Can't decide between 7 or 9. Haaalp!

[Lady_X]

Hi all! I've been gone for forever and had decided I was nine but I keep finding that I'm one of the first to confront an issue or assert myself in some way. Totally don't avoid confrontation.

Can I still be a nine?

[Luminous]

Hi!!! I have seen your posts around in older threads many, many times! So I'm excited to say hi!

I don't always avoid confrontation, either, and I'm a 9. Sometimes I do avoid it, and do the stubborn not-going-to-move thing that 9s do, sometimes I can be passive aggressive, and sometimes I just simply can't hold back when I have very strong feelings about something and not doing anything creates more internal tension than doing something.

How do you go about asserting yourself, why do you do it, and how do you feel about it afterwards?

[JocktheMotie]

Hey Hey! Welcome back

Both are optimistic types but sort of hard to confuse. ENXP types sometimes read as word for word expressions of type 7 so that's where there could be some overlap but the core fears are completely different. However, both types also distract themselves from their inner worlds by looking outward; 7s for psychic gluttony and 9s for immersive distraction from internal anxiety.

That you find yourself asserting and confronting issues could just be ENFPness. Standing up for your Fi values is a natural thing and just because you're not a doormat doesn't mean you're not a 9. You may have just...grown beyond the weakness of the type.

Is there anything about the 7 core fear that rings true?

[Lady_X]

Thanks both of you! And hi!! Jock good to see you're still here! 👋
I relate to both but I feel like I don't have a good enough understanding of either.
I think if I'm a 9 it makes sense that would make me a calmer enfp. I relate to being a pacemaker and feeling calm and serene as a natural state more than I'm exuberant and excitable like a 7 is described. Tho I am that. I just feel the other is more natural state.

the things I'm referring to tho are in a group either in person or online if someone says something I disagree with I'll be the first to say oh wow I completely disagree with you and here's why etc
my impression of nines is that they just wouldn't insert themselves in the middle of what could become a heated discussion.

[Boogie man]

I know a few 9's, both on- and offline, and every single one of them speaks up about injustices and when they see things as wrong.

Not all of them do this with equal levels of comfort - I think instinct and tritype and other factors come into play - but quietly or loudly, they all do it. The gut triad is about power after all. Power, being "there," taking up space, being heard. One 9, an So/Sx 9w1 I think, is the least likely of the ones I know to do it. But then I've known an So/Sp 9w1 who was extremely (vocally) opinionated.

Thing is, disagreeing with a standpoint or standing against someone's attitude - while these may be good and worthwhile cause in themselves - doesn't mean that the 9 is standing up for their needs. Especially the 1 wingers can take a more logical and righteous stance on things, while not necessarily addressing the more essential issue of the moment. And that is what is ultimately 9 about it: the not-addressing-the-essential.

I can't be much help of your dilemma between 7 and 9, I don't know much of your history with the types, but I thought I'd share my view on the opinionated 9. Barack Obama is considered by many (most?) to be a 9 - I think he's a 9 also - and he definitely doesn't shy away from arguing difficult and heated points! I would add Bernie Sanders to the list of opinionated 9's as well. Food for thought

[Luminous]

Thing is, disagreeing with a standpoint or standing against someone's attitude - while these may be good and worthwhile cause in themselves - doesn't mean that the 9 is standing up for their needs. Especially the 1 wingers can take a more logical and righteous stance on things, while not necessarily addressing the more essential issue of the moment. And that is what is ultimately 9 about it: the not-addressing-the-essential.

Could you please elaborate on what you mean by "essential"?

[Boogie man]

Could you please elaborate on what you mean by "essential"?

Well, type 9's sin is Sloth, and this relates to falling asleep to oneself. This slumber removes a sense of priority from one the most elemental human needs: being seen, heard, felt,.. having a presence. So one way to make oneself feel present, to feel seen and heard, is to assert oneself in discussions and be disagreeable. But the underlying anger may not have anything to do with the discussion itself: instead, the anger may be misdirected and may stem from a another problem altogether in the 9's life. So then addressing this other problem, the true source of the anger or frustration, would be addressing the essential.

Types 1 and 8 tend to chronically misdirect their anger towards perceived problems in their lives while missing the source of it, and thus they overexert themselves (gut issue) in this way. They are both a variation on type 9, and while type 9 tends towards under-exerting their presence, many can still choose "safe" (maybe this is my 6 perspective speaking :p ) venues to make themselves heard. Venues where it is accepted to be 'unruly' or disagreeable. But this doesn't mean that the true source of one's problems and anger get addressed.

[Lady_X]

I know a few 9's, both on- and offline, and every single one of them speaks up about injustices and when they see things as wrong. Not all of them do this with equal levels of comfort - I think instinct and tritype and other factors come into play - but quietly or loudly, they all do it. The gut triad is about power after all. Power, being "there," taking up space, being heard. One 9, an So/Sx 9w1 I think, is the least likely of the ones I know to do it. But then I've known an So/Sp 9w1 who was extremely (vocally) opinionated. Thing is, disagreeing with a standpoint or standing against someone's attitude - while these may be good and worthwhile cause in themselves - doesn't mean that the 9 is standing up for their needs. Especially the 1 wingers can take a more logical and righteous stance on things, while not necessarily addressing the more essential issue of the moment. And that is what is ultimately 9 about it: the not-addressing-the-essential. I can't be much help of your dilemma between 7 and 9, I don't know much of your history with the types, but I thought I'd share my view on the opinionated 9. Barack Obama is considered by many (most?) to be a 9 - I think he's a 9 also - and he definitely doesn't shy away from arguing difficult and heated points! I would add Bernie Sanders to the list of opinionated 9's as well. Food for thought

Okay that's awesome insight. Thank you. It is left out of every description I've read. I would guess I'm 9w8 sx/sp


And I'm more inclined to stand up for others or for ideas than I am for myself But I will of course if I care what they think I suppose.

This is really helpful. Thank you

[Officer Ed Powell]

Hey, welcome back. You won’t remember me but I liked your calm energy on the forum. I thought you were a 9.

[Virtual ghost]

9

The 7 thing is probably a fix and the ENFP part of you.