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[Traditional Enneagram] holy shiz i really am a 9 :/

Lady_X

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I look at it more as finding the few key items that are essential to the type, as opposed to the "personality traits" which are kind of extraneous. For instance, an essential feature of e9 is wanting a peaceful state of mind. An inessential feature is wanting to "make peace" between other parties. Making peace is just one of a multitude of ways that an e9 might react to conflict, along with simply avoiding the conflict.

So if Lady X's primary issue is avoiding anger to maintain a peaceful state of mind, then she is e9. If it is not her primary issue, it still might be her main way of dealing with anger, while she otherwise usually reacts to her fears about the world as an e7. The nifty thing about tritype is that you don't really have to care which is your main type, because you've defined how you react in any of the grief/fear/anger cases. I list e3 as the last of my tritype, but I still find insight from being aware of it: I react to the grief of not getting along with people not by trying to be helpful (e2) or looking for that one person who will love me as I really am (e4), but by trying to be the kind of person that anyone might love/admire (e3).

that is not my primary issue at all. i do not relate to the idea that I'm repressing anger to keep the peace. i do however often naturally diffuse it and
am often very peaceful.

I'm not afraid of anger...mine or anyone else's. my instinct is to strip it down and figure out what the underlying issue is and deal with it.
 

uumlau

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that is not my primary issue at all. i do not relate to the idea that I'm repressing anger to keep the peace. i do however often naturally diffuse it and
am often very peaceful.

I'm not afraid of anger...mine or anyone else's. my instinct is to strip it down and figure out what the underlying issue is and deal with it.

I understand that, but e9s are kind of weird: we ALL say we don't have any anger issues, that we aren't afraid of anger, etc. The trick is looking at your typical reactions. E.g., do you let an issue go until it's far too late to deal with it, and then you're angry because it hasn't been dealt with?

Kind of like your thread title: an e9 eventually realized, "Holy shiz, I really DO do that ..."

My main point is that it's not an EASY question. The instinctive answer is often not the correct answer: there is an unconscious behavior/reaction that feels like it happens TO YOU, when it is really something caused BY YOU (however indirectly).

I'm not saying that you are or aren't an e9. I'm just giving you my insights as to what being an e9 feels like to me, and why it was so hard to type myself: http://www.typologycentral.com/forums/what-s-my-type-/42299-uumlaus-enneagram.html
 

Lady_X

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I understand that, but e9s are kind of weird: we ALL say we don't have any anger issues, that we aren't afraid of anger, etc. The trick is looking at your typical reactions. E.g., do you let an issue go until it's far too late to deal with it, and then you're angry because it hasn't been dealt with?

Kind of like your thread title: an e9 eventually realized, "Holy shiz, I really DO do that ..."

My main point is that it's not an EASY question. The instinctive answer is often not the correct answer: there is an unconscious behavior/reaction that feels like it happens TO YOU, when it is really something caused BY YOU (however indirectly).

I'm not saying that you are or aren't an e9. I'm just giving you my insights as to what being an e9 feels like to me, and why it was so hard to type myself: http://www.typologycentral.com/forums/what-s-my-type-/42299-uumlaus-enneagram.html

yes i understand that...which is why it's all so hard.
 

Lady_X

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I understand that, but e9s are kind of weird: we ALL say we don't have any anger issues, that we aren't afraid of anger, etc. The trick is looking at your typical reactions. E.g., do you let an issue go until it's far too late to deal with it, and then you're angry because it hasn't been dealt with?

Kind of like your thread title: an e9 eventually realized, "Holy shiz, I really DO do that ..."

My main point is that it's not an EASY question. The instinctive answer is often not the correct answer: there is an unconscious behavior/reaction that feels like it happens TO YOU, when it is really something caused BY YOU (however indirectly).

I'm not saying that you are or aren't an e9. I'm just giving you my insights as to what being an e9 feels like to me, and why it was so hard to type myself: http://www.typologycentral.com/forums/what-s-my-type-/42299-uumlaus-enneagram.html

yes i understand that...which is why it's all so hard.
 

Avocado

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It is VERY rare for me to feel angry. I last felt it months ago for a split second, and last acted on it about 11 years ago.
 

Lady_X

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I'm not saying i never get mad. i can have a temper. It's quick and fiery..not repressed.

i.Just don't feel like i.have any issues there.
 

Werebudgie

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I understand that, but e9s are kind of weird: we ALL say we don't have any anger issues, that we aren't afraid of anger, etc. The trick is looking at your typical reactions. E.g., do you let an issue go until it's far too late to deal with it, and then you're angry because it hasn't been dealt with?

Kind of like your thread title: an e9 eventually realized, "Holy shiz, I really DO do that ..."

My main point is that it's not an EASY question. The instinctive answer is often not the correct answer: there is an unconscious behavior/reaction that feels like it happens TO YOU, when it is really something caused BY YOU (however indirectly).

[MENTION=9310]uumlau[/MENTION]! I've been trying to put the bolded into words for some time now re my e9 gf and some things I've been seeing and she's been surfacing and discussing with me. Specifically, that switch from BY YOU (reality) versus TO YOU (illusion).

Question for you: is this shift of responsibility/attribution specifically an e9 thing, do you think? If so why do you think it happens (what is it about the e9 state that underlies this). If not, are there any specific ways that it would show up in an e9 that would be particularly flavored by that type? I would be most grateful to you for any insight you might have on this point. (and [MENTION=5418]Lady_X[/MENTION] I don't want to hijack your thread so please feel free to let me know if I should take this line of inquiry elsewhere),

I look at it more as finding the few key items that are essential to the type, as opposed to the "personality traits" which are kind of extraneous. For instance, an essential feature of e9 is wanting a peaceful state of mind. An inessential feature is wanting to "make peace" between other parties. Making peace is just one of a multitude of ways that an e9 might react to conflict, along with simply avoiding the conflict.

From what I've seen, this is a crucial distinction - that an essential e9 feature is wanting to be in that state that the 9 will name as inner peace or something along those lines. And that the inessential part of "making peace" externally is only one possible strategy to try to get that inner peace. That makes so much sense and shows why it's useful to separate the essential from the inessential pieces (and speaking as a 6, we have so many different strategies, some of which are contradictory to each other, to try to get that illusion-security state that these kinds of distinctions become even more crucial. But the essential/inessential distinction seems important for the 9 too IMO)

do you think a lot of villains and people who turned "evil" started out as 9?

No I do not. Absolutely not. I don't think villian-ness and/or evil can be traced to any one particular enneagram (or other) type.

I feel like that road leads into the dysfunctional stereotyping I see all too often on this site. That said, I do know that you in particular, prpl, are not coming from a dysfunctional place in asking that question, you're just literally asking it because it occurred to you. Still, it can feed the fire of dysfunction which is way to hot here on the site as it is IMO. I hope that makes sense.

sometimes I feel like a villain because i'm a lot more cynical and feel more evil than I did as a kid. I thought I was gonna solve world hunger and that people were inherently good (still something I delude myself into believing from time to time), was gonna time travel help nazi prisoners (the ones in the camps) escape than travel further back and help slaves escape. of course none of that happened and unfortunately don't have such a power. now I just get angry when people yell at the clerk in the store over something the clerk has no control over, and i hope the customer gets kicked in the head or something.

I'm confused by the rest of your comment about yourself. Meaning: you start out asking about 9s, then describe your own experiences and - aren't you a six? What's the connection you're seeing here?
 

prplchknz

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No I do not. Absolutely not. I don't think villian-ness and/or evil can be traced to any one particular enneagram (or other) type.




I'm confused by the rest of your comment about yourself. Meaning: you start out asking about 9s, then describe your own experiences and - aren't you a six? What's the connection you're seeing here?
oh because i'm debating 8 or 9 in my tritype. But the last number in it. I disagree an idealistic person is more likely to become an evil villain vs a realistic person.
 

Werebudgie

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I disagree an idealistic person is more likely to become an evil villain vs a realistic person.

Ah, okay. Well, I don't know what I think on that point overall. But I don't see 9s as any more idealistic than any enneagram type. The whole enneagram conceptual map seems to me to be about the loss of access to specific "Holy Ideas" (for me it's not ideas, so I would call it essences) and related development of coping mechanisms to make up for that loss/damage. So in that sense, I would think that ALL enneagram types have a sort of break from the essence to which we can be connected - and that break is similar in structure to losing idealism in the face of reality*. So I don't see any enneagram type as more or less idealistic or realistic than any other. The flavor is just different. IMO.

*Edited to add: I don't think that the world of damage and lost access truly is reality, but I do think it presents as such in people's experiences in this broken world.
 

prplchknz

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Ah, okay. Well, I don't know what I think on that point overall. But I don't see 9s as any more idealistic than any enneagram type. The whole enneagram conceptual map seems to me to be about the loss of access to specific "Holy Ideas" (for me it's not ideas, so I would call it essences) and related development of coping mechanisms to make up for that loss/damage. So in that sense, I would think that ALL enneagram types have a sort of break from the essence to which we can be connected - and that break is similar in structure to losing idealism in the face of reality*. So I don't see any enneagram type as more or less idealistic or realistic than any other. The flavor is just different. IMO.

*Edited to add: I don't think that the world of damage and lost access truly is reality, but I do think it presents as such in people's experiences in this broken world.
ah ok,, but if 9s seek harmony and it's just not happening, don't you think they'd be more like to go "screw you people, and blow up shit or cause a shooting?" out of resentment cause harm. i guess any type can do that, but i feel because they want harmony in society their down fall so to speak might be on a larger scale.
 

Werebudgie

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ah ok,, but if 9s seek harmony and it's just not happening, don't you think they'd be more like to go "screw you people, and blow up shit or cause a shooting?" out of resentment cause harm. i guess any type can do that, but i feel because they want harmony in society their down fall so to speak might be on a larger scale.

I don't think "wanting harmony" would be the real issue in that case. I do, however, think that the 9's repressed anger coming out could certainly yield the "screw you people and blow up shit" response, maybe especially in a 9w8. My experience with 9w8 anger is that it can be extremely nasty and destructive.

However. I think that ALL types have our weak points that would yield harm to others on a variety of scales/scopes. 6s, for example, could get really paranoid if under enough stress related to trying to get a state of security, and could probably do a lot of harm on a larger scale from that space if that was the route it took. Think about some of the crazy paranoid "the world is out to get me and I won't let it" people .... I'd bet some of them are 6s.
 

Lady_X

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FWIW I thought I was INFJ for around 8 freaking years, and did the whole "schooling" thing too. People grow and realize wbo they *truly* are. It's totally normal and you shouldn't feel any shame in it! :)

Oh that does make me feel better actually 😂
I also thought my mom was infj the whole time I was here and she's an infp. Haha damn
And I'm back because I don't know if I'm a 9 now. Trying to figure it out. 😄
 

Lady_X

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Oh that does make me feel better actually 😂
I also thought my mom was infj the whole time I was here and she's an infp. Haha damn
And I'm back because I don't know if I'm a 9 now. Trying to figure it out. 😄

i'm not a 9 :D
 

Lady_X

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Cool, how'd you figure it out? I used to think I was 9w8 before realizing I was 7w6.

I think it had something to do with some conversations with friends and husband about career/ life goals and then realizing how very 7 it all was. then looking into it again and realizing how that sx influences the 7 and makes us sorta floaty/ dreamy and also the sx is why i merge with others. not because i'm a 9.

i think i also remembered posting on reddit asking about type 9's and not being conflict avoidant etc. that was the biggest thing i was trying to sort out because i also noticed that honestly...in a group of people i will be the first to say...yeah no..i don't think thats right etc. like, i never just stay quiet to keep peace. i'm not usually shitty about things but will def discuss immediately without much thought about it. and i think some type 9's explained that to me more. and about having this sort of buried rage?? yeah no not at all. i'm just chill until i get excited about things and then i'm very effusive.
 

SearchingforPeace

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I am still very comfortable in my typing as a 9. Being a 9w8 is very different than the 9w1, which is the usual description.

The 9s relationship with anger is very interesting. I have spent a lot of time investigating and pondering anger. Accepting anger requires 9s to accept and value themselves, which is one of the key struggles 9s face.
 
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