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[Traditional Enneagram] You know you're a type 9 when...

Cygnus

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Feb 10, 2014
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Oh, ok. I can see that. omg, I was just about to tell you that you seem like an Ne-dom, no joke! Are you sure you're an ESFp, then? I'd be inclined to guess along the lines of ENTP. :shrug:
Really? What about Ti do you hate? You come off as a thinker to me, btw. :thinking:


I've been on the internet long enough to recognize what Ti really looks like. It sickens me. Ti isn't about theory or subjective logic. Ti is about order. Ti is about beating down the individual out of his happiness and forcing him to comply with the "greater order." Ti is nihilistic and cynical.

In my experiences, ENTPs are dull, nihilistic, boring bitches who whine about Rick Perry and eat hot pockets. Every time I've tried to interact with ENTPs, they've shoved me away for being too annoying.


DJA's ESFP description resonates much more than the ENTP.
The impression this video gave is that the "gruff," "hardass" stereotypes typically associated with ESTP, but really more characteristic of ESFP, give the impression of belonging to Ti, when, in reality, they belong to Se. This would support my speculations on MBTI forum descriptions of Fi, that altruistic elements of Fi are feigned, mainly by NFPs, to bolster their egoes, creating an incorrect perception of what Fi really is. In other words, Fi can still be a dick if it feels like it, but Se gives you the tools for the job.



My kinesthetic unawareness may point to weak Se, but Socionics expressly addresses this:
the16types said:
Se as leading function in SLE (ESTp; Zhukov) and SEE (ESFp; Napoleon) - this person is very self-confident in his abilities, believes that he can do everything. Often makes an impression of a willful person: "what I consider to be right, is right for everyone" [translator's note: quite possibly this results from Ji-creative and not dominant Se since this behavior can be observed in IxEs as well]. Makes an impression of a volitional man - he seems to never have enough space around him, "like a bull in a china shop." If he is endowed with physical strength and stamina, he detests "wimps"; if the opposite and he turned out to be weak then considers all stronger men to be "goons". Often good at handling money, but in this issue can be either too conservative or too cocky. Life is perceived through the prism of power: "who is over whom". To be heard by him, you have to make yourself be respected. Any weakness is seen as a deficiency, so often he can use it to his advantage not seeing anything wrong by it. They are constantly doing something, developing some skills. Usually, their strength is visible to the naked eye, but it is lacking in flexibility, rather it is something monumental and conservative. Always try to be first in any enterprise, and if it doesn't turn out this way this angers them greatly. If their strength and ability are questioned, it may lead to an outbreak of aggression. Potentially - great athletes, but the constant over-evaluation of own abilities is fraught with possible injuries. Preaches the gospel of power and abilities, confident in own external appearance. Asserts his own uniqueness, originality. Sees no need to get someone's approval for a particular action; implements his solutions a very self-confident manner. Does not hesitate to use force anywhere. Grows angry and irritated if someone has contradicted him and this is usually visible outwardly. Sometimes, he first falls into irritation, and then only afterwards he understands something of what has been said to him. Listens out the opinion of someone else only when he couldn't accomplish something himself or that person is seen as having authority in his eyes. Loves extreme situations as this is a way to prove to himself that he is, he exists. In addition, this makes it easier for him to get approval from society for his actions. First, they'll do something, and only later understand what they had done. Person of action, agency. Inclined towards philosophy of overcoming or at least coping, of victory at all costs "could topple a bear - you're a man." Prefers to win over the opposite sex, to take by siege like a fortress. With this always sure that everything depends only on himself, his power, his capabilities. Hence becomes extremely irritated when he realizes that he has not achieved his goal. His weakest point is inability to understand that in life not everything depends on him alone. Therefore, if such a person does not achieve success in life, he grows very frustrated because at heart he considers himself a failure. Very sure that he looks and dresses well. Find it hard to be in a situation where nothing can be done, nothing can be changed, to be placed in "limbo", to just wait for the right moment for action, not "blurt out" everything at once. They are always accompanied by restless activity, by workaholism. Not a minute without action, which means sometimes the incapacity to stop and think. If there is a pause, then it has to get filled. If they are talking, immediately come up topics of problems and action.
 

Entropic

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Aug 20, 2012
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MBTI Type
INTJ
Enneagram
8w9
Instinctual Variant
sx/so
So E9 is just not caring about anything? Seriously want to know, because that seems odd. Being more cynical than me could just be due to mbti type. Just a thought. I actually nicknamed an INTJ friend of mine (well, former friend) cynical (no joke). She was not happy. lol I'm not claiming to be an E9 here, either. I'm just saying I could see the possibility (to clear that up for everyone). I made this thread to see if peope relate to what I had to say (& it's fine that you don't), & for them to state E9 traits that they relate to & exhibit.

No, 9 is defined by its inner apathy and lack of motivation. And no, the cynicism isn't related to mbti. Cynicism is more related to enneagram.

The thing is that few to not traits that you listed are actually exemplary of 9. Cygnus breakdown from the perspective of what 9 is about is honestly very accurate. The only thing that you mentioned that even remotely seemed like 9 was the out of sight and out of mind comment, but then again it probably applies even more to 7 than 9.

9 is situated in the body triad so it's focused on action and doing but I don't see you emphasizing anything in relation to the body triad, nor do I see you emphasizing the hidden anger that is hidden in 9s a and the need and desire to be unaffected.
 

Doctor Cringelord

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Aug 27, 2013
Messages
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MBTI Type
I
Enneagram
9w8
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sp/sx
If a Nine read it and it wasn't trash, she might take more vested interest in the information. If a Nine got her ego bruised from this -- no true Nine has an ego.


In the context of this dispute, a Nine would give more value to the actual, objective information being presented, than to the context of its presentation.

yes

I've recently realized I totally fucking hate Ti.

wha?

Really? What about Ti do you hate? You come off as a thinker to me, btw. :thinking:

I think Cygnus is ENFP, just my two cents. I'm usually wrong though.
 

DreamBeliever

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No, 9 is defined by its inner apathy and lack of motivation. And no, the cynicism isn't related to mbti. Cynicism is more related to enneagram.

The thing is that few to not traits that you listed are actually exemplary of 9. Cygnus breakdown from the perspective of what 9 is about is honestly very accurate. The only thing that you mentioned that even remotely seemed like 9 was the out of sight and out of mind comment, but then again it probably applies even more to 7 than 9.

9 is situated in the body triad so it's focused on action and doing but I don't see you emphasizing anything in relation to the body triad, nor do I see you emphasizing the hidden anger that is hidden in 9s a and the need and desire to be unaffected.

Well, Cygnus actually just said the out of sight, out of mind comment just meant I was lazy. I mean, I can't be too lazy if I graduated high school with a 3.6 gpa while taking honors & AP classes, & I'm neat & clean by my ESTJ & ISFJ grandparents standards. lol I can see how it would relate to type 7, though. Kind of that 7 escapism, right?
 

Doctor Cringelord

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I feel it varies? But that makes no sense, right? lol

Makes a lot of sense, actually. People are either

a) complex and multifaceted, meaning they might see reflections of themselves in more than one type
b) approaching type systems from the wrong angles.
 

uumlau

Happy Dancer
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Feb 9, 2010
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MBTI Type
INTJ
Enneagram
953
Instinctual Variant
sp/so
I feel it varies? But that makes no sense, right? lol

People new to typology tend to have two problems that make it difficult for them to identify their type(s).

1) Lack of self-awareness. We tend to take "self-awareness" for granted, but most people aren't very self aware at all.
2) Lack of understanding of what the typology means.

I suspect you're having both problems.

Instead of trying to find your type by brute force, it's often best to just expose yourself to the typology community(ies) and gradually absorb the knowledge. Eventually, your type will become self evident as you see how the various types play out in other people.
 

wolfy

awsm
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Jun 30, 2008
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What is all this thread s!#it about? I think I am a 9w8. I think I am a nine because that was the feedback I got and it fit best.
 

Chrysanthea

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This might not be a type nine thing but (being a highschool student) I tend to ignore any assignments that I feel overwhelmed by, and convince myself that it won't really affect my grade. Consequently... I have D's in the classes with lots of work, and all A's in the ones with little to none. I think I am proud of my 3.0 gpa considering how little effort and time I put into school.
 

DreamBeliever

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This might not be a type nine thing but (being a highschool student) I tend to ignore any assignments that I feel overwhelmed by, and convince myself that it won't really affect my grade. Consequently... I have D's in the classes with lots of work, and all A's in the ones with little to none. I think I am proud of my 3.0 gpa considering how little effort and time I put into school.

Now this sounds like me at college!
 

hjgbujhghg

I am
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This might not be a type nine thing but (being a highschool student) I tend to ignore any assignments that I feel overwhelmed by, and convince myself that it won't really affect my grade. Consequently... I have D's in the classes with lots of work, and all A's in the ones with little to none. I think I am proud of my 3.0 gpa considering how little effort and time I put into school.

this is exactly what I used to do at highschool and stool do at college :D
 

Frosty

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When something bad happens and you just keep waiting for the emotional bomb to drop, and then being glad when it never really does.

Feeling uncomfortably torn in multiple directions when people fight, especially those closest to you, instinctively trying to stop it. After a while, becoming so good at it that you stop arguments that are probably even healthy.


What dreambeliever said about apologizing is sort of the opposite for me though, I am much more inclined to apologize than I am to demand them from others. An apology demanded seems insincere, and sort of desperate on the part of whoever is demanding it. I dislike having strings attached to my actions, and apologizing to me seems to be more about the other person than yourself. Bit of an overly romanticized notion maybe. I can smell the bullshit from self soothing, fluffed up, evasively suggestive, crap a mile away, and it is absolutely awful. Why bother. Just my possibly overly romanticized opinion. Though occasionally, I might bend to the appeal. Not sure if this is a 9 thing.
 

DreamBeliever

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When something bad happens and you just keep waiting for the emotional bomb to drop, and then being glad when it never really does.

Feeling uncomfortably torn in multiple directions when people fight, especially those closest to you, instinctively trying to stop it. After a while, becoming so good at it that you stop arguments that are probably even healthy.


What dreambeliever said about apologizing is sort of the opposite for me though, I am much more inclined to apologize than I am to demand them from others. An apology demanded seems insincere, and sort of desperate on the part of whoever is demanding it. I dislike having strings attached to my actions, and apologizing to me seems to be more about the other person than yourself. Bit of an overly romanticized notion maybe. I can smell the bullshit from self soothing, fluffed up, evasively suggestive, crap a mile away, and it is absolutely awful. Why bother. Just my possibly overly romanticized opinion. Though occasionally, I might bend to the appeal. Not sure if this is a 9 thing.

No, no. You must have misunderstood that. I agree with you on apologizing. It wasn't me that I said demands apologizes, it was my friends saying I should. I disagreed, because I thought it would be more awkward. The situation would be kind of hard to explain, but I hope you get my point. I hate having to do forced apologizes myself too, because they are insincere, so there's no reason for me to demand them for others. People come around when they come around. That's how I look at it.
 

Frosty

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No, no. You must have misunderstood that. I agree with you on apologizing. It wasn't me that I said demands apologizes, it was my friends saying I should. I disagreed, because I thought it would be more awkward. The situation would be kind of hard to explain, but I hope you get my point. I hate having to do forced apologizes myself too, because they are insincere, so there's no reason for me to demand them for others. People come around when they come around. That's how I look at it.

Ah ok, totally forgot exactly what you said and didn't bother to look. Yes, I could see where demanding an apology would be awkward, and I have been in the situation where someone has told me that I had been mistreated or that I should 'bitch someone out'-which to me just seems to be about the biggest waste of time and energy i the world.

I think that people generally are stupid(not overall, but oftentimes confict is started from some sort of misunderstanding), they say stupid things for stupid reasons, and trying to work with stupidity, especially angry stupidity, is like trying to start a fire in a in the middle of a storm:fighting fire with fire:yada yada yada. Just a waste of time and energy on both ends- at the end of the day it is escalating something that never really even registered with me or offended me in the first place.

Actually though the situation of friends trying to force me to actively confront someone is generally more awkward to me than the act in and of itself. It is almost a, should I be offended, was something beyond what I understood meant, do I realy care about this-if I let this go could this continue or escalate, is it better to nip this in the bud now-when do I start to care, need to prevent that from happening/becoming emotionally devestated


If I can confront someone in a calm, even toned manner then I have no issue doing that, I can be pretty direct if I really want or care enough to be- but add strong, impossible to placate, emotions and I chchchchoke.

I agree with the whole when people come around they come around thing, but generally I will throw out an olive branch. But I am too proud to beg, and stubbornness towards an apology is more of a bad reflection on the other person than anything to me. It is what it is at that point, though I generally do not think I actively hold it against the person. Usually things are not that emotionally important to me. People are fickle and complicated creatures at the end of the day with many things to offer, and to hold something like that against them to an extent where I miss out on their perspective doesn't make sense to me, so it is hard to really understand why someone else would allow it. Why let a disagreement shape the entirety of a person-but anyways I am digressing a bit too much.


Another thing

Feeling comfortable with almost any decision to the point where you don't even feel the need to strongly make them.
 

Chrysanthea

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Though I can be comfortable with any decision, making them myself can actually make me anxious... Especially when there are a lot of options.. There is nothing I hate more than restaurants with a huge ass menu because I could eat literally anything, which is difficult for someone like me to choose from.

Speaking of indecisiveness.... I honestly can't figure out my own enneatype arrangement. WHAT GOES FIRST?! 5w4 or 9w1, godammit?! >.< (I've already researched through nearly everything I could find regarding this dilemma... But I can't for the love of Talos figure my shit out.)
 

Frosty

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Though I can be comfortable with any decision, making them myself can actually make me anxious... Especially when there are a lot of options.. There is nothing I hate more than restaurants with a huge ass menu because I could eat literally anything, which is difficult for someone like me to choose from.

Speaking of indecisiveness.... I honestly can't figure out my own enneatype arrangement. WHAT GOES FIRST?! 5w4 or 9w1, godammit?! >.<


I am indecisive as all hell, obviously. It isn't generally that the choices are overwhelming, usually the opposite. They all end up being equally bland, and separating and understanding the reasons as to why one choice might be slightly better, is generally just more trouble than it is worth.

I have found that with anything, from purchasing a snack in the vending machine to deciding what major to pursure, the best thing to do is actually to completely shut down my brain, go outside of myself and force an immediate decision. This works better for some things than others, namely for descions more involving the short term.

But even with this I am still terribly indecisive, making a decision is just so final, and as I said before there are so many different strengths, weaknesses, others, and facets to consider-and reconsider-and consider the reasons for the reconsideration, aurgh. It is a huge over-reach, one that I have actually found easier lately to distance myself from.

Losing focus in the middle of a conversation, drifting, drifting, drifting, thinking about everything and nothing. Catching yourself at it, and then trying to fill in the gaps. More or less succeeding by offering some snwer that vaguely relates to the last thing that you heard.

Not really feeling connected to the people who you know you should. Having to emotionally try to catch up to other people.

Might be just me: Disgust at the overly passionate, and then disgust at my disgust. I do not particuarly like when people get emotional too quickly without reason. Overly visibly happy or especially overly visibly sad, especially if as I have harped upon, it is tied to some sort of expectation. Makes me suspicious, and possibly to a lesser (or greater?) extent, jealous and uncomfortable.
 
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