Odd Enneagram/MBTI combinations, all the oddballs rejoice!

[OrangeAppled]

Oh yes it is thank you for the link, I find it awesome lol, Soo is your INFJ friend more "out there" and more in the world? do you think he fits the 3w4 type?

He's very good at social networking (IRL, not online). It's funny, because he would say he is more social than I am, which is true in the sense that I don't seek people out (and frankly, I don't connect easily/quickly with people), but yet, when socializing, I often participate more in conversation. He'll hang back & observe, but organize the whole thing.
I considered 1w2 for him, and it's still possible, but I think he is more image-oriented.

 

[Mal12345]

I don't feel any conflict between the two. It's not like one side of me is INTP and the other is 4w5, they're merged and work together. I suppose what makes me different from a stereotypical 4 is that I'm not melodramatic, temperamental, or expressive, and I'm probably not as sensitive. I keep my feelings on the inside and act based on logic. If you met me in person, you would probably say I'm more like a 9 or a 5 than a 4, and that's because I don't fit the stereotype, and the things that make me a 4 are mostly things that don't show on the outside. That's why every time I take an enneagram test I end up getting 9, then 5, and then 4 in that order. I swear, I always get 9 just because I'm agreeable.

What primarily matters is this:
Type 5
Key Motivations: Want to possess knowledge, to understand the environment, to have everything figured out as a way of defending the self from threats from the environment.

and this

Type 4
Key Motivations: Want to express themselves and their individuality, to create and surround themselves with beauty, to maintain certain moods and feelings, to withdraw to protect their self-image, to take care of emotional needs before attending to anything else, to attract a "rescuer."
http://www.enneagraminstitute.com/

 

[Silveresque]

What primarily matters is this:
Type 5
Key Motivations: Want to possess knowledge, to understand the environment, to have everything figured out as a way of defending the self from threats from the environment.

and this

Type 4
Key Motivations: Want to express themselves and their individuality, to create and surround themselves with beauty, to maintain certain moods and feelings, to withdraw to protect their self-image, to take care of emotional needs before attending to anything else, to attract a "rescuer."
http://www.enneagraminstitute.com/

All of those motivations for both types fit me, though I'm much more drawn to 4's motivations. In case you're wondering, I don't have a single doubt about my type right now. I've already considered everything, not just the motivations, and determined that 4 is the better fit, by far. It makes me wonder how I ever deceived myself into thinking I was not a 4. When I read the descriptions for type 4, they fit me perfectly. So well, in fact, I get chills just from reading it. That's the one, that's my type.

 

[Mal12345]

All of those motivations for both types fit me, though I'm much more drawn to 4's motivations. In case you're wondering, I don't have a single doubt about my type right now. I've already considered everything, not just the motivations, and determined that 4 is the better fit, by far. It makes me wonder how I ever deceived myself into thinking I was not a 4. When I read the descriptions for type 4, they fit me perfectly. So well, in fact, I get chills just from reading it. That's the one, that's my type.

That's what I thought too - for about one month.

 

[Silveresque]

That's what I thought too - for about one month.

I'm curious, what was it that made you decide you were a 5 and not a 4?

 

[Mal12345]

I'm curious, what was it that made you decide you were a 5 and not a 4?

Excellent question. I would say - nothing. The type 4 qualities I had previously just vanished one day. The day before they up and left, I was like this:

As long as they believe that there is something fundamentally wrong with them, they cannot allow themselves to experience or enjoy their many good qualities. To acknowledge their good qualities would be to lose their sense of identity (as a suffering victim) and to be without a relatively consistent personal identity (their Basic Fear).

http://www.enneagraminstitute.com/typefour.asp

and the next day I was no longer like that.

 

[Silveresque]

Excellent question. I would say - nothing. The type 4 qualities I had previously just vanished one day. The day before they up and left, I was like this:

As long as they believe that there is something fundamentally wrong with them, they cannot allow themselves to experience or enjoy their many good qualities. To acknowledge their good qualities would be to lose their sense of identity (as a suffering victim) and to be without a relatively consistent personal identity (their Basic Fear).

http://www.enneagraminstitute.com/typefour.asp

and the next day I was no longer like that.

Well, maybe you're a really healthy 4, or maybe you really are a 5. I was a 5 for a while, but I was never fully satisfied with it because at one point I no longer fit into any of the levels of development. I think 4's levels fit me better all the way through, not just in the average levels.

By the way, I'm not sure if you've seen this link: http://sites.google.com/site/upatel8/personalitytype4. The levels of development on there are the most detailed of any I've seen.

 

[OrangeAppled]

I think 4's levels fit me better all the way through, not just in the average levels

This is a good point to consider. You should relate to most levels of your type at various points throughout your life. I can see myself in the 4 from the bottom to the top, depending on how stable I was/am. I may relate to aspects of other types, but not at every level.

 

[Thalassa]

Actually, there seem to be very few INFJs willing to admit to a 6 enneagram...but I think that has more to do with what people WANT to be, than anything else...

I thought I was supposed to be a 4 at first, but it just didn't fit (there are aspects I relate to, but overall it doesn't fit.) I'm not enough of a special snowflake.

I don't understand why people don't want to admit to being 6s. Is it because it's so common? I feel like 6 fits me so well, even better than 4, and I thought I was a 4 for a long time, but I was just one of those 4w3/6w7 mix-ups. 4w3 is still in my triad though.

I'm proud to be a 6.

I know an ISTJ 9 who could seem ISFP in some respects if you don't know him well (referring to the "look alikes" chart)...and I think it makes more sense than ISTP for him. He's extremely externally structured, is interested in controlling and managing his environment, has the Te wall up, can even be perceived as sarcastic and "mean" sometimes by his own family members apparently....but he has this strong, strong Fi value about, for example, staying very quiet and controlled and rational when other people are upset or yelling. He's also VERY introverted. He fits the 9 type perfectly in other aspects, and he's also obviously an Si/Te/Fi/Ne. Not ISFJ. Lacks Fe expression, much too emotionally detached from most people and things; the detachment is actually part of his barrier to avoid his 9-ish fear of loss and separation. He's about a level 5 or 6.

 

[Mal12345]

Well, maybe you're a really healthy 4, or maybe you really are a 5. I was a 5 for a while, but I was never fully satisfied with it because at one point I no longer fit into any of the levels of development. I think 4's levels fit me better all the way through, not just in the average levels.

By the way, I'm not sure if you've seen this link: http://sites.google.com/site/upatel8/personalitytype4. The levels of development on there are the most detailed of any I've seen.

I will look into the type 5 page of that site. I attribute my original type 4 call to a wing that was overpowering my main type.

Edit - the levels of development descriptions are not as detailed as those in Personality Types.

 

[brainheart]

Excellent question. I would say - nothing. The type 4 qualities I had previously just vanished one day. The day before they up and left, I was like this:
http://www.enneagraminstitute.com/typefour.asp

and the next day I was no longer like that.

Not that I think you're a four, at all, but part of becoming a healthy four is stopping thinking like that. I get healthy, and then I find myself questioning my type. So I do all this soul searching, then have a day of doom and gloom and remember, oh yeah... I'm a four. So the key is just getting over all that and no longer being trapped by my idea of who ' the real me' is, just accepting the four vulnerabilities and then transcending them.

 

[Mal12345]

This is a good point to consider. You should relate to most levels of your type at various points throughout your life. I can see myself in the 4 from the bottom to the top, depending on how stable I was/am. I may relate to aspects of other types, but not at every level.

Even level 1?

 

[OrangeAppled]

Even level 1?

Level 1 in which direction (top or bottom)? I didn't say or mean every aspect of every level; I meant many aspects of most levels. I realize many of us haven't hit rock bottom or reached self-actualization .

 

[Thalassa]

Not that I think you're a four, at all, but part of becoming a healthy four is stopping thinking like that. I get healthy, and then I find myself questioning my type. So I do all this soul searching, then have a day of doom and gloom and remember, oh yeah... I'm a four. So the key is just getting over all that and no longer being trapped by my idea of who ' the real me' is, just accepting the four vulnerabilities and then transcending them.

I'm sure it's that way with any enneagram type. You think "oh I'm totally past all the negative associations with this enneagram." Because all of the enneagrams do pretty much focus on weak points.

Here's me as a nutcase:

Level 6: To compensate for insecurities, they become sarcastic and belligerent, blaming others for their problems, taking a tough stance toward "outsiders." Highly reactive and defensive, dividing people into friends and enemies, while looking for threats to their own security. Authoritarian while fearful of authority, highly suspicious, yet, conspiratorial, and fear-instilling to silence their own fears.

Anyone recognize that person?

I identify with healthier levels than 6 though, I'm periodically healthier or happier, depending on phases of my life, I think I've gotten all the way up to Level 2, even with slight glimpses of Level 1 for short periods of time.

Then I have a bad day and act like a level 6. I've even seen 7. I think am at around a 5 right now.

I don't think it's like you start at average and work your way up to level 2 or 1, and then live happily ever after. I'm pretty sure that's not how it works at all, though it could for some people, people simply are not at "their best" every single day, no matter how healthy they are or how much therapy they've had.

 

[Mal12345]

Not that I think you're a four, at all, but part of becoming a healthy four is stopping thinking like that. I get healthy, and then I find myself questioning my type. So I do all this soul searching, then have a day of doom and gloom and remember, oh yeah... I'm a four. So the key is just getting over all that and no longer being trapped by my idea of who ' the real me' is, just accepting the four vulnerabilities and then transcending them.

As you said, I'm not a four, and I'm not in that place you're describing. And at the time I found that I was not a 4, I would still engage in whipping my emotions into an intense frenzy in an effort to master them. That continued until the day I hit bottom, and was forced to recognize that maybe this wasn't such a good thing to do with my emotions.

But I've had different relationships with my emotions down through the years. When I was about 10 years old I made a rational, conscious decision to stop crying when I was hurt, based on the reasoning that crying doesn't make anything better. And so I stopped.

These decisions are much easier at that age, before everything in the psyche is set and stone, when the mind becomes just one big bundle of ingrained habits that are extremely difficult to change. So it's difficult to see how you can simply 'stop thinking like that.' The adult mind isn't that flexible, and most so-called willpower is just a delusion. Strengthening the will is required before progress can be made.

 

[Mal12345]

Level 1 in which direction (top or bottom)? I didn't say or mean every aspect of every level; I meant many aspects of most levels. I realize many of us haven't hit rock bottom or reached self-actualization .

I thought you said you had been at every level of the type 4. Never mind.

 

[brainheart]

As you said, I'm not a four, and I'm not in that place you're describing. And at the time I found that I was not a 4, I would still engage in whipping my emotions into an intense frenzy in an effort to master them. That continued until one day I hit bottom, and was forced to recognize that maybe this wasn't such a good thing to do with my emotions.

But I've had different relationships with my emotions down through the years. When I was about 10 years old I made a rational, conscious decision to stop crying when I was hurt, based on the reasoning that crying doesn't make anything better. And so I stopped.

These decisions are much easier at that age, before everything in the psyche is set and stone, when the mind becomes just one big bundle of ingrained habits that are extremely difficult to change. So it's difficult to see how you can simply 'stop thinking like that.' The adult mind isn't that flexible, and most so-called willpower is just a delusion. Strengthening the will is required before progress can be made.

Spoken like a true introverted thinking five... some of us like the messiness of life.

 

[pure_mercury]

I am apparently a 2w3 Sx/So. Is that weird for an ExFJ?

 

[Thalassa]

Being a 2 or 3 or 2w3 or 3w2 would be extremely common for ESFJ.

 

[Thalassa]

When I was about 10 years old I made a rational, conscious decision to stop crying when I was hurt, based on the reasoning that crying doesn't make anything better. And so I stopped.

Actually it releases toxins from your body (including your own emotional/hormonal "toxins" in the form of negative feelings) so it does serve a health purpose and it's perfectly rational to cry. It's a release.

But I can see how a little boy would think that, since it didn't serve any purpose he could see.