtf do I do wrong"
    It's not that w8s or 8s can't take blame, it's about vulnerability and protecting oneself imo, not giving over power to others; it could be abused if it was. Questioning if you're wrong is normal, if you are worried about revealing that to others then question why.

    Internal v external focus for 1 v 8 as I see it is about the motivators of the type, 8s are concerned with power, who has it, who may abuse it, they put attention towards protecting themselves and others, they prefer to have the power themselves. While 1s are more concerned with monitoring themselves, not making mistakes, being consistent to their values, they are focused on what they should do, what is right. One is primarily directed outwards monitoring others, the other is inward. This shows in how the anger manifests also.

    But I blame others always. Being wrong is okay lol, there's a next time for being right. Being controlled, especially in a hostile situation makes you a bitch

    Cause when you're wrong your only judge is yourself and I'm not hard on myself, ever. I'm self preservative and looking out for my best interest, but when you're in other people's control it's just hostile and gets on my nerves
    That sounds much more w8 than w1 to me.
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  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by DoctorTypo View Post
    Aren't comfort seeking 9w8s also nitpicky about comfort?
    No. Comfort seeking, yes. Nitpicky not so much. Nitpicky means to to criticize unnecessarily the little things. To criticize is to find fault, implying a right and wrong way. There's a superego quality here (wing 1). 9w8s are more grounded in contrast and don't feel a need to "social justice warrior" every little thing. Enneagram 8 is also part of the "power" triad, so it doesn't make sense for them to whine about things that bother them (they are doers/assertive types). That's probably why you don't see many 8s on forums. They don't have the patience to deal with the tediousness of online interaction. In short, to whine and complain is to relinquish power (antithetical to 8s) because by doing so, you are essentially handing over your livelihood (claiming a victim). It's what 5s and 8s have in common as "power" types.

  4. #24
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    9w8s have an easier time believing that they can prevail over others. 9w1s have an easier time believing that they can't....they're slower to start but harder to beat once they get their butt in gear.

  5. #25
    Junior Member pearslug's Avatar
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    I find that this description really nails it from my perspective (as a 9w1) but I don't know if you 9w8s can relate to your part? (lemme know :P)

    "9w8 is about calmness(nine) from a position of strength(eight). They choose to be calm as opposed to feeling they have to maintain being calm to avoid conflict or estrangement like a 9w1. They don't invite conflict but don't shy away from it either as they nip conflict in the bud as quickly as possible. They are the most "chill" of the instinctive triaders. They have the best balance in their personal boundaries as they are halfway in between being a doormat and dominating others. This is why they are generally the most likeable of all subtypes.

    9w8 is called the "comfort-seeker" and wants to make life easier for themselves. They are firmly grounded in their bodies with an emphasis on being physically comfortable. Hardly anything bothers them. They aren't nearly as hard on themselves as 9w1s. They are easygoing but can be direct with others if forced out of their comfort zone as they are much more assertive than their 9w1 siblings. While they have a bias towards letting things work out on their own they have no problem stepping in and settling things.

    9w8s have an ego in being grounded in reality. They pride themselves in being simple regular people. They take pleasure in noticing when there isn't any point to discussing something, often to the extent of exhibiting a "who cares" apathy. Asserting their self-importance certainly falls in that category. While they are realistic about themselves they have a tendency to be underestimated by others. Like eights they play down and trivialize what's not worth dwelling on as "no big deal". Not getting what they want is also declared "no big deal" and therefore not that important. They tend to be attracted to the outdoors and other physical activities. They mainly fear permanently losing loved ones.

    9w8s are more genial and practical. They are significantly less withdrawn than 9w1s. Although they are less intuitive than 9w1s, they have a natural sense of rhythm for the ebb and flow of things around them. They have an ability to make anyone like them even when they are being irreverent and mischevious. They have an "it's all good" attitude as nothing appears to bother them. In response to a prank they might go "nice one" whereas a 9w1 would initially seem dazed and taken aback before saying it's alright. 9w8s have an overt(eight) haze(nine) in comparison to the more repressed(one) haze(nine) of 9w1s. Like all 9s they have trouble expressing anger directly and become less focused when they do. Their 8 wing though makes them more able to blow off steam by expressing anger physically at least, like throwing stuff in fustration.


    9w1 is about keeping their inner peace(nine) intact(one). They avoid conflict externally and the reality of that conflict internally. They see conflict as an endless web of which any path could lead to estrangement so they hold their anger inside. They suppress their rough edges and conceal disagreeableness to seem accomodating. They have trouble saying no gracefully: "what do you mean?"..."answer to what?"..."I'm flattered you asked but I'll have to think about that as I have something else I gotta do"..."me participating would likely make no difference so you'd be better off asking someone else". They may also feel emotionally unsafe wanting something that's counter to the wants of the people around them. They'll either be wishy-washy and try to change the subject or find a way to go along while feeling they were sucked in. Basically they trade their comfort for others' comfort and hope and assume that by ignoring conflict they will maintain their emotional tranquility. To a 9w1 hope and assume are often close enough to be interchangeable. If they are in a safe and comfortable enviornment they can better explore disagreement.

    9w1s are sensitive and self-effacing as well as gentle and loving. While they have issues with expressing anger they can also feel crippled with anxiety. They suppress or ignore their wants due to fear. They "cocoon" under stress and their "positive outlook" is a defense against a deep-seated belief of an inability to have an influence or impact. The delayed anger responses from 9w1s result from an excessive buildup of intense long-term anxiety that never got dealt with. They are much harder on themselves than 9w8s. They are very sensitive to criticism because they take it as a judgement on them as people. This is why praise can have such a positive effect on them. The key is to try to relieve their anxiety directly and then anger issues will resolve themselves.

    9w1s have an "ego in having no ego", as opposed to the 9w8 ego in being able to be apathetic to what's pointless. They can be unusually intuitive and cerebral as well as creative and fantastical. They have a knack for synthesizing various theories and viewpoints. Sometimes they can seem like 4s and 5s except they idealize "flow" and don't take things to the same extremes. It's tough to narrow down the possibilities and discriminate the way they see everything as interconnected. They feel ambivalent and out of touch with what their instincts tell them. They repress and ignore negative urges in themselves but get fustrated with those who disturb the peace. In response to being disturbed themselves they might initially be taken aback or dazed and then say everything is okay.

    9w1s are high-minded types who idealize peace, harmony, healing, and union with others. They mainly fear being seperated from loved ones and on some level they feel like they don't matter as a distinctly seperate person. "United we stand divided we fall" resonates with them because on a deeper level seperation is equivalent to annihilation. They dream about formlessness as the perfect reality, where one is freed from struggles of the ego and anything else that detracts from fluidity. They feel drawn to being connected with the vastness and beauty of nature and are attracted to things like large bodies of water and celestial entities in the sky. The Way of the Tao is very 9w1, as are other eastern philosophies that aspire to a formless and egoless nirvana. "The answer will come to you in time my son" wiseman archetype is also very 9w1. In such a reality unnecessary details, pain, and anxiety are either drowned out or work themselves out on their own."
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  6. #26
    Upside-Down Rainbow Maya Dawn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pearslug View Post
    I find that this description really nails it from my perspective (as a 9w1) but I don't know if you 9w8s can relate to your part? (lemme know :P)

    "9w8 is about calmness(nine) from a position of strength(eight). They choose to be calm as opposed to feeling they have to maintain being calm to avoid conflict or estrangement like a 9w1. They don't invite conflict but don't shy away from it either as they nip conflict in the bud as quickly as possible. They are the most "chill" of the instinctive triaders. They have the best balance in their personal boundaries as they are halfway in between being a doormat and dominating others. This is why they are generally the most likeable of all subtypes.

    9w8 is called the "comfort-seeker" and wants to make life easier for themselves. They are firmly grounded in their bodies with an emphasis on being physically comfortable. Hardly anything bothers them. They aren't nearly as hard on themselves as 9w1s. They are easygoing but can be direct with others if forced out of their comfort zone as they are much more assertive than their 9w1 siblings. While they have a bias towards letting things work out on their own they have no problem stepping in and settling things.

    9w8s have an ego in being grounded in reality. They pride themselves in being simple regular people. They take pleasure in noticing when there isn't any point to discussing something, often to the extent of exhibiting a "who cares" apathy. Asserting their self-importance certainly falls in that category. While they are realistic about themselves they have a tendency to be underestimated by others. Like eights they play down and trivialize what's not worth dwelling on as "no big deal". Not getting what they want is also declared "no big deal" and therefore not that important. They tend to be attracted to the outdoors and other physical activities. They mainly fear permanently losing loved ones.

    9w8s are more genial and practical. They are significantly less withdrawn than 9w1s. Although they are less intuitive than 9w1s, they have a natural sense of rhythm for the ebb and flow of things around them. They have an ability to make anyone like them even when they are being irreverent and mischevious. They have an "it's all good" attitude as nothing appears to bother them. In response to a prank they might go "nice one" whereas a 9w1 would initially seem dazed and taken aback before saying it's alright. 9w8s have an overt(eight) haze(nine) in comparison to the more repressed(one) haze(nine) of 9w1s. Like all 9s they have trouble expressing anger directly and become less focused when they do. Their 8 wing though makes them more able to blow off steam by expressing anger physically at least, like throwing stuff in fustration.


    9w1 is about keeping their inner peace(nine) intact(one). They avoid conflict externally and the reality of that conflict internally. They see conflict as an endless web of which any path could lead to estrangement so they hold their anger inside. They suppress their rough edges and conceal disagreeableness to seem accomodating. They have trouble saying no gracefully: "what do you mean?"..."answer to what?"..."I'm flattered you asked but I'll have to think about that as I have something else I gotta do"..."me participating would likely make no difference so you'd be better off asking someone else". They may also feel emotionally unsafe wanting something that's counter to the wants of the people around them. They'll either be wishy-washy and try to change the subject or find a way to go along while feeling they were sucked in. Basically they trade their comfort for others' comfort and hope and assume that by ignoring conflict they will maintain their emotional tranquility. To a 9w1 hope and assume are often close enough to be interchangeable. If they are in a safe and comfortable enviornment they can better explore disagreement.

    9w1s are sensitive and self-effacing as well as gentle and loving. While they have issues with expressing anger they can also feel crippled with anxiety. They suppress or ignore their wants due to fear. They "cocoon" under stress and their "positive outlook" is a defense against a deep-seated belief of an inability to have an influence or impact. The delayed anger responses from 9w1s result from an excessive buildup of intense long-term anxiety that never got dealt with. They are much harder on themselves than 9w8s. They are very sensitive to criticism because they take it as a judgement on them as people. This is why praise can have such a positive effect on them. The key is to try to relieve their anxiety directly and then anger issues will resolve themselves.

    9w1s have an "ego in having no ego", as opposed to the 9w8 ego in being able to be apathetic to what's pointless. They can be unusually intuitive and cerebral as well as creative and fantastical. They have a knack for synthesizing various theories and viewpoints. Sometimes they can seem like 4s and 5s except they idealize "flow" and don't take things to the same extremes. It's tough to narrow down the possibilities and discriminate the way they see everything as interconnected. They feel ambivalent and out of touch with what their instincts tell them. They repress and ignore negative urges in themselves but get fustrated with those who disturb the peace. In response to being disturbed themselves they might initially be taken aback or dazed and then say everything is okay.

    9w1s are high-minded types who idealize peace, harmony, healing, and union with others. They mainly fear being seperated from loved ones and on some level they feel like they don't matter as a distinctly seperate person. "United we stand divided we fall" resonates with them because on a deeper level seperation is equivalent to annihilation. They dream about formlessness as the perfect reality, where one is freed from struggles of the ego and anything else that detracts from fluidity. They feel drawn to being connected with the vastness and beauty of nature and are attracted to things like large bodies of water and celestial entities in the sky. The Way of the Tao is very 9w1, as are other eastern philosophies that aspire to a formless and egoless nirvana. "The answer will come to you in time my son" wiseman archetype is also very 9w1. In such a reality unnecessary details, pain, and anxiety are either drowned out or work themselves out on their own."
    ... Wow. That was beautiful.
    “The world breaks everyone, then some become strong at the broken places.” ~Ernest Hemingway

    Johari: https://kevan.org/johari?name=~MS*ANGEL~
    Nohari: https://kevan.org/nohari?name=~MS*ANGEL~

    Quote Originally Posted by Nijntje View Post
    "And then, raising my lids slowly and looking out from underneath my lashes, i captured him with my eyes"

  7. #27
    Junior Member pearslug's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Morning Star View Post
    ... Wow. That was beautiful.
    I know but I didn't write it
    Likes Maya Dawn liked this post

  8. #28
    Diabolical Kasper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pearslug View Post
    I don't know if you 9w8s can relate to your part? (lemme know :P)

    "9w8 is about calmness(nine) from a position of strength(eight). They choose to be calm as opposed to feeling they have to maintain being calm to avoid conflict or estrangement like a 9w1. They don't invite conflict but don't shy away from it either as they nip conflict in the bud as quickly as possible. They are the most "chill" of the instinctive triaders. They have the best balance in their personal boundaries as they are halfway in between being a doormat and dominating others. This is why they are generally the most likeable of all subtypes.

    9w8 is called the "comfort-seeker" and wants to make life easier for themselves. They are firmly grounded in their bodies with an emphasis on being physically comfortable. Hardly anything bothers them. They aren't nearly as hard on themselves as 9w1s. They are easygoing but can be direct with others if forced out of their comfort zone as they are much more assertive than their 9w1 siblings. While they have a bias towards letting things work out on their own they have no problem stepping in and settling things.

    9w8s have an ego in being grounded in reality. They pride themselves in being simple regular people. They take pleasure in noticing when there isn't any point to discussing something, often to the extent of exhibiting a "who cares" apathy. Asserting their self-importance certainly falls in that category. While they are realistic about themselves they have a tendency to be underestimated by others. Like eights they play down and trivialize what's not worth dwelling on as "no big deal". Not getting what they want is also declared "no big deal" and therefore not that important. They tend to be attracted to the outdoors and other physical activities. They mainly fear permanently losing loved ones.

    9w8s are more genial and practical. They are significantly less withdrawn than 9w1s. Although they are less intuitive than 9w1s, they have a natural sense of rhythm for the ebb and flow of things around them. They have an ability to make anyone like them even when they are being irreverent and mischevious. They have an "it's all good" attitude as nothing appears to bother them. In response to a prank they might go "nice one" whereas a 9w1 would initially seem dazed and taken aback before saying it's alright. 9w8s have an overt(eight) haze(nine) in comparison to the more repressed(one) haze(nine) of 9w1s. Like all 9s they have trouble expressing anger directly and become less focused when they do. Their 8 wing though makes them more able to blow off steam by expressing anger physically at least, like throwing stuff in fustration.
    For the most part I do.

    Like this part the most: "they are halfway in between being a doormat and dominating others", too true for me, I'm an apathetic power freak.
    Likes pearslug liked this post

  9. #29

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    Quote Originally Posted by pearslug View Post
    I find that this description really nails it from my perspective (as a 9w1) but I don't know if you 9w8s can relate to your part? (lemme know :P)

    "9w8 is about calmness(nine) from a position of strength(eight). They choose to be calm as opposed to feeling they have to maintain being calm to avoid conflict or estrangement like a 9w1. They don't invite conflict but don't shy away from it either as they nip conflict in the bud as quickly as possible. They are the most "chill" of the instinctive triaders. They have the best balance in their personal boundaries as they are halfway in between being a doormat and dominating others. This is why they are generally the most likeable of all subtypes.

    9w8 is called the "comfort-seeker" and wants to make life easier for themselves. They are firmly grounded in their bodies with an emphasis on being physically comfortable. Hardly anything bothers them. They aren't nearly as hard on themselves as 9w1s. They are easygoing but can be direct with others if forced out of their comfort zone as they are much more assertive than their 9w1 siblings. While they have a bias towards letting things work out on their own they have no problem stepping in and settling things.

    9w8s have an ego in being grounded in reality. They pride themselves in being simple regular people. They take pleasure in noticing when there isn't any point to discussing something, often to the extent of exhibiting a "who cares" apathy. Asserting their self-importance certainly falls in that category. While they are realistic about themselves they have a tendency to be underestimated by others. Like eights they play down and trivialize what's not worth dwelling on as "no big deal". Not getting what they want is also declared "no big deal" and therefore not that important. They tend to be attracted to the outdoors and other physical activities. They mainly fear permanently losing loved ones.

    9w8s are more genial and practical. They are significantly less withdrawn than 9w1s. Although they are less intuitive than 9w1s, they have a natural sense of rhythm for the ebb and flow of things around them. They have an ability to make anyone like them even when they are being irreverent and mischevious. They have an "it's all good" attitude as nothing appears to bother them. In response to a prank they might go "nice one" whereas a 9w1 would initially seem dazed and taken aback before saying it's alright. 9w8s have an overt(eight) haze(nine) in comparison to the more repressed(one) haze(nine) of 9w1s. Like all 9s they have trouble expressing anger directly and become less focused when they do. Their 8 wing though makes them more able to blow off steam by expressing anger physically at least, like throwing stuff in fustration.

    Yeah, I can relate to all of that.
    Likes pearslug liked this post

  10. #30
    Senior Member ceecee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pearslug View Post
    I find that this description really nails it from my perspective (as a 9w1) but I don't know if you 9w8s can relate to your part? (lemme know :P)

    "9w8 is about calmness(nine) from a position of strength(eight). They choose to be calm as opposed to feeling they have to maintain being calm to avoid conflict or estrangement like a 9w1. They don't invite conflict but don't shy away from it either as they nip conflict in the bud as quickly as possible. They are the most "chill" of the instinctive triaders. They have the best balance in their personal boundaries as they are halfway in between being a doormat and dominating others. This is why they are generally the most likeable of all subtypes.

    9w8 is called the "comfort-seeker" and wants to make life easier for themselves. They are firmly grounded in their bodies with an emphasis on being physically comfortable. Hardly anything bothers them. They aren't nearly as hard on themselves as 9w1s. They are easygoing but can be direct with others if forced out of their comfort zone as they are much more assertive than their 9w1 siblings. While they have a bias towards letting things work out on their own they have no problem stepping in and settling things.

    9w8s have an ego in being grounded in reality. They pride themselves in being simple regular people. They take pleasure in noticing when there isn't any point to discussing something, often to the extent of exhibiting a "who cares" apathy. Asserting their self-importance certainly falls in that category. While they are realistic about themselves they have a tendency to be underestimated by others. Like eights they play down and trivialize what's not worth dwelling on as "no big deal". Not getting what they want is also declared "no big deal" and therefore not that important. They tend to be attracted to the outdoors and other physical activities. They mainly fear permanently losing loved ones.

    9w8s are more genial and practical. They are significantly less withdrawn than 9w1s. Although they are less intuitive than 9w1s, they have a natural sense of rhythm for the ebb and flow of things around them. They have an ability to make anyone like them even when they are being irreverent and mischevious. They have an "it's all good" attitude as nothing appears to bother them. In response to a prank they might go "nice one" whereas a 9w1 would initially seem dazed and taken aback before saying it's alright. 9w8s have an overt(eight) haze(nine) in comparison to the more repressed(one) haze(nine) of 9w1s. Like all 9s they have trouble expressing anger directly and become less focused when they do. Their 8 wing though makes them more able to blow off steam by expressing anger physically at least, like throwing stuff in fustration.
    Besides throwing stuff in frustration (but he does other, physical things that accomplishes the same), I would agree that my 9w8 is much like this.
    I like to rock n' roll all night and *part* of every day. I usually have errands... I can only rock from like 1-3.
    Likes pearslug liked this post

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