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  1. #31
    Softserve Ice Cream Agent Washington's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Deadpan View Post
    I have an even deeper understanding of type 4 fixation now. I posted about it in another thread yesterday.

    Sexual 4 is far from a pretty type though. I am allowed to say this because reasons.
    I can understand why you'd say that. But I think, the fact remains that all types, when normal to unhealthy, aren't exactly flattering descriptions. E.g. 7. Gut types have that viscereal thing going on, but look at 7. Addicts to worldly things as opposed to addicts towards trying to get an identity of sorts. Sure, we're the mental type, but being mental types just potentially means we delude ourselves a bit more than the others and pretend we know things others don't.

    Though, I do think that type 4 sx can have that ugly side that nerds online in particular relate to, and like with MBTI, people have the tendency to go "that's just how I am" once typed a certain way, as opposed to using it as a tool to better themselves. Not that the second choice is necessarily a better one, it's just more... productive I guess. There's a certain attraction to staying the same.

    I haven't read your post though, so I'm not sure which one you're talking about. Maybe I missed something essential.
    There's no love in fear.
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    Do we want to remind you of something? Yes: the world is good and we belong here.
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  2. #32
    Can't be satisfied. Peter Deadpan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ogata View Post
    I can understand why you'd say that. But I think, the fact remains that all types, when normal to unhealthy, aren't exactly flattering descriptions. E.g. 7. Gut types have that viscereal thing going on, but look at 7. Addicts to worldly things as opposed to addicts towards trying to get an identity of sorts. Sure, we're the mental type, but being mental types just potentially means we delude ourselves a bit more than the others and pretend we know things others don't.

    Though, I do think that type 4 sx can have that ugly side that nerds online in particular relate to, and like with MBTI, people have the tendency to go "that's just how I am" once typed a certain way, as opposed to using it as a tool to better themselves. Not that the second choice is necessarily a better one, it's just more... productive I guess. There's a certain attraction to staying the same.

    I haven't read your post though, so I'm not sure which one you're talking about. Maybe I missed something essential.
    What you have missed is what most people in the typology community miss, and that is a proper understanding of the fixations in depth. I don't say that in a judgmental way toward you in particular.

    There are a lot of good resources on the internet, but very few great resources. One has to go above and beyond to find the good stuff, and that takes time.

    In short, if anyone thinks sexual 4 (or 4 period) is a glamorous type, then they are sorely mistaken. And yes, all types have their ugly side, but no type is glorified as much and as consistently as type 4.

    Personally though, I still think most readily available descriptions of sexual 4 are mostly unflattering, often referring to intense outward anger, volatility, hateful competition, and hot and cold relationship games. So with that in mind, this is why I wonder why so many readily mistype as sexual 4.
    Perpetual mood


    “Sometimes I think I have felt everything I'm ever gonna feel.
    And from here on out, I'm not gonna feel anything new.
    Just lesser versions of what I've already felt.”


    - look it up yourself



  3. #33
    Softserve Ice Cream Agent Washington's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Deadpan View Post
    What you have missed is what most people in the typology community miss, and that is a proper understanding of the fixations in depth. I don't say that in a judgmental way toward you in particular.

    There are a lot of good resources on the internet, but very few great resources. One has to go above and beyond to find the good stuff, and that takes time.

    In short, if anyone thinks sexual 4 (or 4 period) is a glamorous type, then they are sorely mistaken. And yes, all types have their ugly side, but no type is glorified as much and as consistently as type 4.

    Personally though, I still think most readily available descriptions of sexual 4 are mostly unflattering, often referring to intense outward anger, volatility, hateful competition, and hot and cold relationship games. So with that in mind, this is why I wonder why so many readily mistype as sexual 4.
    I don't think it's a glamorous type, and enneatypes aren't really my forte.

    I simply think it is convenient for many to type as sx 4. It's easier for them to act this way without having to take accountability. It's like the N type of MBTI. People mistype and glamorise a certain trait so that they have an excuse to think of themselves as different, rare, or special. And so that they don't have to work on bettering themselves. Not talking about people on this forum either. Just in general.
    There's no love in fear.
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    Do we want to remind you of something? Yes: the world is good and we belong here.
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    Likes Peter Deadpan liked this post

  4. #34
    幽霊||๏ ɪɴᴀᴄᴛɪᴠᴇ
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    Is any type glamorous? Enneagram pretty much highlights negative, unhealthy mechanisms.

    9 - The pushover escapist
    8 - The sadist
    7 - The escapist who can't take life seriously
    6 - The needy, fearful dependent
    5 - The weakling who can't take on the world
    4 - The emotionally masochistic victim
    3 - The walking success facade
    2 - The manipulative strings attached giver
    1 - The holier than thou moralist

    How do you know they are mistyped, anyway?

  5. #35
    Can't be satisfied. Peter Deadpan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hexcoder View Post
    Is any type glamorous? Enneagram pretty much highlights negative, unhealthy mechanisms.

    9 - The pushover escapist
    8 - The sadist
    7 - The escapist who can't take life seriously
    6 - The needy, fearful dependent
    5 - The weakling who can't take on the world
    4 - The emotionally masochistic victim
    3 - The walking success facade
    2 - The manipulative strings attached giver
    1 - The holier than thou moralist

    How do you know they are mistyped, anyway?
    I would "like" this but I guess you turned that feature off?

    And I know most of them are mistyped because sexual 4 is a rare type and most self-proclaimed 4s are in fact not 4s at all, they just think they are because they misunderstand the type itself and think they must be one because they have feelings and feel different than other people and use the type to justify their pain.

    (Likes were automatically disabled for this post too, hmmm...)
    Perpetual mood


    “Sometimes I think I have felt everything I'm ever gonna feel.
    And from here on out, I'm not gonna feel anything new.
    Just lesser versions of what I've already felt.”


    - look it up yourself



  6. #36
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hexcoder View Post
    Is any type glamorous? Enneagram pretty much highlights negative, unhealthy mechanisms.

    9 - The pushover escapist
    8 - The sadist
    7 - The escapist who can't take life seriously
    6 - The needy, fearful dependent
    5 - The weakling who can't take on the world
    4 - The emotionally masochistic victim
    3 - The walking success facade
    2 - The manipulative strings attached giver
    1 - The holier than thou moralist

    How do you know they are mistyped, anyway?
    Weird. (Not your post.) Good list, which is why i wanted to say something (and Enneagram is organized around all those directions of integration/disintegration and has religious underpinnings, so of course it does include focus on a 'broken' end of spectrum) but yeah Likes are turned off. I wonder if my post will be missing the Like button.

    EDIT: Why, yes. Yes it is missing.

    Now my question is:
    1. Did one of the mods fat-finger a key?
    2. Is there a policy change to now remove Like buttons from new posts, that we haven't yet heard about?
    3. Did a new patch fubar the Like utility or reset some setting?
    Or some other nefarious reason?

    (Maybe this forum is a Type 4 SX... its identity thrives on the push-pull of manufactured drama? Wheee!)
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft
    Likes Luminous liked this post

  7. #37
    幽霊||๏ ɪɴᴀᴄᴛɪᴠᴇ
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Deadpan View Post
    I would "like" this but I guess you turned that feature off?

    And I know most of them are mistyped because sexual 4 is a rare type and most self-proclaimed 4s are in fact not 4s at all, they just think they are because they misunderstand the type itself and think they must be one because they have feelings and feel different than other people and use the type to justify their pain.

    (Likes were automatically disabled for this post too, hmmm...)

    Yeah, I've started disabling likes and also stopped liking posts. Not a fan of the feature. It's weird that likes were disabled for yours though.
    Fair enough reason, although I suppose that's true of every type (misunderstand the type), albeit for different reasons (not about emotional pain, etc). I think others also mistype their peers for the same reason...lol, like I have seen people mistake my mood disorder symptoms for Sx E4 before, and it always kind of annoys me because in reality I despise the intensity of my emotions and am constantly seeking to escape from it, detach from it, control it, and so forth...or I / others suffer consequences if I get caught up in them. I find that I easily envy those who don't feel as intensely as I do, it's a fucking curse to me...but people come along and assume things or slap labels on me anyways based upon their limited understandings: "presence of intensity = drama king who wants attention and craves that intensity" and meanwhile I'm actually over here legitimately suffering from bipolar or bpd or whatever. But...people like their boxes and labels. Typology just gives a lot of people a tool to judge people faster or more presumptuously with. That's one thing I actually can't stand about it. It frequently removes the true "why" from the "what" they are observing by giving them preset configurations despite the fact that people are not always doing it for any of those quite limited options they are given. It's better to just think for yourself and ask questions, you get to know a person much better if you do...even though most people think they are learning to understand people better, but that's just because they are being given a list of traits they haven't yet explored while failing to consider the other ones outside of the system that they haven't. Yes, new things are presented...buuuut unfortunately (or fortunately, however you perceive it), human beings are more complex than a personality construct comprised of 9 generalized overviews of classifications.




    Quote Originally Posted by Totenkindly View Post
    Weird. (Not your post.) Good list, which is why i wanted to say something (and Enneagram is organized around all those directions of integration/disintegration and has religious underpinnings, so of course it does include focus on a 'broken' end of spectrum) but yeah Likes are turned off. I wonder if my post will be missing the Like button.

    EDIT: Why, yes. Yes it is missing.

    Now my question is:
    1. Did one of the mods fat-finger a key?
    2. Is there a policy change to now remove Like buttons from new posts, that we haven't yet heard about?
    3. Did a new patch fubar the Like utility or reset some setting?
    Or some other nefarious reason?

    (Maybe this forum is a Type 4 SX... its identity thrives on the push-pull of manufactured drama? Wheee!)

    I have no idea why it's disabled that way automatically for you guys. I guess perhaps it's some sort of error since you're quoting me? I don't know. Lmao the list of reasons and last comment, though.

    Oh, yeah...honestly, Integration and "Health Level 1" might be the only real positives in the entire Enneagram system, then we wonder why we're all getting buttmad when we're mislabeled according to our own self-perceptions.

  8. #38
    Da Voodoo Boogie man's Avatar
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    Multiple factors are at play. There is the age of the audience that is commonly attracted to online "self-discovery" personality forums. Hint: it's the age of developing a unique identity and of sexual development.
    Then there is the top-down drip of shallow "teachings."

    This guy, David Fauvre, Enneagram "teacher," types at Sx 4. Sexual. Image. "Hate / Competition." Sx 468 at that... He's as 9 as they come.


    Seriously...

    Him and Katherine Fauvre (who self-types at Sx 874 when her 3 is glaring: 'cold' business woman), two halves of the same coin, are endorsed by the Enneagram Institute - by the Enneagram lord and savior Russ Hudson himself. Russ self-types at 5w4 (he's 5w6 really..) with 458 tritype. See a pattern here?



    Guess his heart fix. Right. It's type 2. The "5 who gives."
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  9. #39
    ∂ιѕgяα¢є∂ ¢σѕмσηαυт Luminous's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boogie man View Post
    Multiple factors are at play. There is the age of the audience that is commonly attracted to online "self-discovery" personality forums. Hint: it's the age of developing a unique identity and of sexual development.
    Then there is the top-down drip of shallow "teachings."

    This guy, David Fauvre, Enneagram "teacher," types at Sx 4. Sexual. Image. "Hate / Competition." Sx 468 at that... He's as 9 as they come.


    Seriously...

    Him and Katherine Fauvre (who self-types at Sx 874 when her 3 is glaring: 'cold' business woman), two halves of the same coin, are endorsed by the Enneagram Institute - by the Enneagram lord and savior Russ Hudson himself. Russ self-types at 5w4 (he's 5w6 really..) with 458 tritype. See a pattern here?



    Guess his heart fix. Right. It's type 2. The "5 who gives."
    I'm curious. Do you think visual typing is good method?
    ✦ᏖᏒᎥᎮ ค ℓιɬɬℓɛ Ꮭıɠɧɬ ʄคŋɬคʂɬıƈ✦ -: ✦ :- ƒ O ᖇ G E ᗪ I ᑎ ƒ I ᖇ E ❋-: ✦ :-★ᴅᴏɴ'ᴛ ꜰᴇᴇᴅ ᴛʜᴇ ᴇᴇʟꜱ★
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  10. #40
    Da Voodoo Boogie man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Luminous View Post
    I'm curious. Do you think visual typing is good method?
    You can make a thread on it if you want, though I don't see the relevance of your question to my post. My intent was to discuss why Sx 4 is often a mistype magnet - and I believe the greatest source of this stems from mistyped Enneagram authors and teachers.

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