Changing Enneagram Type?

[chasingAJ]

I'm just curious to know how flexible this test is because each time I have taken it, I have gotten a different type. First it was 5, then 8 and then 1. This MBTI is always INTJ though, even when I feel like I'm being totally honest and open about my emotional self.

I see info about 4w5 or 5w6 or whatever but what about 8w1 or 8w5? Am I off the path here?

IMO Enneagram has given me a fraction of the insight that MBTI did... am I the only one who has this problem... IE a stable MBTI and fluctuating Enneagram?

 

[poppy]

Enneagram says that people move in "directions of growth" where they become more like a different type. For a 5 that direction is towards 8. There is some flexibility, although it's different than the wings.

But yeah, enneagram is generally a much less consistent system.

 

[chasingAJ]

That was very helpful Poppy, thank you. I hadn't found that information anywhere. I can see myself moving from 5 toward 8 but not the strong and overly aggressive unhealthy type 8... that scares me.

 

[BlackCat]

Enneagram type doesn't change. But yeah basically what poppy said.

 

[Metamorphosis]

Enneagram type doesn't change. But yeah basically what poppy said.

That's difficult to believe.

It seems to me that enneagram type is more about behavior while MBTI type is more about thought process.

I see info about 4w5 or 5w6 or whatever but what about 8w1 or 8w5? Am I off the path here?

Wings are only one number off from the type in either direction.

 

[Asterion]

I'm just curious to know how flexible this test is because each time I have taken it, I have gotten a different type. First it was 5, then 8 and then 1. This MBTI is always INTJ though, even when I feel like I'm being totally honest and open about my emotional self.

I see info about 4w5 or 5w6 or whatever but what about 8w1 or 8w5? Am I off the path here?

IMO Enneagram has given me a fraction of the insight that MBTI did... am I the only one who has this problem... IE a stable MBTI and fluctuating Enneagram?

Tests wont help you much with the enneagram, learn the system from the basics up and it'll become more usefull than MBTI ever was... or at least it'll be more interesting than MBTI ever was...

In my experience, the tests have only ever been right 1 in 3 times... which is quite the coincidence

 

[Asterion]

That's difficult to believe.

It seems to me that enneagram type is more about behavior while MBTI type is more about thought process.

Enneagram is about motivations and 'psychological defence mechanisms' (<-- as many people have said). MBTI covers the how, enneagram covers the why.

Wings are only one number off from the type in either direction

why do so many people have trouble with that...

 

[Space_Oddity]

Enneagram is about motivations and 'psychological defence mechanisms' (<-- as many people have said). MBTI covers the how, enneagram covers the why.

This is just a side note, but I don't think any of the systems presented here covers the why. Enneagram is a better description of the how than MBTI, but it still doesn't explain how the motivations and "psychological defense mechanisms" were developed.

Just as one can't say "he behaves like that because he's an ENFJ" (obviously people do it, but it's completely self-explanatory - one has to look at what makes the person an ENFJ), one can't really say "he behaves like that because he's Enneagram this and this". It describes the person well, but it doesn't explain them. I believe people don't become their types out of this air. It has very deep psychological reasons, and only understanding these reasons will make one understand the person in depth.

 

[compulsiverambler]

I'm just curious to know how flexible this test is because each time I have taken it, I have gotten a different type. First it was 5, then 8 and then 1. This MBTI is always INTJ though, even when I feel like I'm being totally honest and open about my emotional self.

I see info about 4w5 or 5w6 or whatever but what about 8w1 or 8w5? Am I off the path here?

IMO Enneagram has given me a fraction of the insight that MBTI did... am I the only one who has this problem... IE a stable MBTI and fluctuating Enneagram?

Don't worry about the tests, they're just supposed to be rough guides to the several types you're most likely to be and even Riso and Hudson say theirs turns out to be accurate only about 80% of the time. The best way to decide your type is to learn and understand exactly what the types are all most afraid of and the set of strategies for dealing with it that they're most attached to. I've not seen any websites that do this adequately. It's much better to read a few books on the subject.

 

[chasingAJ]

This has been an interesting thread (at least to me). I agree with the idea that the why isn't so easily pinpointed. I tend to think of these personality theories as a decoder ring for our most natural or comfortable way of behaving. I always believed in nurture as opposed to nature, then I had a child and was really floored by her behaviors that seemed to come out of nowhere from birth. It seems to me that personality is somewhere in the middle. MBTI may explain the most comfortable way of operating and Enneagram the motivator for those coping skills but I see the why as a unique and individualistic thing.


What fascinates me the most is that with so many people in the world and so many experiences (both positive and traumatic) we end up with so few basic ways of handling life. I often wonder if our children or our children's children will have different personality types, if this too will evolve. Perhaps I am admitting to the lack of recent reading on these topics but I'm more of an explorer of ideas than a verbatim reader.

 

[OrangeAppled]

I get the impression enneagram is more flexible as it describes behavior/motivations, and I think those can change; I'd be surprised for a person to drastically change though, which is why certain numbers are associated with certain MBTI types. Ennegram seems to have "healthy" and "unhealthy" modes, and change seems to be more in the way of becoming balanced or becoming imbalanced.

However, MBTI really boils down to cognitive functions, and I don't think the orientation of your thought process changes. I think your behavior can make it appear as those they have, but that would be more related to enneagram.

 

[Asterion]

This is just a side note, but I don't think any of the systems presented here covers the why. Enneagram is a better description of the how than MBTI, but it still doesn't explain how the motivations and "psychological defense mechanisms" were developed.

Just as one can't say "he behaves like that because he's an ENFJ" (obviously people do it, but it's completely self-explanatory - one has to look at what makes the person an ENFJ), one can't really say "he behaves like that because he's Enneagram this and this". It describes the person well, but it doesn't explain them. I believe people don't become their types out of this air. It has very deep psychological reasons, and only understanding these reasons will make one understand the person in depth.

I think you're right, the two theories are the same in that manner, you work out that he's an ENFJ by looking at his actions and trying to see his thoughts, you basically just categorize him as an ENFJ, that doesn't explain why he's an ENFJ of course, he just is because he thinks that way. You can look at what makes him an Extravert, but the answer will always be uncertain.

The enneagram will describe an enneagram 8, and then explain that he feels that he needs to have control of his surroundings and therefore he acts in a certain way. But it can't say why he needs to feel that he has control over his surrondings. It's either complex or it's just built into ones personality, and that's exactly the same as the dichotemies given in MBTI.

 

[Bubbles]

This thread makes me wonder... I'd like to ask if anyone ever felt that their enneagram type was up for changing. Frankly? I don't think I'll ever stop being a 4w3. I think I'll certainly grow (and occasionally, regress) in my stages of health, but I don't see myself becoming a completely different type. I've explained this system to several people I know, and they tell me the same thing--that this pinpoints their motivations nicely and that it's always been this way for them. (Both adults and college students I've explained it to have claimed as such.)

I'd like to throw out here the idea that motivations of the enneagram are also coping mechanisms, developed as we grow, and as with any mechanism, the more it's used the more we rely on it. Of course, becoming healthy in enneagram requires stepping out of the tiny box of your type and learning from the other types around you. We must remember that our type is us at our base. A 4 is preoccupied with becoming a unique and beloved individual, but that doesn't mean all 4s treat themselves as superior or that they don't realize that they're only about as interesting as everyone else. Not all 3s steamroll each other to be the best, not all 9s shy from conflict, etc etc. We learn to overcome our basest instincts--because if we don't, we let them rule our judgments. That's, in essence, what enneagram is about.

Don't worry about the tests, they're just supposed to be rough guides to the several types you're most likely to be and even Riso and Hudson say theirs turns out to be accurate only about 80% of the time. The best way to decide your type is to learn and understand exactly what the types are all most afraid of and the set of strategies for dealing with it that they're most attached to. I've not seen any websites that do this adequately. It's much better to read a few books on the subject.

I had to read a whole book cover-to-cover to figure this system out. And now I've got two more to read through.

 

[FDG]

You can change enneagram type, sure. If you were mistyped in the first place.