[Traditional Enneagram] Phobic enneagram 6 ignorance

[Avocado]

yea, I'm the same setup, phobic 6w7 sp/sx and most definitely have the same issues. I don't think people think I'm dumb about stuff but the dualities really destroy my confidence sometimes.. it's really hard to make decisions/ stand for one thing... Even sometimes if the task or the facts or whatever it is is very straight forward you start to question a lot of stuff.... It makes you look like "you don't know what you're doing" to some of the really bold types... 8's and such. pfft. whatever, 8's.. Thats what I say... I've convinced myself that this is a really good way to go about things... There's fewer assumptions.... I mean if everyone were like this then there would be a problem.... But, for the most part, this thinking style is important in many areas!

I do notice I get a lot of people asking me questions in work and school settings, moreso than they would ask someone else. I think people like the way I weight all these things back and forth in my head/ (and out loud!!) .. Meanwhile I feel like I clearly don't know anything or what i'm talking about. or maybe they just ask because I'm being nice... I don't know.

I at least know I know nothing.
--SOCRATES

 

[The Great One]

I need those excersizes STAT!

Also' why 6w7 Sp/So?

Those exercises are going to take a VERY LONG time for me to type so I can't do it now, but I can do it later tonight.

Also, I believe that you are a 6w7 sp/so because of your demeanor. You don't fit basically anyone's description of a 7w6 so/sp, be it the Favre's, David Riso, or Naranjo. The way you describe yourself makes me believe that you kind of come off like the nerdy guy with high anxiety that gets picked on a lot and made fun of a lot. What you are describing here is not, the 7w6 so/sp, but instead some variety of phobic 6w7. The 3 main types of 6w7 that act like this in general are the so/sx, sp/sx, and sp/so. However, the sp/so and sp/sx are probably the most phobic of all. By the fact that you seem like you are not social last, and seem to think that you are sx last, my first guess would be that you are a 6w7 sp/so. My next guess would be that you are 6w7 sp/sx. However, I highly doubt that you are a social 6. The social 6 is more like the rule-abiding do-gooder and they they generally are very super-ego and are very concerned with what is the best for society and how they can improve the world in general. When I think social 6, I think [MENTION=10496]skylights[/MENTION].

You on the other hand seem more Id, but you also seem very phobic: this is another thing that is leading me more in the direction of core 6w7 for you. The 6w7 sp/so and sp/sx tend to have very similar ways of feeling safe: They both care very much about physical safety, they try to be warm and friendly towards others, and they both have a habit of disarming people with humor. What sets them apart from one another is that the 6w7 sp/so tends to be the most phobic of all: they basically always want to be safe, try to follow the rules as closely as possible, and to be as careful as possible. The 6w7 sp/sx on the other hand tends to want to be safe as well and will often try to follow the rules as well. However, the 6w7 sp/sx is kind of mixed bag because they are mainly phobic but many times have a touch of counter-phobia as well. Many times the sp/sx 6w7 will be scared shitless to do something, but yet they will do it anyway just to face the fear. The sp/sx wants to stay safe,but many times come out of their comfort zone just for the hell of it. The sp/so 6w7 is not like this, and would prefer to constantly stay safe.

I hope that helps.

 

[Avocado]

Those exercises are going to take a VERY LONG time for me to type so I can't do it now, but I can do it later tonight.

Also, I believe that you are a 6w7 sp/so because of your demeanor. You don't fit basically anyone's description of a 7w6 so/sp, be it the Favre's, David Riso, or Naranjo. The way you describe yourself makes me believe that you kind of come off like the nerdy guy with high anxiety that gets picked on a lot and made fun of a lot. What you are describing here is not, the 7w6 so/sp, but instead some variety of phobic 6w7. The 3 main types of 6w7 that act like this in general are the so/sx, sp/sx, and sp/so. However, the sp/so and sp/sx are probably the most phobic of all. By the fact that you seem like you are not social last, and seem to think that you are sx last, my first guess would be that you are a 6w7 sp/so. My next guess would be that you are 6w7 sp/sx. However, I highly doubt that you are a social 6. The social 6 is more like the rule-abiding do-gooder and they they generally are very super-ego and are very concerned with what is the best for society and how they can improve the world in general. When I think social 6, I think [MENTION=10496]skylights[/MENTION].

You on the other hand seem more Id, but you also seem very phobic: this is another thing that is leading me more in the direction of core 6w7 for you. The 6w7 sp/so and sp/sx tend to have very similar ways of feeling safe: They both care very much about physical safety, they try to be warm and friendly towards others, and they both have a habit of disarming people with humor. What sets them apart from one another is that the 6w7 sp/so tends to be the most phobic of all: they basically always want to be safe, try to follow the rules as closely as possible, and to be as careful as possible. The 6w7 sp/sx on the other hand tends to want to be safe as well and will often try to follow the rules as well. However, the 6w7 sp/sx is kind of mixed bag because they are mainly phobic but many times have a touch of counter-phobia as well. Many times the sp/sx 6w7 will be scared shitless to do something, but yet they will do it anyway just to face the fear. The sp/sx wants to stay safe,but many times come out of their comfort zone just for the hell of it. The sp/so 6w7 is not like this, and would prefer to constantly stay safe.

I hope that helps.

Yes, I seem more like a 6w7 Sp/So than an Sp/Sx simply because I almost always will avoid danger [here I mean I can count the number of times I've taken a risk on one hand, and they were all to avoid something worse], and quite frankly, even though I have high ideals for society, my fear of taking risks has made me trample my own ideals many times.

That is also another reason I hold Christians, theists, and the religious in general in the blackest contempt. Not only are their beliefs factually wrong and full of logic holes, the way they threaten others is damaging to the psyche of young children and the way they use ancient texts to oppress others is morally reprehensable. I live in the Bible Belt, so my logically superior thinking sets me apart from others. In a sense, I live in a personal hell of deep thought and isolation.

 

[The Great One]

Yea. I have to do that too. I am good at new things cause I like change, and I pick up quickly. But the downside, is that I need so much fucking context cause I'm a perfectionist, and don't want to get it wrong. And that's when I ask questions about the little details, which most people (ALL SENSORS, PRACTICALLY) view as "common sense." (And for the record, I don't believe in common sense...there is no such thing...it's bullshit, cause it's all relative.)

So when ppl think you're "a dumbass" as you put it...is it them thinking it's lack of common sense? Cause for me as an intuitive...I start from scratch when learning something new. I don't like to compare present context with prior context until I know I fully understand the whole overall picture of what I'm learning. Which like I said...takes quite a bit of context. lol

Yes, I relate completely. For instance, I have a co-worker whom is an 8w9 ISTP, and I fucking despise that guy! Whenever I am trying to understand something, I ask a boatload of questions and this helps me to understand every little detail and facet of what's going on. However, it seems that my ISTP co-worker despises questions and also despises communication, so when I try to communicate in any way with him, he gets angry. He really makes me feel VERY uncomfortable asking questions, and therefore I generally don't ask him. Then, what happens is that I never know what's going on, and when I don't, I look like a dumbass for not knowing what's going on! GOD IT PISSES ME THE FUCK OFF!
[MENTION=10496]skylights[/MENTION]

Urarienev ahahah my little brother (ISTP) and boyfriend (ISFJ) are all about some "common sense" too... IMO it's an annoying blend of S-Ti... Clearly observing what's present plus perceiving that everything works on logical background mechanisms...

I also agree about just letting it go and letting your gut take over. That definitely yields the best results every time. Which maybe is why we say that 6 integrates to 9....

Yeah, it very well could be why 6 integrates to 9.

Yes, I know what you mean. Also, for me, I often try to get private practice time in before being watched or tested. People ask me how I know what to do - the truth is the amount of time I spend privately reading and learning and practicing.

On a personal note, I want to go into some branch of medicine, and getting it right when I eventually practice whatever discipline I go into is very concerning to me. It's one thing to screw up in your own life but treating others is a consideration of a much higher magnitude. It scares me a bit, but I try to remind myself that all practitioners face that challenge and I am going to try to trust myself to choose the specialty that I am best at so that I can provide the best level of care. I think there are a lot of reasons a 6 would make a good practitioner so I try to remind myself of those...

Yeah, I also take my job seriously as well, and often am afraid that I will screw up as well. What I do is that practice and practice. Then, when the time comes, what I do is to just distract myself completely by reading something or doing something so that I can't think about myself actually screwing up. Then, when it's time to do the actual task, I just do it, and don't think. Thinking is the enemy.

Relatedly - I am so sorry disability is so hard to get. I do know why, though - there are SO many people who try to sweet talk their way into false coverage. My dad (a psychiatrist) comes home with stories about fakers trying to wheedle their way into disability all the time. It's really sad for the people who actually need disability that it requires such a stringent process, but otherwise our government funds would be even more run dry (ie we'd owe China even more) by people who just don't want to work..

I'm not even worried about it anymore. I'm just putting my big boy pants on and just working through it. Oh and it's very hard to. For instance, with that co-worker I mentioned earlier, I have the potential to get into a lot of arguments because he is such a pain in the ass to work with. However, I avoid confrontation with him like the plague because getting into arguments wreaks havoc on my PTSD. When I have something that even feels like a confrontation, it sends me back into my trauma: I go into complete fight or flight mode and I basically either have the choice of screaming at my co-worker or just avoiding the confrontation altogether. Confrontation for me feels like someone holding a blowtorch to your back and saying, "Don't scream, just take the pain. It's so unpleasant for me, that I literally squint my eyes and my lips tighten up. To tell the truth, when I get into confrontation now, it looks like I just ate a sour lemon or something. Just one wrong confrontation, and I could say something that could get me fired. I try to be diplomatic and if diplomacy doesn't work, I just let it go.

On a better note though, I am now saving up money and I am trying to solve my gagging problem out of pocket. I plan to pay for an upper GI series and an upper endoscopy without insurance using my own money since I can't get insurance for a fair price. If I can do this, I can go back to exercising and bodybuilding which would raise my self esteem and would allow me to exercise so that I could burn off some stress.

yea, I'm the same setup, phobic 6w7 sp/sx and most definitely have the same issues. I don't think people think I'm dumb about stuff but the dualities really destroy my confidence sometimes.. it's really hard to make decisions/ stand for one thing... Even sometimes if the task or the facts or whatever it is is very straight forward you start to question a lot of stuff.... It makes you look like "you don't know what you're doing" to some of the really bold types... 8's and such. pfft. whatever, 8's.. Thats what I say... I've convinced myself that this is a really good way to go about things... There's fewer assumptions.... I mean if everyone were like this then there would be a problem.... But, for the most part, this thinking style is important in many areas!

I do notice I get a lot of people asking me questions in work and school settings, moreso than they would ask someone else. I think people like the way I weight all these things back and forth in my head/ (and out loud!!) .. Meanwhile I feel like I clearly don't know anything or what i'm talking about. or maybe they just ask because I'm being nice... I don't know.

Yeah it's really a pain in the ass mindset that we 6w7 types have to deal with.

 

[The Great One]

Yes, I seem more like a 6w7 Sp/So than an Sp/Sx simply because I almost always will avoid danger [here I mean I can count the number of times I've taken a risk on one hand, and they were all to avoid something worse], and quite frankly, even though I have high ideals for society, my fear of taking risks has made me trample my own ideals many times.

That is also another reason I hold Christians, theists, and the religious in general in the blackest contempt. Not only are their beliefs factually wrong and full of logic holes, the way they threaten others is damaging to the psyche of young children and the way they use ancient texts to oppress others is morally reprehensable. I live in the Bible Belt, so my logically superior thinking sets me apart from others. In a sense, I live in a personal hell of deep thought and isolation.

That's the difference between you and me: I don't always avoid danger. Sometimes I even welcome danger and take a "Fuck it, whatever happens, happens" attitude when it comes to danger. I mostly like to stay safe, but many times I will take risks in order to face all the fear that I have. That and when I take a risk and something doesn't go wrong, I derive a sense of euphoria from that.

 

[Evo]

Yes, I relate completely. For instance, I have a co-worker whom is an 8w9 ISTP, and I fucking despise that guy! Whenever I am trying to understand something, I ask a boatload of questions and this helps me to understand every little detail and facet of what's going on. However, it seems that my ISTP co-worker despises questions and also despises communication, so when I try to communicate in any way with him, he gets angry. He really makes me feel VERY uncomfortable asking questions, and therefore I generally don't ask him. Then, what happens is that I never know what's going on, and when I don't, I look like a dumbass for not knowing what's going on! GOD IT PISSES ME THE FUCK OFF!

Yea, that actually sounds dreadful. I work with an 8 that's above me, and she doesn't like to communicate either. And I've said this before in your other thread about ISTP's...but they're already hard to read. And really don't like being questioned. I can see why you would be frustrated.

 

[skylights]

Yes, I relate completely. For instance, I have a co-worker whom is an 8w9 ISTP, and I fucking despise that guy! Whenever I am trying to understand something, I ask a boatload of questions and this helps me to understand every little detail and facet of what's going on. However, it seems that my ISTP co-worker despises questions and also despises communication, so when I try to communicate in any way with him, he gets angry. He really makes me feel VERY uncomfortable asking questions, and therefore I generally don't ask him. Then, what happens is that I never know what's going on, and when I don't, I look like a dumbass for not knowing what's going on! GOD IT PISSES ME THE FUCK OFF!

Hah, I know this game with my brother. Not as bad thanks to 9>8, but it's frustrating. One thing I've found is that observing environments and tangential commenting tends to produce more information and less aggravation than direct questions. At least with my brother he is more a sort of hands-on, watch-and-learn-as-you-go kind of person. So while I am like you and want to know everything up front, I think it's valuable to try to see how they are likely operating on a different plane of expecting you to absorb and understand via experience and process. It's a challenge for an N 6, but I think it can also be an excellent lesson in being present and facing frightening situations. I just did an intro scuba dive with an instructor I'd bet dollars to donuts was an ISTP, and he was really like that too. I was nervous that I'd mess up... freak out... felt like I didn't know enough... eventually had to just say sod it to myself and go with the flow. It all worked out great. Sometimes it's just okay to be and watch... I think that's so hard for 6s... it's a constant struggle to just let go...

 

[Avocado]

That's the difference between you and me: I don't always avoid danger. Sometimes I even welcome danger and take a "Fuck it, whatever happens, happens" attitude when it comes to danger. I mostly like to stay safe, but many times I will take risks in order to face all the fear that I have. That and when I take a risk and something doesn't go wrong, I derive a sense of euphoria from that.

My father was like that...
He had a fast mind that kept him up at night unless he invented something [which he would later patent] and he said ''a day without danger is like a day without oxygen.''

Now I have an ESTP 8w9 step-father who stays angry all the time.

 

[The Great One]

Yea, that actually sounds dreadful. I work with an 8 that's above me, and she doesn't like to communicate either. And I've said this before in your other thread about ISTP's...but they're already hard to read. And really don't like being questioned. I can see why you would be frustrated.

What I am doing now is basically just forcing the guy to communicate. I am also asking him questions despite how stupid he finds them. It is annoying the hell out of him, but I don't care. Yes, he is a true pain in the ass to work with.

Hah, I know this game with my brother. Not as bad thanks to 9>8, but it's frustrating. One thing I've found is that observing environments and tangential commenting tends to produce more information and less aggravation than direct questions. At least with my brother he is more a sort of hands-on, watch-and-learn-as-you-go kind of person. So while I am like you and want to know everything up front, I think it's valuable to try to see how they are likely operating on a different plane of expecting you to absorb and understand via experience and process. It's a challenge for an N 6, but I think it can also be an excellent lesson in being present and facing frightening situations. I just did an intro scuba dive with an instructor I'd bet dollars to donuts was an ISTP, and he was really like that too. I was nervous that I'd mess up... freak out... felt like I didn't know enough... eventually had to just say sod it to myself and go with the flow. It all worked out great. Sometimes it's just okay to be and watch... I think that's so hard for 6s... it's a constant struggle to just let go...

1)Yeah, I don't learn as I go at all. I want everything up front. I would rather discuss the theoretics of a situation in it's entirety before I begin something. I like to be able to see things in my head before I do them.

2)This is why I research the hell out of an instructor before I take them. If I am paying them to teach me something, I want to know that I will get along with them, and that there teaching style matches my learning style, before we begin.

3)On a side note, I finally found my core enneagram type, and you were correct: I am a 6w7 sp/sx. The sp 6w7 tries to be warm and friendly to others in order to be safe. They also try to get on everyone's good side; the sp 6 hates making enemies. Also, the sp 6 is very obsessed with having enough money to survive. In fact, the sp 6 is very much like the gatherer ant from the story of "The Ant and the Grasshopper": they are constantly building resources for when "the winter comes". In addition the sp/sx often times is co-dependent and likes to rely on other people. Sp 6's tend to naturally look for a "father figure" or a mentor so to say, to show them the ropes with everything. I have definitely sought out mentors to look up to in the past because I thought that I would naturally mess things up. Another thing is that the sp 6 tends to be very good at establishing social networks in order to survive. I thought that this was something that strictly social 6's did, but apparently sp 6's do this as well. Social 6's tend to set up social networks in order to be apart of something and in order to find others with like-minds that are also dedicated to doing the greater good and improving society in general.

Also, my second variant is sexual: The sexual 6 tends to be the most counter-phobic 6. The sexual 6 tends to look a bit like an 8 at first site. When the SX 6 perceives a threat, it lashes out at it counter-phobicly. The Sx 6 tends to give out the "Don't fuck with me vibe" to anyone whom is within 3 feet of them. They are also very into physical appearance and it is very important to them to be seen as attractive. In addition a lot of SX 6's like to come off as physically intimidating: many of the male sx 6's tend to be very much into working out heavily, and many of them like to get physically large with large muscles and whatnot in order to feel safe. Many sx 6's are into the martial arts as well because learning to fight well is also a way to come off as physically intimidating to people. Many sx 6's are very much into other really rough sports like football and wrestling as well. The sx 6's tend to be adrenaline junkies as well. Sexual 6's are often highly sexual in the literal sense as well and tend to be sexual freaks. Finally, sexual 6's are often very obsessed with attracting a mate.

I believe that I am a sp/sx 6 because I am a combination of both the self-preservation and the sexual 6. I mostly tend to play it safe: I like to build social networks of people that can help me if I need it, I tend to be very warm and friendly to others and I often disarm others with humor, I tend to be like a gather ant and having a great deal of money and resources tends to make me feel safe, and I tend to try to be as physically safe as possible and try to avoid danger. In terms of the second variant: being physically attractive is something very important to me, I am actually trying to get in shape now and I actually want to become much more large and more physically fit in order to deter people from fucking with me, I'm very obsessed with attracting a mate, and I actually would like to get into the martial arts as well and learn how to fight well.

Also, my sp variant and sx variant tend to fight with one another. On one hand the sp variant wants to stay safe constantly, not do anything that could harm me, and wants to avoid conflict. However, on the other hand, the Sx variant wants to break the rules, do crazy shit, and be and to be confrontational. My variants are very much at odds with one another inside of me.

My father was like that...
He had a fast mind that kept him up at night unless he invented something [which he would later patent] and he said ''a day without danger is like a day without oxygen.''

Now I have an ESTP 8w9 step-father who stays angry all the time.

Is he still alive?

 

[Avocado]

What I am doing now is basically just forcing the guy to communicate. I am also asking him questions despite how stupid he finds them. It is annoying the hell out of him, but I don't care. Yes, he is a true pain in the ass to work with.



1)Yeah, I don't learn as I go at all. I want everything up front. I would rather discuss the theoretics of a situation in it's entirety before I begin something. I like to be able to see things in my head before I do them.

2)This is why I research the hell out of an instructor before I take them. If I am paying them to teach me something, I want to know that I will get along with them, and that there teaching style matches my learning style, before we begin.

3)On a side note, I finally found my core enneagram type, and you were correct: I am a 6w7 sp/sx. The sp 6w7 tries to be warm and friendly to others in order to be safe. They also try to get on everyone's good side; the sp 6 hates making enemies. Also, the sp 6 is very obsessed with having enough money to survive. In fact, the sp 6 is very much like the gatherer ant from the story of "The Ant and the Grasshopper": they are constantly building resources for when "the winter comes". In addition the sp/sx often times is co-dependent and likes to rely on other people. Sp 6's tend to naturally look for a "father figure" or a mentor so to say, to show them the ropes with everything. I have definitely sought out mentors to look up to in the past because I thought that I would naturally mess things up. Another thing is that the sp 6 tends to be very good at establishing social networks in order to survive. I thought that this was something that strictly social 6's did, but apparently sp 6's do this as well. Social 6's tend to set up social networks in order to be apart of something and in order to find others with like-minds that are also dedicated to doing the greater good and improving society in general.

Also, my second variant is sexual: The sexual 6 tends to be the most counter-phobic 6. The sexual 6 tends to look a bit like an 8 at first site. When the SX 6 perceives a threat, it lashes out at it counter-phobicly. The Sx 6 tends to give out the "Don't fuck with me vibe" to anyone whom is within 3 feet of them. They are also very into physical appearance and it is very important to them to be seen as attractive. In addition a lot of SX 6's like to come off as physically intimidating: many of the male sx 6's tend to be very much into working out heavily, and many of them like to get physically large with large muscles and whatnot in order to feel safe. Many sx 6's are into the martial arts as well because learning to fight well is also a way to come off as physically intimidating to people. Many sx 6's are very much into other really rough sports like football and wrestling as well. The sx 6's tend to be adrenaline junkies as well. Sexual 6's are often highly sexual in the literal sense as well and tend to be sexual freaks. Finally, sexual 6's are often very obsessed with attracting a mate.

I believe that I am a sp/sx 6 because I am a combination of both the self-preservation and the sexual 6. I mostly tend to play it safe: I like to build social networks of people that can help me if I need it, I tend to be very warm and friendly to others and I often disarm others with humor, I tend to be like a gather ant and having a great deal of money and resources tends to make me feel safe, and I tend to try to be as physically safe as possible and try to avoid danger. In terms of the second variant: being physically attractive is something very important to me, I am actually trying to get in shape now and I actually want to become much more large and more physically fit in order to deter people from fucking with me, I'm very obsessed with attracting a mate, and I actually would like to get into the martial arts as well and learn how to fight well.

Also, my sp variant and sx variant tend to fight with one another. On one hand the sp variant wants to stay safe constantly, not do anything that could harm me, and wants to avoid conflict. However, on the other hand, the Sx variant wants to break the rules, do crazy shit, and be and to be confrontational. My variants are very much at odds with one another inside of me.



Is he still alive?

No.

 

[The Great One]

No.

I'm sorry.

 

[Evo]

1)Yeah, I don't learn as I go at all. I want everything up front. I would rather discuss the theoretics of a situation in it's entirety before I begin something. I like to be able to see things in my head before I do them.

2)This is why I research the hell out of an instructor before I take them. If I am paying them to teach me something, I want to know that I will get along with them, and that there teaching style matches my learning style, before we begin.

My variants are very much at odds with one another inside of me.

Welcome to my world lol.

 

[Avocado]

I'm sorry.

Thank you, though it has been 14 years. The first step-father I had after him was the worst man ever [he was strict JW and was more into torturing for fun than out of anger], my second step-father was a goofy guy who was nowhere near as bad as the first guy and also loved danger [he died, too...3 years ago] he was less intellectual than my dad, though, and now I am on number four. He is very angry and a somewhat strict southern baptist [this marriage got my mom shunned for 2 years, as JW's can only marry JW's. She completed the challenges to be unshunned, though.] I've been through a lot...

{The JW rules override the guy's rules, which is weird in what SHOULD be a patriarchy...}

 

[skylights]

3)On a side note, I finally found my core enneagram type

Awesome!

It sounds like it fits you well. I didn't know what you explained about sp 6 and networks - interesting! - and now I know why you seemed to vibe a little social. It's also an interesting contrast with my soc/sx, in that I don't even consciously "build" networks so much as I feel like I "join" them or "engage" them, and I don't usually do it with a specific purpose in mind for that group (ie I don't have a very good idea of envisioning how the group can help me, besides the security of belonging) - rather I usually join because I want to contribute to the group's cause.

Like I mentioned my little brother is sp/sx as well, pretty sure, and I can sometimes see that sp-sx war taking place inside of him.

 

[The Great One]

Thank you, though it has been 14 years. The first step-father I had after him was the worst man ever [he was strict JW and was more into torturing for fun than out of anger], my second step-father was a goofy guy who was nowhere near as bad as the first guy and also loved danger [he died, too...3 years ago] he was less intellectual than my dad, though, and now I am on number four. He is very angry and a somewhat strict southern baptist [this marriage got my mom shunned for 2 years, as JW's can only marry JW's. She completed the challenges to be unshunned, though.] I've been through a lot...

{The JW rules override the guy's rules, which is weird in what SHOULD be a patriarchy...}

I'm sorry you've been subjected to so many crazies.

Awesome!

It sounds like it fits you well. I didn't know what you explained about sp 6 and networks - interesting! - and now I know why you seemed to vibe a little social. It's also an interesting contrast with my soc/sx, in that I don't even consciously "build" networks so much as I feel like I "join" them or "engage" them, and I don't usually do it with a specific purpose in mind for that group (ie I don't have a very good idea of envisioning how the group can help me, besides the security of belonging) - rather I usually join because I want to contribute to the group's cause.

Like I mentioned my little brother is sp/sx as well, pretty sure, and I can sometimes see that sp-sx war taking place inside of him.

Is following the rules very important to you? Supposedly social 6's are very big on following rules as well.

 

[Avocado]

I'm sorry you've been subjected to so many crazies.



Is following the rules very important to you? Supposedly social 6's are very big on following rules as well.

I follow the rules so long as it doesn't grossly undermine my values. I also don't network so much as obsessively try to get people to like me.

 

[skylights]

Is following the rules very important to you? Supposedly social 6's are very big on following rules as well.

Nah. People write a lot of crap about Social 6s. I think it's more individualistic than just blind rule-following. I do think 6s tend to be a bit idealistic/perfectionistic, and with Socials that might come out in the way they operate in group situations/endeavors.

Personally, I'm pretty keen on making sure I know the rules and I stay pretty aware on whether I'm breaking them or not and whether others are breaking them or not, but it's just because I like to know what's going on in my surroundings and whether I'm liable to get in trouble or not. Paying attention to what others get away with helps me judge what I can get away with reasonably or not and helps me decide whether I think it's worth risking it. I am a stickler for rules that I think are important - like wash your hands after using the bathroom, and finish your entire pack of antibiotics - because they help keep people safe and healthy, but it's about the reason, not about the rule itself. Mostly I'm just picky about the public health stuff, personally. Whereas my retail workplace has a slew of picky small rules that I disregard constantly with private glee because I don't judge them to help anyone and they can often hinder us instead, and are devised by people who have no idea what sort of daily work we do or what the conditions are (I know this... it is not just cynical conjecture... I have met these people and talked to them about store operations...)

I also don't network so much as obsessively try to get people to like me.

Hahahaha same!!

 

[Avocado]

Nah. People write a lot of crap about Social 6s. I think it's more individualistic than just blind rule-following. I do think 6s tend to be a bit idealistic/perfectionistic, and with Socials that might come out in the way they operate in group situations/endeavors.

Personally, I'm pretty keen on making sure I know the rules and I stay pretty aware on whether I'm breaking them or not and whether others are breaking them or not, but it's just because I like to know what's going on in my surroundings and whether I'm liable to get in trouble or not. Paying attention to what others get away with helps me judge what I can get away with reasonably or not and helps me decide whether I think it's worth risking it. I am a stickler for rules that I think are important - like wash your hands after using the bathroom, and finish your entire pack of antibiotics - because they help keep people safe and healthy, but it's about the reason, not about the rule itself. Mostly I'm just picky about the public health stuff, personally. Whereas my retail workplace has a slew of picky small rules that I disregard constantly with private glee because I don't judge them to help anyone and they can often hinder us instead, and are devised by people who have no idea what sort of daily work we do or what the conditions are (I know this... it is not just cynical conjecture... I have met these people and talked to them about store operations...)



Hahahaha same!!

That is how I am with rules. I sometimes look ISTJ till I stub my toe and scream [I have an ingrown nail that keeps coming back, and the slightest pressure kills me.].

 

[The Great One]

[MENTION=18694]Magic Qwan[/MENTION]

I follow the rules so long as it doesn't grossly undermine my values. I also don't network so much as obsessively try to get people to like me.

Yep, that's a classic self preservation 6 move: They try to get people to like them, try to create as non-hostile of an environment as they can, try to be warm and friendly to everyone, and they often times try to disarm people with humor. Another thing they often do is that they often make fun of themselves in order to make other people laugh.

 

[The Great One]

[MENTION=10496]skylights[/MENTION]

Nah. People write a lot of crap about Social 6s. I think it's more individualistic than just blind rule-following. I do think 6s tend to be a bit idealistic/perfectionistic, and with Socials that might come out in the way they operate in group situations/endeavors.

Personally, I'm pretty keen on making sure I know the rules and I stay pretty aware on whether I'm breaking them or not and whether others are breaking them or not, but it's just because I like to know what's going on in my surroundings and whether I'm liable to get in trouble or not. Paying attention to what others get away with helps me judge what I can get away with reasonably or not and helps me decide whether I think it's worth risking it. I am a stickler for rules that I think are important - like wash your hands after using the bathroom, and finish your entire pack of antibiotics - because they help keep people safe and healthy, but it's about the reason, not about the rule itself. Mostly I'm just picky about the public health stuff, personally. Whereas my retail workplace has a slew of picky small rules that I disregard constantly with private glee because I don't judge them to help anyone and they can often hinder us instead, and are devised by people who have no idea what sort of daily work we do or what the conditions are (I know this... it is not just cynical conjecture... I have met these people and talked to them about store operations...)

Personally I think that what it's more about for social 6's is finding some type of large group that will allow them to do good (super-ego) deeds. I believe that they look for some type of higher authority or group to allow them to achieve their humanitarian goals. For instance, I would think that most social 6's would look towards things like religion, charity groups, the peace corp, etc., in order to achieve their goals. I will admit that it's probably the so/sp 6's that tend to have the more blind obedience. You probably tend to break the rules a lot more because of your secondary sx variant which is much more counter-phobic.