Twin Peaks

[Z Buck McFate]

I wonder if dark cooper raped Audrey Horne in a coma and that's how we have that psycho asshole dude that's listed as a Horne in the credits.

Since reading this, I keep waffling back and forth between hoping that's not what happened and thinking I might be disappointed if it doesn't turn out to be the case.

I also can't get over how freaky dark cooper is. Dale Cooper was such an iconic and incredible character that balanced immense skill and instinct and spiritual guidance with a relentless optimism and moral code and sort of childish sense of wonder- that seeing it portrayed by an evil doppelganger that maintains all of the skill and instinct and spiritual guidance, but replaces the rest with a sinister and maelovant hate, is just so incredibly GAHH.

I am thoroughly impressed at how well Lynch did this. After seeing MacLachlan in some way less than impressive or intimidating roles over the past several years, I was worried he/Lynch wouldn't be able to effectively bring Cooper back. But holy shit.

 

[Z Buck McFate]

I'm not sure if Dougie will "wake up". He's had his coffee and now...PIE....what else did he enjoy? I'm thinking he needs to be back in Twin Peaks, near the Lodges to wake up. Again, not sure.

I do hope he wakes up soon, because this blank phase is starting to erode my enjoyment of the show (and the inconsistencies in his impairment are adding up and harshing my awe/suspension of disbelief - like when he said "hi" after spitting out the hot coffee.....I think simply opening his mouth to let the hot coffee out would have been better and funnier).

Once he had the pie, I'd started thinking it might either be Diane or some Deus Ex Machina / Black Lodge event. Were you thinking actual physical proximity to Twin Peaks? We should keep an active list to see how close one of us comes to guessing it.

I'm hoping it's the Deus Ex Machina-like Black Lodge event (which, done Lynch-style, would actually be more about symbolizing something inherent to human nature rather than some truly external force).

 

[ChocolateMoose123]

I'd totally forgotten about that until I read this^. So I watched it again. They didn't actually take it from his body - they hover over his body until half the orb rises out of C's abdomen, but they leave while it's sticking halfway out. So it's unclear whether or not they removed it. I'd kind of thought they 'activated the Bob' in him in order to bring him back? [I did forget about that scene though. And it's possible they did remove him.

Yeah. I can see it that way, too. On my way to find footage I googled video for "cooper gets shot" and it brought up the first series shooting of Cooper in his hotel room. I had forgotten about it. The giant visited him after. The bullet hit a wood tick (a parasitic creature). Which would be similar to those woodsmen. heh heh. Interesting connection/parallel? I need to re-watch the scene and see what the Giant says. It probably makes more sense now than then.

Yeah - the fact that the Doppleganger wasn't actually weakened is what leans me towards thinking Bob is still there. The whole "neutral position is the most comfortable position" scene and all.

I can't make heads or tails yet. Reminded me of first season when Laura says, "sometimes my arms bend back"....*shrug*

And with the woodsmen, before reading any of these other posts, that was precisely my vague impression of them. That they're general Bob activators/catalysts, like little pieces of shadow in the collective unconscious that move people to act on base impulses, to be puppets to their own unconscious. There's a Foucault quote coming to mind here (roughly): People often know what they do, they often know why they do what they do, but what they don't know is what what they do does. I kinda see the woodsmen as the invisible effect of shadow behavior, the residual emotional charge that wants to be released in an aggressive direction.

I agree! Although, I don't think I could express it as well as you just did here.

 

[burningranger]

Just when you think this show is going to get better...



...you get another weekly episode.

 

[Z Buck McFate]

Yeah. I can see it that way, too. On my way to find footage I googled video for "cooper gets shot" and it brought up the first series shooting of Cooper in his hotel room. I had forgotten about it. The giant visited him after. The bullet hit a wood tick (a parasitic creature). Which would be similar to those woodsmen. heh heh. Interesting connection/parallel? I need to re-watch the scene and see what the Giant says. It probably makes more sense now than then.



I can't make heads or tails yet. Reminded me of first season when Laura says, "sometimes my arms bend back"....*shrug*

This is exactly why I'm glad I found this thread - it was driving me crazy watching the show without anyone to bounce this type observation off of *and* I'd be missing out on all the observations I missed. There's a lot of stuff in the previous posts in this thread that I didn't bother quoting (because I find a whole lot of "I agree" posts to be distracting), but that I found really interesting nonetheless.

***

I decided to watch the movie last night, because I hadn't seen it in a while, and thought it might be handy to post some ring fyi:

In the movie, the last we see of Agent Chet Desmond (Chris Isaak) is when he sees the green ring under a trailer in Theresa Banks’ trailer park and reaches for it. (The trailer belonged to the old woman and the little boy in the next dream sequence - trailer park manager (Harry Dean Stanton) said their name was Chalfont, and other Chalfonts stayed there before them). Directly after Desmond disappears is the scene where Phillip Jeffries (David Bowie) shows up at the FBI office and some weird dream-ish stuff happens – and during the dreamish thing, before Jeffries disappears, The Arm said (in backwards), “With this ring, I thee wed.”

Later on the old woman and the boy give Laura Palmer a painting to hang on her wall (they appear while Laura is loading the car for Meals On Wheels, and then they disappear). That night (she hangs it on the wall) she has a dream that starts with walking through the door on the painting. It leads to camera shot that moves across the b/w zigzag floor up a gold painted table to show the ring (it’s the same exact shot that leads to the ring in a recent episode, I think it's when the ring disappears off Ray’s finger, after dark Cooper shoots him). The Arm holds the ring up to show Agent Cooper, and Agent Cooper warns Laura not to take the ring. (This is before she's actually met Cooper). Laura wakes with a numb left arm, holding the ring. Only she wasn’t really awake, she was still in the picture. When she woke up for real the next morning, she opened her hand and the ring wasn’t there.

Then later, something triggers a memory and Laura remembers seeing the ring from her dreams/visions on Theresa Banks’ finger before Banks was murdered.

Finally, in the train car where she's murdered, one-armed Mike shows up and throws the ring into the train car. She puts it on before she's killed.

 

[Z Buck McFate]

episode 14 (not using spoiler box)

[Episode 14 - not putting things under spoiler button]

Andy:

When Andy disappeared to (where is that b/w place? is it the White Lodge? this season started with Cooper in that same seat, when the giant told him "it's in our house now"), my first reaction was "Not Andy!!" I was afraid he was going to be stuck there for a while. I was glad the he came back almost immediately - and then I was glad Lynch chose him for that, although I'm not sure I'd be able to explain why. He seemed oddly assertive when he reappeared, carrying the woman (saying she was important, that she needed their protection). But it didn't last. He was back to his unassuming self by the end of the episode.

Some thoughts on why he was chosen: he's the most innocent (?) of all of them, and probably therefore most invisible/least susceptible to the woodsmen? I'm not sure innocent is the best word, since innocence is probably actually the easiest thing to corrupt. Andy is addle-minded and sensitive, but he's also just really nice. When people are mean to him and/or mean around him, he only points it out (instead of getting mean in return).

Fleshed-over eyes woman:

She's back! ...

The Fireman / aka the giant:

...because he tries to extinguish 'fire walk with me' kind of fire?

"Gotta light?"

One thing that's occurred to me about this is that there seem to be a lot of characters who smoke - which admittedly happens to be Lynch's style, but it is a vice that shows up a lot in this show. Human frailty leaves people very susceptible to a wide range of addictions - to behaviors, to substances, to experiences, anything to help people flee from a subjective experience they don't want to experience. People behave in parasitic ways without realizing it when they get caught up in that fleeing. Smoking is one of the clearest examples of that kind of fleeing (albeit one of the less parasitic vices).

eta: The words the 'gotta light' guys says - "This is the water and this is the well. Drink full, and descend" - it's like he's saying "do what feels good to flee from what feels bad, and descend further into the condition of being a puppet to your own subconscious. It's interesting that everyone listening literally loses consciousness. /eta

***

As an aside, there have been scenes I thought were super funny: that scene with Lucy, Andy and Hawk at the police station, looking at the evidence from Laura's murder case. I've watched that scene several times now, and it's still funny. Hawk: "It's not about the bunny! (long pause) Is it about the bunny? (pause) No, it's not about the bunny." I found that whole conversation completely hilarious.

Or that scene with the Mitchum brothers, when they're watching the news and find out the guy from the casino really is named Douglas Jones, and Rodney Mitchum yells, "What a fuckin' world!" That one made me laugh pretty hard too.

And probably half the scenes with Jerry Horne so far have been pretty funny. "I'm not your foot."

 

[chickpea]

 

[Z Buck McFate]

I forgot about that!

Also, that^. Laura did something like that in the first episode.

 

[anticlimatic]

I forgot about that! Also, that^. Laura did something like that in the first episode.

I knew that ceiling fan shot of the palmer house after the breakdown at the supermarket was a bad omen, but I didn't know how bad. I wonder if lynch uses loops and recursion set us on edge. Wasn't old lady palmer later that night listening to a boxing match clip on repeat? Any time things in this show start spinning or repeating themselves I always start to feel inexplicably panicked.

And speaking of feelings, I felt a thorough case of the creeps after realizing the significance of this "billy" character that had been under my nose the entire time, though I'm still not entirely sure what it is. Recal earlier in the season when Andy came to see him, but the dude who greeted him in the lawn insisted it was a bad time? The way the camera held on the open door to the black interior for a moment just to summon some kind of sense of dread. Then there was the dude who randomly ran into the diner at the end of another episode asking if anybody had seen billy, and how odd and creepy that scene felt for some reason (other than the fact that if you look closely it's a completely different set of customers in the middle of the scene- perhaps signaling an important 'change' where this billy is concerned), then there was the drama with Audrey being in love with him, and the final conversation this last episode between Tina's daughter and the other girl about the last sighting of billy with the fence leaping and the blood coming out of his mouth, which pretty much points to that Dougy-like "drunk" in the jail cell who seems to be a far cry from any apparent ladies man that we've been told he is- something is definitely changed about the guy alright.

 

[Aquarelle]

Also I'd just like to mention how much fan service lapdog me enjoyed the repeat performance of "just you and I" by James. That roadhouse has some crazy good live entertainment. I need to move to twin peaks.

Such a terrible, awful song and yet I LOVED seeing it performed at the Roadhouse. I was laughing my head off. And then it was in my head for a week. F*ck.

 

[ChocolateMoose123]

We learned that Diane is related to Dougie via marriage and during the debriefing, we hear of the Blue Rose and Tammy mention a Tulpa.


A Tulpa is a thoughtform, or being created from the collective thoughts of separate individuals. The concept of Tulpas is theoretical in nature and originates from Tibetan mythology, where Tulpas are described as extra bodies that were created from one person's mind in order to travel to spiritual realm

Sounds a lot like Doppleganger origins or the creation of Dougie!


Wow...Sarah Palmer really was surprising. I was not expecting that. She has always had supernatural abilities (she was able to see BOB in the original series, something only Laura could do). I wonder what is inside her or channeling through her. I'm curious as to what will be revealed.

Freddie's green bionic hand was interesting....I know based on previous episodes Mr C can't be killed by bullets and blunt head trauma seems to do the trick with these dopplegangers (Laura's dad killed himself by running into the jail cell walls). I'm wondering if there will be foreshadowing there.

Billy....and the naked lady.....

253 was definitely a number that repeated. Clock struck 253 when Mr. C came through the car lighter. In the purple room the blinded woman warned that it was almost late....seems a time that is overlapping again. I will have to google more. Good episode!

 

[Z Buck McFate]

This wasn't specifically about this past episode per se, but I noticed the eyeless woman is billed as Naido (since the first episode she appeared - meanings for the word here at TP's wiki). I wonder if she's something like the opposite of the 'mother' of Bob?

I recently watched Leland's original death scene. He was explaining what Bob wanted from Laura, and he said "they wanted to use her." I'll have to watch it again because this was about a week ago, there was more, but "they" stuck out to me.

[Episode 15]

I loved the opening with Ed and Nadine, and the way Nadine enthusiastically yelled "I'm shoveling my way out of the shit!" to explain why she was setting Ed free. I can't remember the last time I saw a scene more moving than when Ed went from stunned to elated - like "all my dreams will come true" elation - to heartbroken/devastated, and then back to elated. He's always been one of my favorites. And the way Shelly stood nearby reacting to their interaction - the same way Norma reacts to Shelly's life. Even though when someone does that to me in real life I find it beyond annoying, there's something sweet about the way it happens between Norma and Shelly. I loved everything about that opening.

Place above ghosty convenient store

I'm not willing to rewatch Fire Walk With Me to check (nor do I have the patience to search the vast wilderness of youtube), but the wallpaper on the walls reminded me of that picture given to Laura Palmer by the old woman and the little boy (the Chalfonts? if that's really their name, they lived in the trailer park in the movie and appeared in the series next door to the agoraphobic guy). The old woman told Laura the picture would look good on her wall, then later than night Laura dreamt she was there. Anyway, I think it might be the same place.

Black Lodge? Is the hotel just another place for people trapped there? Anyone have thoughts about it?

It looked to me like Evil Cooper was kicked out by some higher Black Lodge power - the phone rings, he answers it, suddenly he's outside the convenient store again. So Evil Cooper isn't *quite* as powerful a figure in the Black Lodge as he's previously appeared?

Phillip Jeffries

That big device in Jeffries' room - have we seen that before? It looks like the thing that was on top of the room Naido was originally in. I was half expecting to see Bowie. I've been surprised at how many scenes they managed to shoot with Catherine Coulson - she passed away in 2015. I'm kind of dreading the episode when Miguel Ferrer stops appearing, because Albert is another one of my favorites, but since he passed in January of this year maybe he made it through production. I hope so. It's been such a bittersweet thing, imo, to watch them thus far. I'll just admit, it kind of came to a head with me watching the scene with Hawk and Margaret when she called to say goodbye. (I totally cried, all the way through the next scene where Hawk tells everyone else in the station she passed).

Anyway, any thoughts on the device that Phillip Jeffries is either imprisoned in, or became, or some other thing?

Billy

Has it been confirmed the guy in the jail cell is Billy? At the very least it's been strongly inferred; one character describes the last time she saw him, with blood coming out of his mouth, and the guy in the cell has a continuous stream of blood dripping from his mouth.

The vegetative state he's in is a lot like the one Dougie Jones is in - only able to repeat the last thing someone said to him or that he overhears. (Unless he actually is communicating with Naido).

Dougie's Fork Adventure

I'm really hoping this means we'll finally get Cooper back. That look on his face when he heard "Gordon Cole" was completely new. I think we've only got 2 or 3 more episodes, and I miss Cooper.

And the look on Dougie's face when he stuck the handle of the fork in the outlet bumps the scene into my personal "5 funniest moments" list.

eta: Green hand with enhanced strength

I reminds me of Nadine's sudden enhanced strength in the original series. I'm at a loss for possible interpretations. Sudden super strength given to an otherwise totally unremarkable person.

 

[Z Buck McFate]

I knew that ceiling fan shot of the palmer house after the breakdown at the supermarket was a bad omen, but I didn't know how bad. I wonder if lynch uses loops and recursion set us on edge. Wasn't old lady palmer later that night listening to a boxing match clip on repeat? Any time things in this show start spinning or repeating themselves I always start to feel inexplicably panicked.

I'm getting this feeling from the Audrey scenes. There's something bizarrely circular about her conversations with that guy (who I guess is her husband?). If she's not literally trapped in a bad place (coma), then she's trapped in some really bad circular logic.

 

[anticlimatic]

I am so happy I could girl squeal.

Fascinating revelations that episode. My notes and questions:

Apparently the black lodge can crank out tulpas with a little sample of someone and the seed. A new dougie seems to have been ordered for production. If that wasn't the real Dianne, where IS the real Dianne? Is she trapped somewhere- like at that motel with Phillip Jeffries? Dead...?

Cooper is saying all the right things as always.

Big props to MD for calling it on Audrey- more or less. Is she in a coma, or is she trapped somewhere else? Is the roadhouse the white lodge? Has it all been audrey's dream this whole time a-la mulholland drive? That would explain the surreal and high quality music- and all the odd very odd very very odd odd things that transpire there; dreamy beautiful with an undercurrent of something wrong and rotten. Coma seems like the most likely. Sonny Jim even said it- "people can be in comas for years."

That whole scene creeped me the F out soooo bad. I had originally thought to myself- 'if Audrey shows up at the road house, we'll know she's not in a coma.' so when she did, I was like "Oh, ok. She's actually awake." Then the weird shuffling away by people for 'audrey's dance' which I didn't hear when he said it, but quickly figured it out once the music started playing. My stomach actually turned, that's how bad Lynch messed with my expectations. Especially the climax when things go dark and violent and she screams to get out and wakes up for a second... in a sanitorium? What was up with the mirror and the white?

What a shocking end for Hutch and his wife. Did not see that coming.

Richard was Dark Coop's kid after all- that he sent to his death via.....the guarded gateway to the white lodge?

 

[ChocolateMoose123]

I am so happy I could girl squeal.

Fascinating revelations that episode. My notes and questions:

Apparently the black lodge can crank out tulpas with a little sample of someone and the seed. A new dougie seems to have been ordered for production. If that wasn't the real Dianne, where IS the real Dianne? Is she trapped somewhere- like at that motel with Phillip Jeffries? Dead...?

I was under the impression that the tulpas are created deliberately by the dopplegangers (or maybe those who have passed through to the Lodges?) with those "seeds". The real Diane could be dead. OR - she did say, "I'm in the Sheriff station" "I'm not me" Who else is in the police station? Naido and Lucy. I mean, as far as women are concerned. My guess is some connection to Naido. Not sure. I did read that "Judy" and Naido could be same person. Does this mean Diane is Judy is Naido??

Cooper is saying all the right things as always.

Big props to MD for calling it on Audrey- more or less. Is she in a coma, or is she trapped somewhere else? Is the roadhouse the white lodge? Has it all been audrey's dream this whole time a-la mulholland drive? That would explain the surreal and high quality music- and all the odd very odd very very odd odd things that transpire there; dreamy beautiful with an undercurrent of something wrong and rotten. Coma seems like the most likely. Sonny Jim even said it- "people can be in comas for years."

You know, when she started dancing I couldn't help but think it was similar to Leland's dancing when possessed by BOB. I don't know. Dancing has never been a GOOD thing in TP. But she could be the "dreamer within a dream" that Monica Bellucci was referencing??

I hate for Lynch to be so on the nose like that, but he did the same thing in Mullholand Drive - only the whole movie was literally Naomi Watts character's brain dying from a suicide and the thoughts/feelings/imagery that passed through it so quickly on her way out. (My take anyway).

Seriously. The "It was only a dream" ....It's a tired trope that writers are told never to do it because it's so hackneyed. Only Lynch gets away with it because he's good at what he does.

That whole scene creeped me the F out soooo bad. I had originally thought to myself- 'if Audrey shows up at the road house, we'll know she's not in a coma.' so when she did, I was like "Oh, ok. She's actually awake." Then the weird shuffling away by people for 'audrey's dance' which I didn't hear when he said it, but quickly figured it out once the music started playing. My stomach actually turned, that's how bad Lynch messed with my expectations. Especially the climax when things go dark and violent and she screams to get out and wakes up for a second... in a sanitorium? What was up with the mirror and the white?

Not sure what that was....white lodge or dream or coma......

What a shocking end for Hutch and his wife. Did not see that coming.

Have a feeling that Zalinski accounting car was purposeful. Maybe a cog in that wheel of shadowy office types who control the box? Maybe taking those two out to clean up any connections? Not sure...

 

[ChocolateMoose123]

I'm not willing to rewatch Fire Walk With Me to check (nor do I have the patience to search the vast wilderness of youtube), but the wallpaper on the walls reminded me of that picture given to Laura Palmer by the old woman and the little boy (the Chalfonts? if that's really their name, they lived in the trailer park in the movie and appeared in the series next door to the agoraphobic guy). The old woman told Laura the picture would look good on her wall, then later than night Laura dreamt she was there. Anyway, I think it might be the same place.

Black Lodge? Is the hotel just another place for people trapped there? Anyone have thoughts about it?

[MENTION=7842]Z Buck McFate[/MENTION]

I really want to look into that old woman and the boy. I really think they are a large key in all of this but I haven't been able to have the time to look again at them. I do know they like their creamed corn! The young boy was also a witness to the meeting to divy up the garmonbozia between BOB, and The Arm above the convenience store. So, pretty evil entities, I think. Would the old woman be the young girl who ate the bug creature??

 

[Z Buck McFate]

Longer post forthcoming, but (just watched recent episode a 2nd time) wanted to quickly say I'm really impressed by how well Maclachlan brought Cooper back. And I am SO glad he's back.

Also, the Mitchum brothers grow on me more and more with every episode. When I first saw Jim Belushi, I wondered what the hell Lynch was thinking - but I've gone 180 on that. He and Knepper are great.

Oh - and [MENTION=5223]MDP2525[/MENTION] if it's helpful, I *think* the old woman and young boy (the Chalfonts?) only appear in the movie and in one episode. It's the episode where Donna takes over Laura's Meals On Wheels route, so probably somewhere in the middle of the first season. The old woman lifted the lid off the meal Donna brought her and expressed disappointment about the creamed corn; then suddenly the creamed corn was missing from the plate and the boy was holding it in his hand. And then much later, when Donna brought Cooper there, a younger woman answered the door and said she'd been the only resident for years.

Also, I would guess the old woman was actually too old to be the girl from episode 8? Because that aired around '90 - and she looked at least 70 years old. I would love if those characters came back in some form though.

 

[anticlimatic]

Regarding the old woman and mike, it seems possible for the black lodge/ other world entities to break "good." I don't remember why mike changed his ways from being bobs "familiar" (though I remember him mentioning it at some point), but I always suspected something similar happened with the old lady and the boy. The inhabiting spirits are likely ageless, so maybe the two found love? The whole thing confuses me a bit, especially when you factor The Arm into the equation. Bob and Mike were a duo, same as the old lady and the boy- but mike saw the light and broke good- though his arm wanted to stay evil so he cut it off and it became something new. This sounds like the behavior of plants more than mammals- and likely why the evolution of the arm looked like a plant. Or maybe a virus? Split and multiply. Bob inhabited Leland and mike inhabited Gerard, but we don't have any insight into who the old lady and the boy or their respective inhabiting spirits are- though I assume they're separate. Are the woodsman working for the spirits, or are the spirits working for the woodsman?

 

[ChocolateMoose123]

Regarding the old woman and mike, it seems possible for the black lodge/ other world entities to break "good." I don't remember why mike changed his ways from being bobs "familiar" (though I remember him mentioning it at some point), but I always suspected something similar happened with the old lady and the boy. The inhabiting spirits are likely ageless, so maybe the two found love? The whole thing confuses me a bit, especially when you factor The Arm into the equation. Bob and Mike were a duo, same as the old lady and the boy- but mike saw the light and broke good- though his arm wanted to stay evil so he cut it off and it became something new. This sounds like the behavior of plants more than mammals- and likely why the evolution of the arm looked like a plant. Or maybe a virus? Split and multiply. Bob inhabited Leland and mike inhabited Gerard, but we don't have any insight into who the old lady and the boy or their respective inhabiting spirits are- though I assume they're separate. Are the woodsman working for the spirits, or are the spirits working for the woodsman?

The BOB/MIKE thing:

You know how we know how BOB "looks"? We have never seen MIKE. We see him through Gerald (but is this any different from seeing BOB via Leland?) Anyway, just something I thought of. To me, his true form is still unknown.

Gerald via possession through MIKE claims to have had "seen the face of God" leading him to cut of his arm, which was tattooed with "fire walk with me". This became The Arm aka The Man From Another Place. AKA the electric tree with a brain attached.

MIKE had a beef with BOB over garmonbozia. (It's what the meeting above The convenience store was about). So MIKE/Gerald has played both sides. We know he undermined BOB because BOB was greedy and took more than his fair share of pain/sorrow. Leaving MIKE/Gerald to undermine his success and favor Cooper. However - we really don't know his allegiances.

I'll have more later. But when The Arm came to Cooper he said "one and the same" next time you see me I won't be me. Then Cooper's coffee changed from solid to liquid, etc. That's when Coop uttered the words "Fire Walk with me" (oh shit! I remember thinking that was the moment Cooper corrupted himself.)



More I think about it the more I think Cooper and Laura are brother/sister entities. Jeffries told Mr C that he *is* Cooper. I'm wondering if he is very much split down the middle. Both can create tulpas and have done so. Both have the same powers, although one is more "bad".

The tree screamed "non-existant" ....I really think Coop might be inhabiting two different bodies equally? There is no true doppelgänger?

I still can't wrap my head around it. But "non-existant" makes it seem like an abnormality happened and neither Cooper is Cooper.

 

[Z Buck McFate]

and likely why the evolution of the arm looked like a plant. Or maybe a virus?

I kind of thought the arm evolved into something that looked like a huge nerve cell.

Split and multiply. Bob inhabited Leland and mike inhabited Gerard, but we don't have any insight into who the old lady and the boy or their respective inhabiting spirits are- though I assume they're separate. Are the woodsman working for the spirits, or are the spirits working for the woodsman?

I'm under the impression the woodsmen are working for the spirits, in a sense - like they're all 'working for' that mother-thing that spit out Bob. Only I'm not at all sure it's a deliberate kind of 'working for' - kind of like bacteria (or whatever kind of) cells don't 'work for' a cold, they just kind of do what they do and it makes sickness thrive? (If that made sense).

Also, it only just occurred to me (maybe because of the above post) that maybe the old lady and the boy are the same entity - they're just different facets of what the entity is made of? They only appear together in the movie and episode 9 of the original series - but the boy (may or may not be same boy) appears several times under the creepy white mask. I think he was there when Leland died, and I think Cooper saw him more than a couple times in those visions he'd get of the Lodge. Has the mask appeared yet in this season? I don't remember.

The wiki pages say that the boy is a lodge spirit. (Are wiki pages reliable? They're made by fans aren't they?) When they appeared to Donna, the old lady referred to herself as Mrs. Tremond - but I think she was using the last name of the woman who actually lived there, instead of it being her own name. Then again, it's uncertain whether Chalfont is really her name either. But the trailerpark groundskeeper (Harry Dean Stanton ) said they'd lived there for a while (under Chalfont), and he said the folks who lived there before the old lady and her grandson where also Chalfont - so I'm inclined to think Chalfont is (if not being the actual name) more significant.

Wiki page on old lady. Wiki page on boy.

eta: Ooohhh - maybe they simply took the name Chalfont because it belonged to the people before them, just like they took "Tremond" from the actual resident who lived there. The Wiki pages on them are interesting. The little boy is actually David Lynch's son! It's funny, I totally thought "Damn, that looks exactly like a little David Lynch" and wondered if that was intentional (the way some directors put cameos of themselves in the story), yet it didn't even occur to me that it might be his actual son.