[Traditional Enneagram] Enneagram Type and MBTI function correlations...

[atlascatcher]

Also I am now up to date on the forum posts, please answer my initial question! I'm really not being malicious in intent I just don't understand the notion of wanting to not come down from your ivory tower.

 

[yeghor]

Why would I not be?

I ask you if you have spoken to any INFJ e1s. You said you've not met any in real life and have only spoken to INFJs and INTJs online so I ask you if you've spoken to any INFJ e1s online as I wasn't sure if you were saying you spoke to INFJ and INTJ 1s or simply those types. Then you list me a bunch of videos of people you think are INTJ or INFJ, which I took as unrelated to my initial question and then you said you haven't spoken to them online only watched their videos. Which made me wonder if you've actually talked to anyone you believe is INFJ other than reading their writings or video posts.

Sorry not trying to beat you up or anything. All I wanted to know is if you've had extensive interaction with INFJ e1s online or INFJs in general online of any enneatype other than reading a forum.

You are projecting onto me then.

The answer you want to hear is: No. I'd expect those guys and girls to be enneagram 1s though. It's not important for me for someone to claim they are an INxJ but to walk and talk like one too.

The template I compare them to is basically myself if that's where you are trying to lead this.

I find the description at INFJ Strengths and Weaknesses | 16 Personality Types to be accurate, in relation to myself, as well.

So you can say I indirectly rely on that description too so as to verify myself as a reference benchmark.
[MENTION=22089]Desiderium[/MENTION]

Sorry to bring you into this but I'll be direct. Are you an INTJ?

If yes, would you be willing to paste your enneagram test result here?

 

[yeghor]

Also I am now up to date on the forum posts, please answer my initial question! I'm really not being malicious in intent I just don't understand the notion of wanting to not come down from your ivory tower.

I am not in my ivory tower. Your entire attitude has been negative from the start and I can feel it in your wording, whixh turns this into a futile discussion for me.

What I tell here is what I perceive to be the truth until such time that it is overruled by further information.

 

[atlascatcher]

You are projecting onto me then.

The answer you want to hear is: No. I'd expect those guys and girls to be enneagram 1s though. It's not important for me for someone to claim they are an INxJ but to walk and talk like one too.

The template I compare them to is basically myself if that's where you are trying to lead this.

I find the description at INFJ Strengths and Weaknesses | 16 Personality Types to be accurate, in relation to myself, as well.

So you can say I indirectly rely on that description too so as to verify myself as a reference benchmark.
[MENTION=22089]Desiderium[/MENTION]

Sorry to bring you into this but I'll be direct. Are you an INTJ?

If yes, would you be willing to paste your enneagram test result here?

Yeah I realize my perception was incorrect, oops.

Nope dude I am not an INTJ haha, MBTI INFJ/socionics INFp through and through, GO BETA! I'm not interested in re-examining my type I've spent too many countless hours and Google Hangouts with others messing with that. You have my enneagram results though from the INFJ call to action post you made, you can always copy them to here for your study.

You've answered enough of my questions to not warrant any further interaction with your theory so I will see you in other parts of the forum. I hope your VI post stays active if it can live past the drama that ensued as I quite enjoyed reading through it.

EDIT: There's been nothing negative about it that is total perception on your part! All I wanted to know is why you shy away from incorporating the real world and if you've actually spoken to other INFJs as it seems to flaw your approach. I have nothing against what you're doing here.
EDIT2: Sorry, just realized it wasn't your initial post but you were a frequent poster in it. Either way!

 

[yeghor]

I haven't read everything in the various threads related to your theory but I've been following the gist of it because it seems a little, well, absurd.

Your opening statement was "I've been reading enneagram descriptions"--Does this not strike you as a bit problematic? First you say you have been reading descriptions and just now you have said you have a habit of questioning external experts.

People give me finalized deductions about other people's correlations about mbti and enneagram types.

I can't see for myself how they forned those correlations, whether the type data they collected is reliable or not. So many blind spots with no means to verify.

I am assuming enneagram type descriptions of experts are correct. I think they must be forming the core of the enbeagram system therefore if they are incorrect, then the entire system collapses and it becomes poibtless to use the enbeagram system at all.

Would it not make more sense to actually speak with those who identify as a certain enneagram, sans their MBTI type, to get a more rounded view of the manifestation of the nine types before trying to associate function use?

How will I know they are really the type they claim to be both in enneagram and MBTI? What reference will I compare them to?

While it is true fours can be self-centered and individualistic, that is not all they are. It is not like we go around thinking me, me, me, me all 24 hours of the day (maybe when extremely unhealthy). By your logic above, any type that is Fi dominant must be self-centered and individualistic, which is untrue in totality. The opposite is possible as well, any type can experience narcissism without being related to the enneagram.

I think IxxPs and ExxJs have a propensity for egotism which they may curb if they mature. Such introverts are more contained/covert in their egotism whereas extraverts are more overt.

When did you last give a fuck about how people you are not emotionally invested in think about you? Tell me about the last instance that made you loathe/hate yourself.

 

[magpie]

So I got this:

Type 1 Perfectionism |||||| 30%
Type 2 Helpfulness |||||||||||| 50%
Type 3 Image Focus |||||| 30%
Type 4 Individualism |||||||||||||||| 70%
Type 5 Intellectualism |||||||||||| 42%
Type 6 Security Focus |||||||||| 38%
Type 7 Adventurousness |||||||||||||| 58%
Type 8 Aggressiveness |||||||||||| 42%
Type 9 Calmness |||||||||||| 46%

type score type behavior motivation
4 17 I must be unique/different to survive.
7 14 I must be fun and entertained to survive.
2 12 I must be helpful and caring to survive.
9 11 I must maintain peace/calm to survive.
5 10 I must be knowledgeable to survive.
8 10 I must be strong and in control to survive.
6 9 I must be secure and safe to survive.
1 7 I must be perfect and good to survive.
3 7 I must be impressive and attractive to survive.

Your main type is Type 4
Your variant stacking is sp/sx/so
Your level of health is below average, i.e. unhealthy

Your main type is which ever behavior you utilize most and/or prefer. Your variant reflects your scoring profile on all nine types: so = social variant (compliant, friendly), sx = sexual variant (assertive, intense), sp = self preservation variant (withdrawn, security seeking).

 

[yeghor]

So I got this:

Type 1 Perfectionism||||||30%
Type 2Helpfulness||||||||||||50%
Type 3Image Focus||||||30%
Type 4Individualism||||||||||||||||70%
Type 5Intellectualism||||||||||||42%
Type 6Security Focus||||||||||38%
Type 7Adventurousness||||||||||||||58%
Type 8Aggressiveness||||||||||||42%
Type 9Calmness||||||||||||46%

typescoretype behavior motivation
417 I must be unique/different to survive.
714 I must be fun and entertained to survive.
212 I must be helpful and caring to survive.
911 I must maintain peace/calm to survive.
510 I must be knowledgeable to survive.
810 I must be strong and in control to survive.
69 I must be secure and safe to survive.
17 I must be perfect and good to survive.
37 I must be impressive and attractive to survive.

Your main type is Type 4
Your variant stacking is sp/sx/so
Your level of health is below average, i.e. unhealthy

Your main type is which ever behavior you utilize most and/or prefer. Your variant reflects your scoring profile on all nine types: so = social variant (compliant, friendly), sx = sexual variant (assertive, intense), sp = self preservation variant (withdrawn, security seeking).

INFP?

 

[magpie]

Yes, I do consider myself an INFP, although I've accepted that and was more curious about my enneagram. Thanks for the test. I guess I am a four then.

 

[Ksilva]

Hey, here are my results, but I'm not sure that they're very accurate because I'm going through depression right now. I think 6 would normally be lower and 3 higher, but the 9 is correct.

Type 1 Perfectionism |||||||||| 38%
Type 2 Helpfulness |||||| 26%
Type 3 Image Focus |||||||||||||| 58%
Type 4 Individualism |||||||||||||| 54%
Type 5 Intellectualism |||||||||||| 46%
Type 6 Security Focus |||||||||||||||||| 74%
Type 7 Adventurousness |||||||||| 38%
Type 8 Aggressiveness |||||||||| 34%
Type 9 Calmness |||||||||||||||||| 74%

 

[yeghor]

Hey, here are my results, but I'm not sure that they're very accurate because I'm going through depression right now. I think 6 would normally be lower and 3 higher, but the 9 is correct.

Type 1 Perfectionism||||||||||38%
Type 2Helpfulness||||||26%
Type 3Image Focus||||||||||||||58%
Type 4Individualism||||||||||||||54%
Type 5Intellectualism||||||||||||46%
Type 6Security Focus||||||||||||||||||74%
Type 7Adventurousness||||||||||38%
Type 8Aggressiveness||||||||||34%
Type 9Calmness||||||||||||||||||74%

This looks like ISTJ.

 

[Ksilva]

Well, that would make perfect sense, as I am under stress right now, and those are all of my functions in reverse.

 

[skgarcia]

I was tested as an INTP for work by my department. We hired a bunch of new people and my company figured it would be a good way to "break the ice." It was a psychological exam. It didn't have anything to do with enneagram typing though, here are my results from the test in your signature. I'm a 23 year old woman who writes for a living.


Type 1 Perfectionism |||| 14%
Type 2 Helpfulness |||||||||||||||| 62%
Type 3 Image Focus |||| 18%
Type 4 Individualism |||||||||||||||||||| 90%
Type 5 Intellectualism |||||||||||||||||| 78%
Type 6 Security Focus |||||||||||||| 54%
Type 7 Adventurousness |||||||||||| 46%
Type 8 Aggressiveness |||||| 22%
Type 9 Calmness |||||||||||||||||||| 90%


type score type behavior motivation
4 22 I must be unique/different to survive.
9 22 I must maintain peace/calm to survive.
5 19 I must be knowledgeable to survive.
2 15 I must be helpful and caring to survive.
6 13 I must be secure and safe to survive.
7 11 I must be fun and entertained to survive.
8 5 I must be strong and in control to survive.
3 4 I must be impressive and attractive to survive.
1 3 I must be perfect and good to survive.

Your main type is Type 4
Your variant stacking is sp/sx/so
Your level of health is very high

 

[yeghor]

I was tested as an INTP for work by my department. We hired a bunch of new people and my company figured it would be a good way to "break the ice." It was a psychological exam. It didn't have anything to do with enneagram typing though, here are my results from the test in your signature. I'm a 23 year old woman who writes for a living.


Type 1 Perfectionism |||| 14%
Type 2 Helpfulness |||||||||||||||| 62%
Type 3 Image Focus |||| 18%
Type 4 Individualism |||||||||||||||||||| 90%
Type 5 Intellectualism |||||||||||||||||| 78%
Type 6 Security Focus |||||||||||||| 54%
Type 7 Adventurousness |||||||||||| 46%
Type 8 Aggressiveness |||||| 22%
Type 9 Calmness |||||||||||||||||||| 90%


type score type behavior motivation
4 22 I must be unique/different to survive.
9 22 I must maintain peace/calm to survive.
5 19 I must be knowledgeable to survive.
2 15 I must be helpful and caring to survive.
6 13 I must be secure and safe to survive.
7 11 I must be fun and entertained to survive.
8 5 I must be strong and in control to survive.
3 4 I must be impressive and attractive to survive.
1 3 I must be perfect and good to survive.

Your main type is Type 4
Your variant stacking is sp/sx/so
Your level of health is very high

4_2 (37) 9_8 (27) 5_6 (32) 7_1 (14)

Fi Ti Si Ne = doesn't make sense as per my theory.

Based on your weakest Ne score however, I'd say you might be an ISFJ.

 

[Mal12345]

4_2 (37) 9_8 (27) 5_6 (32) 7_1 (14)

Fi Ti Si Ne = doesn't make sense as per my theory.

Based on your weakest Ne score however, I'd say you might be an ISFJ.

Basing a result on the weakest function, because something didn't match some theory, is ridiculous. Consider this mbti/Jung correlation from a post close to this thread's OP:

1 - J (Je)
2 - FJ (Fe)
3 - E (Xe)
4 - IF
5 - IT
6 - N/A
7- EP (Pe)
8 - ET
9 - I (Xi)

Now does it make sense? Indeed, as your enneagram is 4w5 which correlates well with Fi/Ti.

But Fi/Ti doesn't make sense to some theory or other because a judging (or perceiving) function is not to be (or perhaps just rarely) the auxiliary type of a dominant judging (or perceiving) function.

Accoring to MY theory, however, Fi Ti Si Ne amounts to INFJ, not ISFJ.

Edit - or INFP, now that I've taken a closer look at all the results.

 

[skgarcia]

I am very aware of typology and to call me an IS-anything could not be further from the truth. My intuition score on the MBTI was 89% the very first go (I know too much about the test now for any current score to be truly accurate) and I have always felt an innate gift to read people and my surroundings. If anything, I am more intuitive than 90% of the N types I've met. Sometimes I feel as if I can "read minds" and manipulate entire social/conversational situations in order to get the topic focused on what I need it to be on. Definitely not a sensor type. I'm very probing and perceptive on a metaphysical level, not just physically.

I feel very comfortable calling myself self actualized; perhaps it's just unusual to see a healthier-than-average INTP with a well conditioned Fi on these forums? Just because it is an unusual personality combination to display vibrant healthiness doesn't mean I have mistyped myself, especially after a year and a half of research. Why would I lie to myself about my own psychology when the entire reason I became interested in MBTI was to learn about myself?

The last two letters probably change by the day or moment, but I know I am not an IS on any day.

 

[yeghor]

I am very aware of typology and to call me an IS-anything could not be further from the truth. My intuition score on the MBTI was 89% the very first go (I know too much about the test now for any current score to be truly accurate) and I have always felt an innate gift to read people and my surroundings. If anything, I am more intuitive than 90% of the N types I've met. Sometimes I feel as if I can "read minds" and manipulate entire social/conversational situations in order to get the topic focused on what I need it to be on. Definitely not a sensor type. I'm very probing and perceptive on a metaphysical level, not just physically.

I feel very comfortable calling myself self actualized; perhaps it's just unusual to see a healthier-than-average INTP with a well conditioned Fi on these forums? Just because it is an unusual personality combination to display vibrant healthiness doesn't mean I have mistyped myself, especially after a year and a half of research. Why would I lie to myself about my own psychology when the entire reason I became interested in MBTI was to learn about myself?

The last two letters probably change by the day or moment, but I know I am not an IS on any day.

I am on mobile atm. I'll have a more detailed look at your video in the coming days. First impression I got was ISTJ as I said.

What are you irritated most with life? What causes you the most anxiety? Your weakest trait?

What quality do you admire in the opposite sex most?

What quality are you most irritated with in the same sex (your competitors)?

Consider the last incidents in your workplace or daily life when answering if you will.

 

[skgarcia]

What are you irritated most with life? What causes you the most anxiety? Your weakest trait?

Stupidity. Ignorance is fine if someone can adapt to the truth once given it, but people with their heads in the sand make me pretty irritated. Especially if it's about philosophy, religion, or science--plenty of people want to "talk the talk" on these topics but refuse to listen to intellectual debate on them at the same time. That is choosing ignorance to me. When I do have anxiety it's around non-nuclear family, little children under three years old, at doctor's appointments, being alone with someone in an atmosphere that socially demands interaction of a certain "type" i.e. going out to eat with a man, etc. Group situations are all right, the pressure is diffused. Large groups of people (concert-sized groups) can make me anxious if I'm not sober. My weakest trait is also probably my greatest gift--I'm a daydreamer; I theorize constantly, to the point it inhibits other aspects of my life. I read too much.

What quality do you admire in the opposite sex most?

Intelligence, masculinity, height, silence, observant, listening to understand and not just to reply, keen, dry wit, a man who truly enjoys solitude and is naturally a loner. A man in all respects. Someone who notices every single detail and remembers everything autobiographical with the same clarity I do. He has to be more intelligent than me--if someone's mind is Rubik's cube I can figure out within an hour of meeting them, I'm not interested. The love of my life I will never figure out completely. He is the embodiment of mysterious and enigmatic.

What quality are you most irritated with in the same sex (your competitors)?

I am never irritated by girls my age, they are not my competitors. I don't compete. They are human beings on their own path in life, and since I am heterosexual, I have no reason to even remotely think about judging them for their behavior.

 

[yeghor]

What are you irritated most with life? What causes you the most anxiety? Your weakest trait?

Stupidity. Ignorance is fine if someone can adapt to the truth once given it, but people with their heads in the sand make me pretty irritated. Especially if it's about philosophy, religion, or science--plenty of people want to "talk the talk" on these topics but refuse to listen to intellectual debate on them at the same time. That is choosing ignorance to me. When I do have anxiety it's around non-nuclear family, little children under three years old, at doctor's appointments, being alone with someone in an atmosphere that socially demands interaction of a certain "type" i.e. going out to eat with a man, etc. Group situations are all right, the pressure is diffused. Large groups of people (concert-sized groups) can make me anxious if I'm not sober. My weakest trait is also probably my greatest gift--I'm a daydreamer; I theorize constantly, to the point it inhibits other aspects of my life. I read too much.

What quality do you admire in the opposite sex most?

Intelligence, masculinity, height, silence, observant, listening to understand and not just to reply, keen, dry wit, a man who truly enjoys solitude and is naturally a loner. A man in all respects. Someone who notices every single detail and remembers everything autobiographical with the same clarity I do. He has to be more intelligent than me--I usually judge this based on emotional depth and range of interests. If someone's mind is Rubik's cube I can figure out within an hour of meeting them, I'm not interested. The love of my life I will never figure out completely. He is the embodiment of mysterious and enigmatic.

What quality are you most irritated with in the same sex (your competitors)?

I am never irritated by girls my age, they are not my competitors. I don't compete. They are human beings on their own path in life, and since I am heterosexual, I have no reason to even remotely think about judging them for their behavior.

Your ideal man sounds like an ISTP. I don't know how to interprete that.

And everybody competes in life.

 

[yeghor]

Basing a result on the weakest function, because something didn't match some theory, is ridiculous. Consider this mbti/Jung correlation from a post close to this thread's OP:

1 - J (Je)
2 - FJ (Fe)
3 - E (Xe)
4 - IF
5 - IT
6 - N/A
7- EP (Pe)
8 - ET
9 - I (Xi)

Now does it make sense? Indeed, as your enneagram is 4w5 which correlates well with Fi/Ti.

But Fi/Ti doesn't make sense to some theory or other because a judging (or perceiving) function is not to be (or perhaps just rarely) the auxiliary type of a dominant judging (or perceiving) function.

Accoring to MY theory, however, Fi Ti Si Ne amounts to INFJ, not ISFJ.

Edit - or INFP, now that I've taken a closer look at all the results.

It's not ridiculous. Based on the least preferred parts of enneagram I am trying to find out about the inferior function in mbti.

 

[skgarcia]

Your ideal man sounds like an ISTP. I don't know how to interprete that.

And everybody competes in life.

My friend, I am very aware of what my ideal man is. I am very aware of what an ISTP and INTP man are like "in the wild." I've dated an INTP for years and coincidentally my direct supervisor at work is an ISTP. You, in all actuality, seem to have a less realistic grip on cognitive functions than I do.

No one competes unless they consider themselves a part of the flock. The fact you are still blatantly telling me I am feeling and interpreting my own subjective reality incorrectly, while not knowing me in the least, makes you seem silly.