Game of Thrones!

[Totenkindly]

Oh, this particular stratagem crossed my mind for this Sunday's episode:

1. Jaime is thrown into water.
2. Bronn saves him by unclasping his armor at bottom of water.
3. There is no way to recognize Jaime aside from his missing hand, if he is no longer wearing his armor or the fake hand Qyburn made for him.
4. Bronn tries to sneak him out of the camp as just another soldier.
5. They are caught, but Tyrion claims that he has "never seen this man before."

Yeah, it's a little hackneyed, but I could see it happening. It could be why water was even involved at all.

EDIT: Also....

I think this is probably the 'best' episode so far this season, in terms of consistency. Some of the episodes had good parts, but here things were all fairly solid. A lot of the proper tone was struck among all the people experiencing a reunion, there were things of interest happening in all the parts, and of course the last twenty minutes.

One of the reviewers got confused and thought Cersei had lost all the gold in that assault; but it's very clear (and I thought I heard it during first viewing too) -- Samwell's dad says that the last of the gold carts had just made it inside king's Landing. So they must be somewhere NEAR King's Landing along the coastline. But these are pretty much all the folks who Jaime was too kind-hearted to flog, to move them along... I bet they wish he had been much more of a taskmaster at this stage.

 

[ceecee]

hehe

 

[ChocolateMoose123]

Frankly, if I had to choose between Jamie and Bronn surviving - I'm picking Bronn. However, the fact that I read the fucking books ruins these choices for me every time. I want Jamie to live so he can turn his back on Cersei (and Jamie's conversation with Lady Olenna alluded to that) and be with Brianne and all that. I want Cersei to live out her life in a dismal existence (even though I tend to cheer for her a little bit). And I have to admit I want a Bronn/Tyrion reunion.

As far as Dany is concerned, she hasn't had to deal with pitched battle, hand to hand combat on her own. The Unsullied, the Dothraki, riding the dragons always allowed her to be there but not be totally vulnerable (remember when the Dothraki kidnapped her? With a dragon no less). But you know who has dealt with this? Jon Snow. And I don't think he would have torched all the food supplies either, amateur move. She is many things but she is also a novice at this war thing in reality. However, she has seen the huge crossbow Qyburn designed solely to kill her dragons so, she will smarten up for next time.

I thought the same thing. Why destroy the supply line? It could be used but I think she did so to use the fire/smoke to hide the incoming direction of her assaults and instigate directional confusion on the battlefield. Bodies don't tend to make good tinder. On that note, a win is a win but she may have underestimated the power of the complete mind-fuck that is seeing a dragon coming your way. All I could think of was that Monty Python "Run Away....Run Away...."

 

[Forever]

All these speculations and theories aside..

Daenerys watching from S1 all the way to now S7, she's a total Aries archetype. A new beginner, the "one", "initiative" if no one will take a risk.. who will?

I also say Cercei is a total Scorpio archetype.. she is ruthless and cunning and will go to any "extreme" to get her way...

fire vs water

Daenerys will only win if she gets to clear up the north, but it comes at the cost of the south licking up their wounds a bit to have a better strategy... but the north being the largest region, she needs to secure and she'll have many by her side.. there is a romance unscripted by Jon and Daenerys, their proximity shows that. (reference Behind the Scenes)

Lol the Bran, me watching the series again recently "chaos is a ladder", I thought that was cute. Littlefinger was underestimating Bran for a little bit..

forget if Jaime is dead or not... is Bran Stark dead?

though you can't blame Jaime for doing what he did.. there's a fucking dragon on the ground

S4 E8 paraphrase (Gregor vs Oberyn) Tyrion comments a relief that no longer how big a person is, if they're flat it doesn't matter what their size is.


While Bronn did what he had to, it was foolish as a war tactic to show too early.. because then it's no longer a "surprise" for Daenerys

 

[Riva]

- Rickon right?

No, Dickon.

Huh, I laughed out loud. Also what he said about fansy sword (?) school. Cracked me up.

- C'mon Danny you learned your lesson now. Dragons are to be used only on guerrilla attacks. No flying them around like kites.

Don't use them like that again and annoy your fans.

- what that dokathari said about westorosies can't fight really affected Tyrion. He seemed sad to see his people dying. Would he have a change of heart against Danny? Man I don't want to see that. It must suck to be in his shoes.

- Dokarathis are soooo based on the Hun people. Hun and Mongolian. This just made me realize that we don't have active central asian members on typc.

- Who taught you how to fight like that? 'No one'. Are you serious Arya, you forgot it was Syrio Forel who taught you all that. No it was not the faceless men that taught you how to fight.

 

[Forever]

S4 E10:

Arya: Who taught you how to fight?

Brienne: My father.

S7 E4:

Brienne: Who taught you how to fight?

Arya: No One.


Such a clever retort.

 

[Riva]

S4 E10:

Arya: Who taught you how to fight?

Brienne: My father.

S7 E4:

Brienne: Who taught you how to fight?

Arya: No One.


Such a clever retort.

Was it retort? If so was it even clever?

I think she was referring to the faceless men when she said no one; but wasn't it Syrio Farel who taught her that?

 

[Totenkindly]

Game of Thrones season 7: 'The Spoils of War' was spectacular, but [fan favorite] should've died - Vox

Was it retort? If so was it even clever?

I think she was referring to the faceless men when she said no one; but wasn't it Syrio Farel who taught her that?

I think there was a conversation behind her and Brienne a few seasons ago where she asked Brienne how she learned to fight like that and Brienne said, "my father" (?). So this quip is rehashing that.

s04e10 (right before the Sandor/Brienne fight)
Arya Stark: "Who taught you how to fight?"
Brienne of Tarth: "My father."
Arya Stark: "Mine never wanted to. Said, "fighting was for boys""
Brienne of Tarth: "Mine said the same, but I kept fighting the boys anyway...kept losing. Finally, my father said, "If you're going to do this, you may as well do it right"."

And yes, obviously she is referring to the Faceless Men. Maybe Syrio was her original teacher, but she sure didn't have much time with him; and whatever she really stepped up to learn, to deal with Brienne, came from her Faceless Men time. It's just Syrio who was her first teacher who really opened her eyes to the possibilities. (Also... what was Syrio's identity? I think there have been arguments over that as well...)

So yeah, it's ironic, it's an inside joke for her, and it's a joke between them based on history. But it's a bit muddled.

 

[Forever]

Was it retort? If so was it even clever?

I think she was referring to the faceless men when she said no one; but wasn't it Syrio Farel who taught her that?

That's what I thought to hence that I capitalized the O in One. Brienne may not know, but she did clearly give her an answer.. well Arya was somewhat good with Syrio Farel.. but obviously her training to become no one is what made her great.

 

[Forever]

Game of Thrones season 7: 'The Spoils of War' was spectacular, but [fan favorite] should've died - Vox

Bronn didn't need to die lol, we need to see some angst with Tyrion more.

Jaime isn't gonna die either. Simple as that.. how are people confused that Jaime is dead when people like The Hound made it alive bleeding out?


If jaime is tough enough to run out of the Stark camp when he was captured, he can get out of the murky depths of the water with Bronn's help.


I think the critics need to be more patient. For like 2 major characters to die within the first battle is kind of boring imo.

 

[Totenkindly]

Bronn didn't need to die lol, we need to see some angst with Tyrion more.

Jaime isn't gonna die either. Simple as that.. how are people confused that Jaime is dead when people like The Hound made it alive bleeding out?


If jaime is tough enough to run out of the Stark camp when he was captured, he can get out of the murky depths of the water with Bronn's help.


I think the critics need to be more patient. For like 2 major characters to die within the first battle is kind of boring imo.

I think the issue is more that -- as opposed to Martin's work on the series -- it's now very clear that certain characters are wearing what is known as "Plot Armor" or even "Fan Armor." The series has lost its courage and wants to somehow build emotional stakes without actual risk. We did get a few deaths this season (which isn't even the litmus test, really, for "good"... these deaths just happened), but how they were handled generated little emotional impact. I loved the battle itself, but I'm mostly bored by the season because there is little emotional engagement right now.

I referenced "Better Call Saul" because it's a series that doesn't tend to put out unless it means it... like the departure of a major character in the last moments of Season 3. They discussed how much they hated it when a series will throw out an episode-end cliffhanger and then essentially retract it next time out because they were never actually serious... it's just an attempt to jerk the audience around. I think the ending of this battle was kinda one of those moments, but that wasn't something Martin was selling when he was dictating the plot points, really. It's odd to see a series that used to be known for playing high-stakes to revert to something without many stakes.

 

[burningranger]

I was recently playing Game of Thrones - The RPG, and was presented with this dillema, as Bran :

 

[Tater]

 

[Forever]

Leslie Jones was so hilarious about last week's episode...

 

[Andy]

Actually that kind of plot twist has already become the Conventional Wisdom if you read any commentaries about Game of Thrones online. It will be more surprising if something else happens. We saw more seeds of it planted tonight.


I don't know. It's not really clear what the ending is. The most the Walkers will get is a statemate if they have legitimate needs; if they are just evil, then they will be pushed back somehow, but it's not clear who will live.

There are other contenders. The prophecy say the little brother, but it doesn't specify that it will be her little brother. There's a number of other younger male siblings who might have a shot. Uncle Greyjoy was a younger brother - I could imagine him marrying Cercei and then killing her shortly afterwards... But I don't think that will happen. I think another black horse contender for the role could be the Hound, the Mountain's little brother. Those two have hated each other for a long time, it would almost seem strange if they didn't end up fighting to the death at some point. Why? Perhaps because of Arya. She wants to kill the queen, so will be heading to Kinglanding at some point. If he hears about her, the Hound may well follow - there's definitely unfinished business between those two.

As for the King of the White Walkers, I'm not sure if he is really evil at all. He used to be a normal human, till the Children turned him into a monster to fight the human invaders. He may be doing what he does for no reason other than that the Children's curse forces him to do it. He probably didn't have to kill the Children, but he did anyway, because he hates them and they forget to specify that he couldn't.

 

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

Can't say I cared too much about Randall biting it; he was an asshole, and a hypocrite. I guess the means Samwell is the heir now.

And did anyone catch the confirmation that Jon is actually ahead of Danerys in the line of succession? I guess Sam was too busy to notice.

Did anyone manage to catch that scroll that Littlefinger obviously wanted Arya to find? Something about wounds on the throat... was it a reference to Joffrey's death (perhaps something implicating Sansa, or more puzzlingly, implicating Littlefinger as the true culprit)? Was it something about Arya killing Walder Frey? Or was it about Catelyn's death?

I like this season better than the last two seasons of Game of Thrones. 5 mangled a bunch of stuff from the books, and season 6 was kind of predictable and felt like a bunch of checklists. This is more surprising... I feel a lot of tension and suspense, and actually feel surprise at plot developments. Things feel a lot less like sloppy truncation.

 

[ceecee]

Leslie Jones was so hilarious about last week's episode...

She is one of the best things on Twitter.

So much happened in this episode!

Gendry! And who has a Valarian steel dagger? Yessssss...

Gilly just dropping the bomb about the annulment and Jon's parents were married and he's the real deal...
Samwell Tarly out! But don't mansplain to your lady.
Cersei is pregnant. And Jamie knows he has to kill that crazy now.
The Hound+Gendry+Thoros and Beric +Jorah+Jon+Tormund (Is Brianne with you??)+Davos - I like it.
Bronn! Run! Cersei gonna kill you!

I could easily be overlooking things, it's crazy how fast it's moving now.

 

[Totenkindly]

I felt like we went from the best episode of the season (episode 4) to one of the worst of the season and maybe the series. I think the series is feeling more and more like a soap opera the longer the season progresses.

There were a few moments where the show felt substantial:

- Baelish suckers Arya and does SOMETHING sneaky.... although I have to look up what was on the scroll. Thank god, he has pretty much just felt completely toothless for some episodes now, and finally he just figured out a new plan. He totally played her.

- Davos tells Gendry to pretend to be Clovis (isn't Clovis Davos' dead son?) when he talks to Jon, and the first thing Gendry does when Jon says hi is introduce himself as Gendry, Robert Barantheon's bastard son while Davos gapes... and they both start sharing bastard experiences and bond. That was hilarious... and it was finally a moment that I did not see coming. I like to be surprised. I have no idea why gendry is around or why he is now played by Christian Bale [ha ha], but that bit was rather great.

- Jon pets the dragon... although then Dany does not even hint at following up on WTF her dragon just allowed a random human to touch his face

- Sansa tells Arya to speak her mind, which is bold. Arya calls out Sansa.

But most of it was full of bizarre plots twists/oddities, starting with the opening (which we discussed in detail last week)... unbelievable... and then followed by this super-crazy mission beyond the wall to, well, do something that I am not even sure why it would even accomplish anything. and a bunch of other stuff that felt like introducing character after character as part of glowy fan service.

Occasionally there would be a good line, but it didn't excuse the thinness of the plot and the characterization. This episode even more than the others has really felt like pieces just being pushed at a crazy speed around the board without regard for common sense, logistics, or purpose.

I was bummed as I just spent the weekend with my kids, so my son and I could finally watch an episode TOGETHER for once.... and, well, we got this instead. I am not even sure why it was named what it was named, because nothing happened there.

EDIT: And yeah, as ceecee says, things are rocketing along:

- Glad to see the Lannisters are moving on. Losing children can make it hard to want to restart a family. How sweet.

- Bronn + Jaime -- with Jaime in armor -- somehow manage to swim for 5 minutes under water (hey, let's ignore that) and are never found by the Dothraki army. Good thing the Dothraki are not wilderness barbarians who are experienced at tracking things.

- Goodbye, Tarleys. Except Sam. But hey, maybe he'll drive home now and realize he's the new lord. Dickon, man, that was dumb. Sweet I suppose, but so dumb.

- When will Tyrion get fired? None of his plans have worked, and then he argues with Dany about how to handle things. He is really in disagreement with her a lot and/or wrong a lot of the time to still keep her confidence. If the show wants to justify his position, they gotta give him him something positive to work out.

- Gilly reading the books conveniently and rather clumsily, so that we now know Jon is not an actual bastard but a legitimate heir to the Starks and Targaryans. Thanks for slipping that in there.

- Is Jorah still friendzoned? Dany looked like she was hot for him, except she was even all more gooey over Jon. Maybe polyamory will become a thing.

- Yeah, fine, so it seems like a fun fanfic thing to put all of our favorite characters in a top secret mission beyond the Wall to kidnap a walker. But seriously? When would this seriously happen.... and why is this even a mission? Take the walker to the meisters if you are going that route -- Sam was right on the mark -- don't waste your fricking time with Cersei.

 

[ceecee]

I felt like we went from the best episode of the season (episode 4) to one of the worst of the season and maybe the series. I think the series is feeling more and more like a soap opera the longer the season progresses.

There were a few moments where the show felt substantial:

- Baelish suckers Arya and does SOMETHING sneaky.... although I have to look up what was on the scroll. Thank god, he has pretty much just felt completely toothless for some episodes now, and finally he just figured out a new plan. He totally played her.

- Davos tells Gendry to pretend to be Clovis (isn't Clovis Davos' dead son?) when he talks to Jon, and the first thing Gendry does when Jon says hi is introduce himself as Gendry, Robert Barantheon's bastard son while Davos gapes... and they both start sharing bastard experiences and bond. That was hilarious... and it was finally a moment that I did not see coming. I like to be surprised. I have no idea why gendry is around or why he is now played by Christian Bale [ha ha], but that bit was rather great.

- Jon pets the dragon... although then Dany does not even hint at following up on WTF her dragon just allowed a random human to touch his face

But most of it was full of bizarre plots twists/oddities, starting with the opening (which we discussed in detail last week)... unbelievable... and then followed by this super-crazy mission beyond the wall to, well, do something that I am not even sure why it would even accomplish anything. and a bunch of other stuff that felt like introducing character after character as part of glowy fan service.

Occasionally there would be a good line, but it didn't excuse the thinness of the plot and the characterization. This episode even more than the others has really felt like pieces just being pushed at a crazy speed around the board without regard for common sense, logistics, or purpose.

I was bummed as I just spent the weekend with my kids, so my son and I could finally watch an episode TOGETHER for once.... and, well, we got this instead. I am not even sure why it was named what it was named, because nothing happened there.

It's just going so fast that nothing seems very developed. I didn't think of soap opera but yeah.

 

[Totenkindly]

It's just going so fast that nothing seems very developed.

That. There is nothing here I really will ever want to rewatch again, there's just no real character drama occurring or really breathless plotting.

I really do plan to read the books that Martin writes after this. I want the depth.