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  1. #1
    ϚᗩᑎᑕTᑌᗩᖇY Luminous's Avatar
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    Default How do you experience your type's center? (Anger, Shame, Fear?)



    From The Enneagram Institute:
    Each type results from a particular relationship with a cluster of issues that characterize that Center. Most simply, these issues revolve around a powerful, largely unconscious emotional response to the loss of contact with the core of the self. In the Instinctive Center, the emotion is Anger or Rage. In the Feeling Center, the emotion is Shame, and in the Thinking Center, it is Fear. Of course, all nine types contain all three of these emotions, but in each Center, the personalities of the types are particularly affected by that Center’s emotional theme.
    If you are an 8, 9, or 1, how do you experience anger and instinctual energy?
    If you are a 2, 3, or 4, how do you experience shame?
    If you are a 5, 6, or 7, how do you experience fear/anxiety?

    Is it your most often felt emotion? Is it your strongest emotion? The hardest to deal with? Do you struggle more with it than others? How often are you in that state?



    Does your experience match up with the above?
    There is a crack in everything
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  2. #2
    tapping out MovinOut's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Luminous View Post
    If you are a 5, 6, or 7, how do you experience fear/anxiety?
    6: I don't remember ever not being scared or anxious.

    I think fear is always in the back of my mind, no matter what I do. Once in a while I am able to push through it, but it's constantly there, making me overthink nearly everything I do, or causing me to feel unnecessarily jittery and uncomfortable. I don't know what it would be like to not be anxious.

    Is it your most often felt emotion?
    Probably... but I think shame is always constantly there in my life too. Unless I'm confusing shame with guilt. I just find myself to be as defective of a person, as much as I am scared of certain things.

    Is it your strongest emotion?
    I think that the strongest of the three would be anger. I probably experience it the least of the three (although still a lot), but I notice anger most when it does occur. I also sometimes feel that my fear and shame turn into anger at times, blending into a huge hybrid monster of negativity.

    The hardest to deal with?
    I think that all three are extremely hard to deal with. I'm not sure which would be hardest.

    Do you struggle more with it than others?
    I would think so.

    How often are you in that state?
    All the time.

    Does your experience match up with the above?
    "Repressed" doesn't seem like such an accurate word in my case, unless I am understanding it incorrectly. It's more like I've gotten used to it and I've accepted it as a constant part of my life. I'd actually rather use "Internalized" to describe my experience with fear and anxiety for the most part, although I have been to known to lash out during times I perceive myself to be immediately threatened.

  3. #3
    Senior Member neko 4's Avatar
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    I feel a lot of shame because I have not lived a "normal" life, which gives me the impression that I'm being judged. When others think negatively about me, I'm influenced by them. The shame probably is more from my mental illness than being a Four though.
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  4. #4
    Inactive For A Bit RadicalDoubt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Luminous View Post
    If you are an 8, 9, or 1, how do you experience anger and instinctual energy?
    I am a 9 and I would relate my angers to the tides. It comes in and it's all I can think of, it goes away and I forget it was ever there. Instinctual energy is very similar, though I would consider myself very disconnected from my instincts in general, which is fitting for being an attachment type. [/QUOTE]

    Is it your most often felt emotion? Is it your strongest emotion?
    No (guilt is, and I think that goes more with shame than anger, unless you count that as self anger in which case it is). When I am in touch with it is is blinding though and it is the singular emotion that has actually moved me forward in life/the emotion I can most connect with what I have done and what has motivated me to do those things. I struggle to rate the fixations though, because I feel shame, fear, and anger a lot haha. [/QUOTE]

    The hardest to deal with? Do you struggle more with it than others?
    They're all really hard for me to deal with tbh, but I do struggle with anger more than the others just because it is so inconsistent (ie. I struggle maintaining it because repression is probably just easier or I don't want to be bothered by it unconsciously) and when it does finally break free it's difficult to get past.

    How often are you in that state?
    This is hard to gauge, always and never honestly haha.

    Does your experience match up with the above?
    Very much so, I can see myself being somewhere between repressing and internalizing my anger, and I am 9w1 so that works.

  5. #5
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    I definately feel pressure from my peers to perform. Since I can't help comparing myself to others. I do feel shame if I felt like I didn't meet a basic standard that I need, in order to be percieved a certain way. Like, if someone came to my house and said it was boring. I would probably be offended lol. I also wouldn't say it is my strongest emotion.
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  6. #6
    Complex paradigm Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Luminous View Post

    If you are an 8, 9, or 1, how do you experience anger and instinctual energy?



    Well, I kinda lie to myself about these kinds of things but at the end of the day I am pretty evidently instinctual type in internal structure. This is because the anger is repressed and generally internalized. The problem is that I don't really fulfill certain US cultural norms that are all over typology, but I am evidently anger based person when you sum it all up (1w9 to be exact). Actually I was often comparing myself to you and thought "If Lumi is anger based then what am I?". Since I am evidently more angry person than you, even if most people have no direct idea about it at face value (since in this case my wing and both of fixes are camouflage types).


    Therefore in practical sense I am pretty rigid and high on standards. There are situations in my life when it is obvious that everyone gets more serious just by realizing that I am coming their way. Or they do preventive "It wasn't me! It wasn't me!" as soon as I come into room. Plus I am the guy that made a new schedule for my teachers when thing got messed up. Basically out of everything I can make a decent working plan and I am basically "stabilizer" and lecturer almost everywhere where I show up and engage. What is all powered up from intense internal source. I even got accused that I lecture the lecturers. What was true at the time and incompetent leadership really really annoys me.



    Also over the years I used gaming as the channel to blow out some of this energy. From clearing crypts to the last monster to building armies and conquering positions while keeping budgets under control. Since often I have the need to strongly move against something I dislike. Therefore despite generally strong intellect I don't mind getting dirty to solve practical problems. Also I have phantasies about organizing trials for the people that evidently did something wrong on the large scale. Kinda creepy by the standards of most people but I can't help myself. Over the years I made a number of posts of me being e1 and when you throw away cultural stuff it is pretty obvious that this is what I am. If anything simply because I am evidently anger based and the processing of it clearly goes in the direction of e1 out 3 gut types. Plus my gut feeling seem to be quite good in seeing where things are generally going, even if the facts aren't fully clear. After all I am capable of making my order out of mess, so I can manage most situations by running on gut instinct if I have to. Also I have clearly above average ability to position myself in space well (I can even do it by the stars if I have to). Since being directly engaged with the real world is quite important to me despite how much I intellectualize along the way.




    Is it your most often felt emotion?
    Yes.


    Is it your strongest emotion?
    Yes.



    The hardest to deal with?
    Actually I kinda enjoy it. Especially since it keeps me going despite all the problems that are coming my way and for me there is direct link between anger and happiness. Since for me the happiness usually comes out of product of anger that is getting things right or done. Not to mention that without it I am kinda colorless and boring. Plus since I use it for constructive purposes I don't really suffer due to it. I suffer more when there is none of it. Because that usually means that I am either tired or kinda depressed.


    How often are you in that state?
    Anger and it's variations like frustration or being annoyed are at least 2/3 of my emotional life. Although not that often it is fully conscious and from outside mostly it can only be seen in energy or how my sentences are constructed. Therefore people can get stressed around me on the longer run.





    Does your experience match up with the above?


    I would say this is generally correct.
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  7. #7
    ϚᗩᑎᑕTᑌᗩᖇY Luminous's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Virtual ghost View Post
    Well, I kinda lie to myself about these kinds of things but at the end of the day I am pretty evidently instinctual type in internal structure. This is because the anger is repressed and generally internalized. The problem is that I don't really fulfill certain US cultural norms that are all over typology, but I am evidently anger based person when you sum it all up (1w9 to be exact). Actually I was often comparing myself to you and thought "If Lumi is anger based then what am I?". Since I am evidently more angry person than you, even if most people have no direct idea about it at face value (since in this case my wing and both of fixes are camouflage types).


    Therefore in practical sense I am pretty rigid and high on standards. There are situations in my life when it is obvious that everyone gets more serious just by realizing that I am coming their way. Or they do preventive "It wasn't me! It wasn't me!" as soon as I come into room. Plus I am the guy that made a new schedule for my teachers when thing got messed up. Basically out of everything I can make a decent working plan and I am basically "stabilizer" and lecturer almost everywhere where I show up and engage. What is all powered up from intense internal source. I even got accused that I lecture the lecturers. What was true at the time and incompetent leadership really really annoys me.
    This amused me because I am quite likely also more angry than people realize, though my response is definitely different than yours. I can also be rigid and have high standards, though this has softened a lot over my life, and no longer being under the same roof as my e8 (angry) father. And I know that some people, at least in the past, have felt the need to be on their best behavior around me (I didn't realize that at the time, however). I attributed it more to them not wanting to disappoint or corrupt me, though, rather than to not anger me. The latter is definitely possible, though. Moreso in the past than now, I think (and hope, since one of my most important values is to respect other's autonomy.) Your response about how anger is actually good for you is particularly interesting to me.

    Is it your most often felt emotion?
    This is difficult for me to answer because, like RadicalDoubt mentioned, it's like it's there and then I forget about it. I think it's possible I've felt it for so long that it is normalized. Anger, resentment, frustration, irritation those combined are definitely high on my list of emotions I experience often, at least.

    Is it your strongest emotion?
    It's one of the strongest, but I think love is the strongest, along with feeling protective of that which I care about (which could include fear of losing it). Though I guess being protective likely falls under the category of anger in that I am attempting to shield someone from whatever is wrong.

    The hardest to deal with?
    Mmm. One of them. Anxiety and fear of loss are the others. Earl Grey told me recently when I asked if I seemed like an angry person, "You have the capacity to it, but it seems that when you feel it, you react as if you had just fallen into sewage." That's very true. I don't like feeling it. At best, it feels a nuisance. It may be over something small and inconsequential, and I can ignore it and not act on it, but it's still affecting me internally. It may be over something I have no control over, and then I've struggled with knowing what the heck to do with it. I may lack impulse control and act in a manner that isn't congruent with who I am/want to be in response to it. I should try to look at it more like Virtual ghost and see how it can be used for good.

    Do you struggle more with it than others?
    Anxiety the most, anger second most. It's probably not as obvious to others. Or maybe it is to those who are around me all the time, since some of it does come out verbally, in the fact that I need to verbally process it sometimes. I try really hard not to rant, though, in part because my father did that ALL the time while I was growing up, and I know how awful it is to be around that.

    How often are you in that state?
    I guess there's usually some anger simmering somewhere inside me. Generally it's not ferocious. It's more a state of unhappiness with the state of the world and that there's little I can do to change it. Lately, more and more, though, I have been more free from it. I would rather be happy, and I am making conscious, deliberate effort to achieve that.
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  8. #8
    ϚᗩᑎᑕTᑌᗩᖇY Luminous's Avatar
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    Forgot to mention something I wanted to mention... not experiencing anger seems like a foreign concept to me. Recently, in a chat on Discord, Coriolis pointed that she may find something deplorable, and will do something to change it, but doesn't necessarily feel anger. Anger just genuinely rises up in my gut at such times. It doesn't feel like something I can stop from happening. I can attempt to channel it one way or another, but I can't entirely keep it from arising.
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  9. #9
    Complex paradigm Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Luminous View Post

    The hardest to deal with?
    Mmm. One of them. Anxiety and fear of loss are the others. Earl Grey told me recently when I asked if I seemed like an angry person, "You have the capacity to it, but it seems that when you feel it, you react as if you had just fallen into sewage." That's very true. I don't like feeling it. At best, it feels a nuisance. It may be over something small and inconsequential, and I can ignore it and not act on it, but it's still affecting me internally. It may be over something I have no control over, and then I've struggled with knowing what the heck to do with it. I may lack impulse control and act in a manner that isn't congruent with who I am/want to be in response to it. I should try to look at it more like Virtual ghost and see how it can be used for good.




    Well, at the end of the day anger is just fuel. You can use it for launching nukes all over the place or you can use it to launch a bunch of weather and communication satellites. What will connect people and lower weather induced damage. Personally I never realized why anger is seen as fundamentally bad thing. It can be used for very bad things but it isn't limited just to that. Strong determination usually scares most people but it can't be said that it is fundamentally bad thing.
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  10. #10
    shooting vultures Earl Grey's Avatar
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    How do you experience fear/anxiety?
    I don't pay attention to emotions much- even if you had asked me in the moment what I was feeling I tend to take a moment to figure out. It usually gets overshadowed by my thinking.

    Is it your most often felt emotion?
    Look at above- but, I don't think it's my most felt emotion. I notice however that I usually am not afraid in situations where other people are.

    Is it your strongest emotion.
    Definitely not.

    Is it the hardest to deal with?
    No?

    Do you struggle with it more than others?
    Look at above.

    How often are you in that state?
    I can't even recall.

    Does your experience match with the above?
    No.



    You know, based off my answers and going through everyone else's it's suddenly a bit clearer to me why I get typed the types I get in real life.
    Vallite King

    . . . for truth and peace you fight
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