I Broke the Test...

[tkae.]

So after thinking about it and looking at different definitions, my Type 4 has come into extreme question.

So I retook the test... and I got a two-way split between 6 and 9 with 5 following close behind (all within 3 points, which in that test was a split).

So I took another test. And I got a split between 4, 6, and 9...

Ironically, the type that made me come into question with being a 4 was 2, but that didn't even come close to scoring on the list.

9 seems like it'd be close because I'm extremely laid-back and try to be harmonious with people and things, but I can't be sure about that because I don't have moments where I question the value of my contribution. I know I have things to express that others want to experience, I know my contribution is valuable, and so I don't try to achieve harmony by making myself less visible. I have the typical INFP "let's all hug and get along" attitude.

6 applies because things in my past have left me with a nasty tendency to feel scared and worried about things. I still have phantom pains of what it feels like to be truly alone, for nothing to be secure and everything to be collapsing around me. I avoid risky activities (21 and I don't smoke, drink, go to parties, concerts, don't really go anywhere at night, etc), but I'm not so obsessed with security and safety that I actively seek to establish a completely organized and defensible life situation. I open myself up and connect with people, and I'm not so preoccupied with safety that I don't feel like I can't put my creative work out into the world because of the strong voice I have. Granted, I want to publish under a pen name and nobody know anything about me... Thomas Pynchon style, etc. But still. I'm an English major going for an MFA. I'm not exactly the poster boy for establishing an independent, ordered life lol

5 I can see, because before I'd thought I was a 4w5. But I'm not entirely sure I'm a 4 because I'm not so much preoccupied with being unique as I am with being true to myself. And I know that's cliche, but for me it's truly not an issue of being unique. I don't need to be doing things other people aren't doing, I just need to be doing what I want to do. I wear sweatshirts I like even if everybody else is wearing them (though I'd recognize it's awkward how we all look the same lol). For me, being unique isn't being original, and being original isn't being different. I'm extremely in tune with my emotions and I'm pretty self-aware. I just really don't care about being original. I only care about being emotionally true to myself and my writing.

And overall I feel like I know who I am. Except for how I can't figure out my enneagram lol

But basically I don't hinge my self-worth on who or what I am. And I know it, mostly. I'm an INFP, I'm extremely laid back, I hate conflict, I love writing because I feel like it expresses the person I know I am on the inside (and don't need to define), I like to make others happy (but don't base the value of accomplishments on it), and I just want everyone to get along, yet I don't go about it by trying to blend in. I have a balance in my presence somewhere between 4 and 9.

So I don't know. Either I've broken the whole thing or I'm so unhealthy in one that I'm slipping into another lol

I can see why I scored 4 the first time because I was really getting over some stuff when I took it. I was obsessed with finding a label for my identity. But now that I've balanced a little and gotten comfortable with myself (four years later), I don't know if that skewed my real results and I just wanted to be a 4 because it was unique (and because INFPs kind of get lumped into that category), or if the desire to understand myself better and find value in myself skewed how I answered things.

Ugh...

So all you people who are smarter than me about this, wtf am I?

 

[skylights]

Hah, not smarter. But maybe a personal reflection can help - which is that you don't sound like a 6 to me, just from reading your 6 concerns. At least not a sx-dom 6, if you're sure of your variant. Though that may only be because you're focusing on things that sound 6-y that might only scrape the surface of sx-6ishness.

Sx-dom 6 has a "strength and beauty" focus as described by Ichazo, where you are very conscious of trying to be competent or appealing enough to not be afraid of your environment - like if you're stable enough, you can be self-assured in terms of your connections with other entities, especially in regards to your mate, who is your most important emotional figure. I don't know if this rings true for everyone, but for me, a major part of being a sx 6 is the element of "testing" your partner (or whatever important 1-on-1 entity) to make sure they're (still) capable, which seems cruel (and is, to some extent, but it's very, very subconscious) of checking that they can hold up to you and your needs. This can happen with people but also with objects or interests, where you start doubting their ability to be what you need as well as your ability to be what they need - so there's also a huge element of focus on personal desirability, making sure you're always up to snuff, that you still possess the ability to entrance and engage and acquire.

From all you've written, you seem most 9w1 to me. Do you relate to this? -

Sexual/Self-pres


The energy of the sexual instinct is at odds with the dominant type Nine energy and makes for a conflicted subtype. These Nines can appear to have a stronger connection to Three, for this reason. The assertive fiery energy engages in a constant push-pull with the calm peace-seeking energy of the Nine. This subtype can have an intense relationship with their environment. They are often drawn to solo sports or to an active engagement with nature that involves some risk and exertion. These Nines are drawn to peak experiences. They might enjoy outdoor solo sports or engaging in nature by way of hiking, rock climbing etc.

With the social instinct last in the stacking, there can be an on/off quality when it comes to relating and these Nines are often somewhat moodier than the other subtypes. As with the self-pres/sexual, this subtype might not engage socially with the same smoothness as other subtypes of Nine. They seem to go towards others in a staccato fashion - they connect in bursts, then withdraw.

When it comes to intimate relationships, this subtype can be needy. The merging of the Nine combines with the intensity of the sexual instinct to create a subtype that will always be in danger of losing themselves in a relationship. Their boundaries for themselves and their partner can become blurred which can lead to conflicts. This subtype might have a hard time judging clearly the degree to which they have merged.

Here are the others, all from ocean-moonshine.net:

Sexual/Self-pres

The sexual/self-pres Six is more concerned with strength, beauty and merging. With this stacking, the counterphobic energy is directed more toward individuals than towards ideas and concepts. It’s more about controlling the people closest to them. Paranoia arises when the Six feels abandoned by intimates. In the sexual/self-pres Six, doubt and anxiety is relieved by the knowledge that one's intimates really are trustworthy. These Sixes are always testing their mates for loyalty. The sexual Six is counterphobic in terms of needing to prove their desirability and strength.


This type is identified with their respective gender roles for security. They can be competitive and appear Eight-like. Male Sixes are likely to show strength as a form of counterphobia. Female Sixes are likely to emphasize their looks in order to be attractive. Security comes from knowing they are desirable. They can be very possessive of their mates. This can turn to extreme jealousy. On the down side, paranoia about the relationship can set in. The sexual/self-pres Six can appear Three-like, because of their need for validation and competitiveness.

On the high side, this subtype can be the most fiercely loyal to their friendships and to those loved ones who have gained their trust. The intensity of the sexual instinct brings with it a passion that is unwavering for the love and protection of their loved ones. The nature of the Six to "go towards," combined with the merging of the sexual instinct, can sometimes create an idealization of others, the ones that have passed the test of the Six. On the down side, the fear of losing the close relationship can cause this subtype to desperately lash out counterphobically.

Sexual/Self-pres

This subtype has a lot in common the self-pres/sexual instinctual stacking. They experience many of the same internal conflicts surrounding relationships, the need for independence and emotional expression. The sexual/self-pres subtype differs however in being more intense, more counterphobic. They entertain more dark nihilistic ideas, ideas that most others don’t want to consider.

With this subtype, a lot of energy revolves around the issue of boundaries. Sexual/self-pres Fives tend to forge strong connections quickly and deeply, but if they feel betrayed, begin to feel overwhelmed, or if they feel that the connection doesn’t serve their true needs, can seem to cut the connection precipitously and “go cold.” They have high standards for significant others. They must feel that they can share their emotions with a significant other without being judged. This is their private world that they share. Relationships can be difficult, because individuals of this subtype will still want their own space and alone time, while at other times will want intense connection. Because the social instinct is least developed, this subtype is not very concerned with how others perceive them (except their intimates). This subtype is deceptive in that they may not seem to be especially intense - until they are engaged in a conversation they find interesting. Then the intensity and emotion become apparent. The internal struggle for this subtype is similar to that of the self-pres/sexual, but more energized and volatile, and getting to know this subtype means getting to know that.

When unhealthy, the energy of the sexual instinct can combine with the dominant type Five fixation to create a very impulsive Eight-like anger. The strength of their convictions can then come out quite forcefully.

Sexual/Self-pres

This is a very volatile type. They are driven to form connections but have very high demands of their partners. When their powerful fantasies don’t match reality, they become very restless. They take the fire and passion of the sexual instinct and turn it inward. This can cause both brooding and fiery outbursts. Dramatic mood swings are very likely with this type. This subtype of Four could be considered the most classic Four, because of the way they seem to embody the archetype of the tortured artist, although not all Fours of this subtype are artists. Stereotype aside, this subtype does tend to bring their emotions into focus more readily then the other subtypes of Four. What is under the surface with the self-pres/sexual is now bubbling to the surface. This subtype can resemble type Seven because of their drama, passion for experience and tendency to suffer from frustration when life seems dull. Like type Seven, they can seem to throw themselves into experience.

When healthy, this subtype learns to balance the need for passion with the less obvious need for groundedness which can come from solid and focused relationships with others and with their creative outlets.

You seem more peaceful to me than the 4, though I suppose that could result from your INFPness. ;]

 

[tkae.]

From the 9 sx/sp:

They are often drawn to solo sports or to an active engagement with nature that involves some risk and exertion. These Nines are drawn to peak experiences. They might enjoy outdoor solo sports or engaging in nature by way of hiking, rock climbing etc.

That doesn't sound like me at all almost. I do love nature and engaging with my environment, but risk and exertion... absolutely not lol

From the 6 sx/sp:

The sexual/self-pres Six is more concerned with strength, beauty and merging. With this stacking, the counterphobic energy is directed more toward individuals than towards ideas and concepts. It’s more about controlling the people closest to them. Paranoia arises when the Six feels abandoned by intimates. In the sexual/self-pres Six, doubt and anxiety is relieved by the knowledge that one's intimates really are trustworthy. These Sixes are always testing their mates for loyalty. The sexual Six is counterphobic in terms of needing to prove their desirability and strength.


This type is identified with their respective gender roles for security. They can be competitive and appear Eight-like. Male Sixes are likely to show strength as a form of counterphobia. Female Sixes are likely to emphasize their looks in order to be attractive. Security comes from knowing they are desirable. They can be very possessive of their mates. This can turn to extreme jealousy. On the down side, paranoia about the relationship can set in. The sexual/self-pres Six can appear Three-like, because of their need for validation and competitiveness

Not really, I don't have that much of a self-image lol

I really don't test for loyalty, I just get extremely hurt when it's betrayed. But I'm not paranoid about it and build things on loyalties I trust. I'm not competitive at all, either. I hate competition, and while I do enjoy validation, I don't fight for it. I just sit quietly and hope it gets thrown my way.

But other parts of it sound like me. I can be paranoid about friendships at first, but I thought it was normal...

5 sx/sp sounds like it might be onto something, though...

Are you going by my sub-type, cause that might not be entirely right either. Not saying I'm not, I don't know. I'm not sure about that either lol

 

[acronach]

just from reading over the thread, you sound a lot like a 5, but the INFP thing is kinda throwing me off... F type 5s are really rare but not unheard of. 6w5? 5w4?

I could def see a 9 fix though

 

[Burger King]

Based on your avatar and overall presence, I'd go with core 9. Reasons?

- I've noticed a correlation between those who wear anime/disney avatars and those who are in the optimistic triad.
- The kid in the avatar is watching an explosion with a very 'meh' expression. What does this mean and what does this say about you I wonder? Seems 9-ish.
- You vibe like someone who's trying to balance their id/superego desires (9) - humility. E4 has image issues, so they don't come across so...uhmm...neutral.
- E5 is in the competence triad. There is arrogance in 'knowing.' The creation of this thread alone eliminates that. Seems like E5 and E6 cp are unlikely.

Edit: Forgot to mention, phobic 6 is a strong possibility as well.

 

[acronach]

Based on your avatar and overall presence, I'd go with core 9. Reasons?

- I've noticed a correlation between those who wear anime/disney avatars and those who are in the optimistic triad.
- The kid in the avatar is watching an explosion with a very 'meh' expression. What does this mean and what does this say about you I wonder? Seems 9-ish.
- You vibe like someone who's trying to balance their id/superego desires (9) - humility. E4 has image issues, so they don't come across so...uhmm...neutral.
- E5 is in the competence triad. There is arrogance in 'knowing.' The creation of this thread alone eliminates that. Seems like E5 and E6 cp are unlikely.

Edit: Forgot to mention, phobic 6 is a strong possibility as well.

there's truth here. My guess is 6 with a heavy 5 wing, but i could be wrong.

 

[skylights]

From the 9 sx/sp:

They are often drawn to solo sports or to an active engagement with nature that involves some risk and exertion. These Nines are drawn to peak experiences. They might enjoy outdoor solo sports or engaging in nature by way of hiking, rock climbing etc.

That doesn't sound like me at all almost. I do love nature and engaging with my environment, but risk and exertion... absolutely not lol

I do suspect this would probably relate more for 9w8 and less for 9w1. I can see my 9w8 brother for that - he loves mountain biking, weightlifting, fast driving (I'm not sure of his instinct, maybe sx/so) - and not for my 9w1 (sp/sx) boyfriend, who generally avoids physical risk.

As a sx I do seek peak experiences but not so much risk and exertion either. I really seek full engagement, which can come with the aforementioned but isn't really important to me (and as a 6 I'm not all that into risk, lol).

while I do enjoy validation, I don't fight for it. I just sit quietly and hope it gets thrown my way.

I think 6s are compelled to seek validation, or at least some kind of response from others, because our type is all about the state of our relationship with the exterior world. If you'd said "I blow everyone off and like to see them react" then I'd say cp 6, but I think it's almost impossible for a 6 to just sit quietly and wait for a reaction. That'd tear away at us.

5 sx/sp sounds like it might be onto something, though...

Are you going by my sub-type, cause that might not be entirely right either. Not saying I'm not, I don't know. I'm not sure about that either lol

Yes, those are by subtype. Here are all the links.

From a thread on INFP 5s:

Fi-doms respond primarily with judgment of the subjective quality of what they're experiencing. Being a Five as well just means that you'll seek to understand everything objectively, so you'll try to detach and objectively analyse your subjective Fi reactions to make sure they're 'right' and reliable, and for the sake of understanding something.

I thought I was a Four because I think about my emotional reactions a lot and am interested in emotional subject matter, but I don't think about my feelings for the same reasons or in the same way that Fours do.

For one thing, I'm not primarily preoccupied with my own worth. Although like most people who have them, I have been during depressive episodes and therefore have strong memories of thinking like an unhappy Four and a strong aversion to ever feeling that way again, the rest of the time I'm far more concerned about my security (thinking triad) than my worth (feeling triad), and in fact during most depressive episodes as well this has remained the case.

I also relate more to the typical Five here and in fleshspace than I do to the Fours. I'm more sensitive in both the good and bad sense, and lean somewhat more towards analysing more human issues in depth than purely technical ones like mechanics or chemistry, due to Fi, but other than that I feel more similar to them.

I do think that E-Five INFPs are probably relatively uncommon forms of each camp and so won't fit the non-defining stereotypes of them as much. If you don't feel quite at home somehow, identifying with either most FPs or Fives that you know despite having the defining characteristics of the types, I think it's more likely you're both.

There's some mention of E5s fearing becoming depleted - lacking unique knowledge or skills; not having concepts to turn over in their minds and apply to reality - which seems to be absent in E9 descriptions.

I think it'd help if you could identify your triad. 5-6-7 spends wayyy too much time in their heads, probing, picking things apart, overanalyzing, running ideas to death, turning thoughts over and over and over, ruminating on certain themes, etc. 8-9-1 avoids picking things apart in favor of action in the real world - in 9's case, generally in favor of seeking and enjoying whatever imbues them with serenity and happiness. 2-3-4 concentrates most on their overall image identity, who they understand themselvf to be and how they relate that Self to themself and others - a "what am I" theme.

I hope any of this is helpful, lol.

 

[skylights]

From the 9 sx/sp:

They are often drawn to solo sports or to an active engagement with nature that involves some risk and exertion. These Nines are drawn to peak experiences. They might enjoy outdoor solo sports or engaging in nature by way of hiking, rock climbing etc.

That doesn't sound like me at all almost. I do love nature and engaging with my environment, but risk and exertion... absolutely not lol

I do suspect this would probably relate more for 9w8 and less for 9w1. I can see my 9w8 brother for that - he loves mountain biking, weightlifting, fast driving (I'm not sure of his full instinct, but almost definitely sx dom) - and not for my 9w1 (sp/sx) boyfriend, who generally avoids physical risk.

As a sx I do seek peak experiences but not so much risk and exertion either. I really seek full engagement, which can come with the aforementioned but isn't really important to me (and as a 6 I'm not all that into risk, lol).

while I do enjoy validation, I don't fight for it. I just sit quietly and hope it gets thrown my way.

I think 6s are compelled to seek validation, or at least some kind of response from others, because our type is all about the state of our relationship with the exterior world. If you'd said "I blow everyone off and like to see them react" then I'd say 6, but I think it's almost impossible for a 6 to just sit quietly and wait for a reaction. That'd tear away at us.

5 sx/sp sounds like it might be onto something, though...

Are you going by my sub-type, cause that might not be entirely right either. Not saying I'm not, I don't know. I'm not sure about that either lol

Yes, those are by subtype. Here are all the links.

From a thread on INFP 5s:

Fi-doms respond primarily with judgment of the subjective quality of what they're experiencing. Being a Five as well just means that you'll seek to understand everything objectively, so you'll try to detach and objectively analyse your subjective Fi reactions to make sure they're 'right' and reliable, and for the sake of understanding something.

I thought I was a Four because I think about my emotional reactions a lot and am interested in emotional subject matter, but I don't think about my feelings for the same reasons or in the same way that Fours do.

For one thing, I'm not primarily preoccupied with my own worth. Although like most people who have them, I have been during depressive episodes and therefore have strong memories of thinking like an unhappy Four and a strong aversion to ever feeling that way again, the rest of the time I'm far more concerned about my security (thinking triad) than my worth (feeling triad), and in fact during most depressive episodes as well this has remained the case.

I also relate more to the typical Five here and in fleshspace than I do to the Fours. I'm more sensitive in both the good and bad sense, and lean somewhat more towards analysing more human issues in depth than purely technical ones like mechanics or chemistry, due to Fi, but other than that I feel more similar to them.

I do think that E-Five INFPs are probably relatively uncommon forms of each camp and so won't fit the non-defining stereotypes of them as much. If you don't feel quite at home somehow, identifying with either most FPs or Fives that you know despite having the defining characteristics of the types, I think it's more likely you're both.

There's some mention of E5s fearing becoming depleted - lacking unique knowledge or skills; not having concepts to turn over in their minds and apply to reality - which seems to be absent in E9 descriptions.

I think it'd help if you could identify your triad. 5-6-7 spends wayyy too much time in their heads, probing, picking things apart, overanalyzing, running ideas to death, turning thoughts over and over and over, ruminating on certain themes, etc. 8-9-1 avoids picking things apart in their heads in favor of action in the real world - in 9's case, generally in favor of seeking and enjoying whatever imbues them with serenity and happiness. 2-3-4 concentrates most on their overall image identity, who they understand themself to be and how they relate that Self to themself and others - a "who am I"/"who am I in relation to you" theme.

I hope any of this is helpful, lol.

 

[tkae.]

there's truth here. My guess is 6 with a heavy 5 wing, but i could be wrong.

I think it'd help if you could identify your triad. 5-6-7 spends wayyy too much time in their heads, probing, picking things apart, overanalyzing, running ideas to death, turning thoughts over and over and over, ruminating on certain themes, etc. 8-9-1 avoids picking things apart in favor of action in the real world - in 9's case, generally in favor of seeking and enjoying whatever imbues them with serenity and happiness. 2-3-4 concentrates most on their overall image identity, who they understand themselvf to be and how they relate that Self to themself and others - a "what am I" theme.

I hope any of this is helpful, lol.

I definitely spend way too much time in my head. Looking at it that way, it's easy to narrow them down. All of this spawns from the fact that I pick things apart to death lol

I don't know. I think that definitely gets it down to 5 and 6. I'm leaning towards 5 because after reading up on it more they seem to have issues with security that make me lean towards 6, and other than that I'm pretty confident about 5. Based on the descriptions I think I fit 5w4 a bit more based on life choices (creative writing major with a minor in the cognition of aesthetic and figurative thought), so...

I don't know, it's 1:45 in the morning lol

Based on all this, does that seem like all the math adds? It's hard telling the difference between a type 6 or a 5 with a history of anxiety disorders and traumatic experiences leaving a chronic sense of malaise

 

[Orangey]

You know, the most accurate way to do this is to look deep into yourself, identify the qualities that give you the least pleasure (or most shame) to claim, and then match it to the enneagram. Forget behaviors. That shit will give you a headache, and it looks like it already has for you.

 

[skylights]

I definitely spend way too much time in my head. Looking at it that way, it's easy to narrow them down. All of this spawns from the fact that I pick things apart to death lol

I don't know. I think that definitely gets it down to 5 and 6. I'm leaning towards 5 because after reading up on it more they seem to have issues with security that make me lean towards 6, and other than that I'm pretty confident about 5. Based on the descriptions I think I fit 5w4 a bit more based on life choices (creative writing major with a minor in the cognition of aesthetic and figurative thought), so...

I don't know, it's 1:45 in the morning lol

Based on all this, does that seem like all the math adds? It's hard telling the difference between a type 6 or a 5 with a history of anxiety disorders and traumatic experiences leaving a chronic sense of malaise

True, I wondered about that too - where 6 and anxiety muddle.

Basically I think the difference is, if hanging back and observing all the time, and not feeling competent enough, trips you up, then you're more likely a 5. If it's anticipating worst case scenarios and trying to prepare for them that trips you up, then you're a 6. 5 doesn't feel the drive to engage as much externally. 6 feels like they have to engage externally because they have to prepare. 5 does more watching in the present and theorizing. 6 does more future thinking.

What's Hard About Being a Five

being slow to put my knowledge and insights out in the world
feeling bad when I act defensive or like a know-it-all
being pressured to be with people when I don't want to be
watching others with better social skills, but less intelligence or technical skill, do better professionally


What's Hard About Being a Six

the constant push and pull involved in trying to make up my mind
procrastinating because of fear of failure; having little confidence in myself
fearing being abandoned or taken advantage of
exhausting myself by worrying and scanning for danger
being too critical of myself when I haven't lived up to my expectations

You know, the most accurate way to do this is to look deep into yourself, identify the qualities that give you the least pleasure (or most shame) to claim, and then match it to the enneagram. Forget behaviors. That shit will give you a headache, and it looks like it already has for you.

The most accurate but also the hardest, imo... I know I wasn't self-aware enough to identify my own protective strategies the first time I tried. If someone is, you're right, that's the best strategy...

It did help me to identify my biggest "problem" in my life.

 

[Orangey]

The most accurate but also the hardest, imo... I know I wasn't self-aware enough to identify my own protective strategies the first time I tried. If someone is, you're right, that's the best strategy...

It did help me to identify my biggest "problem" in my life.

Yeah, it's difficult to be that self-aware. Our first instinct is, I think, to psychical self-preservation...so things that give us pain get repressed or channeled into other weird areas (such as self-aggrandizement or delusions about how we are.) It's like what happens when someone you know with a dull wit claims to be great at verbal comedy.

I think a good way to circumvent this is to solicit honest assessment from someone very close to you. Like family members or some other intimate. Someone who has no reason to try and sabotage you by lying, but is close enough not to fear seriously damaging their relationship with you by being honest.

 

[acronach]

You know, the most accurate way to do this is to look deep into yourself, identify the qualities that give you the least pleasure (or most shame) to claim, and then match it to the enneagram. Forget behaviors. That shit will give you a headache, and it looks like it already has for you.

truth here