Atomic Fiend
New member
- Joined
- Nov 16, 2007
- Messages
- 7,275
Mod Edit: This thread has been pruned of all comments not directly related to the content of the subject movie, and moved out of the Graveyard. As it is now in Arts/Entertainment, on-topic comments will address the movie itself, its aesthetic qualities, technical aspects, marketing, role as social commentary, etc. If your post in the original thread was left in the Graveyard, feel free to repost whatever portion of those ideas falls within the topic as defined here.
I know that you can tell the difference between a small subset of people from a country that is created by immigrants on the back of a nation that was invaded, and took part of a slow genocide of it's natives, and then exploited human beings from other countries to further prop up the prosperity of that aforementioned nation only to (after using those human beings for several generations and prospering from all of the exploitation their ancestors took part in) hypocritically decide that all the things they have a indirect hand in enabling (By once again, coming from immigrants) , or that actually brought them to the dance on the global stage (diversity, democracy, and open trade), while espousing tradition. (which is using other nations people to further their own quality of life and wealth).
And a fictional country made in comics that has never gone outside of it's borders to begin with, exploited nothing but it's own resources, at a price to no one, and spoilers for the movie, if you read the comics you'd know this already:
Also Wakanda doesn't have a wall.
I will bring up an actual issue however, that is based on reality and not the wild musings of some troll who doesn't want someone to have nice things because it makes him feel bad.
There has been a lot of older sci fi fans who were groomed on the works of Tolkien and Roddenbery, who suddenly believe that fictional worlds don't matter and that they represent nothing in the real world, say nothing about it and as such can be discarded. For over 80 years the world of middle earth has allowed us entry to it via the page and the screen at the cinema, there we were able to see dozens of races that don't exist in our world interact with each with the only complaints being how long it would take before we could see them again. We're allowed to go to Westeros and watch political intrigue and battle after battle occur as we connect to and lose people we come to care about on an unreasonably personal level. We were able to chart the Alpha, Beta and delta quadrants with Kirk, Picard and Janeway, and hold Deep Space Nine with Sisko from the Dominion and of the complaints not one of them were "this couldn't exist."
And suddenly we have a film that is also science fiction and the biggest complaint isn't coming from people who've seen the movie, isn't about the quality of the CG in the scene when Killmonger and Panther are fighting the Vibranium caves, but that Wakanda, a nation created in science fiction comic books in the 1960s, can't exist and suddenly the film isn't worth watching because of that. That's a discussion I feel is one worth having.
It seems that suddenly you can only deal with the topic of race, if the race doesn't exist. Like with Bright, or District 9, or Avatar, however as soon as you have the races that have inspired those stories it suddenly becomes, counter intuitively so invalid.
I know that you can tell the difference between a small subset of people from a country that is created by immigrants on the back of a nation that was invaded, and took part of a slow genocide of it's natives, and then exploited human beings from other countries to further prop up the prosperity of that aforementioned nation only to (after using those human beings for several generations and prospering from all of the exploitation their ancestors took part in) hypocritically decide that all the things they have a indirect hand in enabling (By once again, coming from immigrants) , or that actually brought them to the dance on the global stage (diversity, democracy, and open trade), while espousing tradition. (which is using other nations people to further their own quality of life and wealth).
And a fictional country made in comics that has never gone outside of it's borders to begin with, exploited nothing but it's own resources, at a price to no one, and spoilers for the movie, if you read the comics you'd know this already:
Also Wakanda doesn't have a wall.
I will bring up an actual issue however, that is based on reality and not the wild musings of some troll who doesn't want someone to have nice things because it makes him feel bad.
There has been a lot of older sci fi fans who were groomed on the works of Tolkien and Roddenbery, who suddenly believe that fictional worlds don't matter and that they represent nothing in the real world, say nothing about it and as such can be discarded. For over 80 years the world of middle earth has allowed us entry to it via the page and the screen at the cinema, there we were able to see dozens of races that don't exist in our world interact with each with the only complaints being how long it would take before we could see them again. We're allowed to go to Westeros and watch political intrigue and battle after battle occur as we connect to and lose people we come to care about on an unreasonably personal level. We were able to chart the Alpha, Beta and delta quadrants with Kirk, Picard and Janeway, and hold Deep Space Nine with Sisko from the Dominion and of the complaints not one of them were "this couldn't exist."
And suddenly we have a film that is also science fiction and the biggest complaint isn't coming from people who've seen the movie, isn't about the quality of the CG in the scene when Killmonger and Panther are fighting the Vibranium caves, but that Wakanda, a nation created in science fiction comic books in the 1960s, can't exist and suddenly the film isn't worth watching because of that. That's a discussion I feel is one worth having.
It seems that suddenly you can only deal with the topic of race, if the race doesn't exist. Like with Bright, or District 9, or Avatar, however as soon as you have the races that have inspired those stories it suddenly becomes, counter intuitively so invalid.
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