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Experiencing Euphoria from Music

Thalassa

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I think of it all as one continuum, that was only disrupted once grunge came around & made the hair bands GTFO. Also the classic rock station here played GNR & Aerosmith & all that mixed in w/ Led Zep & so on.

By the way, what's the radio genre for the Beatles? I never hear them on classic rock or oldies stations.

Grunge was heavily influenced by 70's music. You're not big on music history, huh? No offense, but if you put 60's and 70's guitar rock in the same category as Hair Metal and 80's pop, you don't seem to have even been exposed to what I'm talking about...the music I'm talking about isn't cheesy, though I'll totally admit some of the 80's synth-pop I like can be cheesy, but that music is more "fun" than "intense."

The Beatles are considered 60's pop (or Mod) and you'd most likely hear their early stuff on a station that played "oldies" from the 50's and 60's that also played bebop, bubble gum, and Motown.

However, the Beatles' later stuff should be played on Classic Rock stations, and IME it usually is.
 

Thalassa

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Wow, it actually had the bridge from Fantasy... yeah, totally total Valley Girl music for sure.

No "Fantasy" had the chorus from this song. Mariah Carey loved this song when she was growing up which is why she sampled it.
 

FunnyDigestion

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Grunge was heavily influenced by 70's music.

Yeah... but grunge itself would never be confused with that stuff, they sound totally different except for some stylistic elements. It's pretty undisputed that when Nirvana (& to a lesser extent Pearl Jam, Soundgarden etc) came out, all the machismo-type "sex drugs & rock n roll" bands completely lost their place in the market. If you look before & after Nirvana, it's totally different. I mean, this is about market history rather than music history. Nirvana killed the traditional rock-N-roll market. It's borne out by how there were tons of Nirvana copycat bands with Kurt wannabes around all the way until ~2002 (Puddle of Mudd, Nickelback, ... can't remember any more).
 

Thalassa

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Yeah... but grunge itself would never be confused with mainstream 70s or 80s music, they sound totally different except for some stylistic elements. It's pretty undisputed that when Nirvana (& to a lesser extent Pearl Jam, Soundgarden etc) came out, all the machismo-type "sex drugs & rock n roll" bands completely lost their place in the market. If you look before & after Nirvana, it's totally different. I mean, this is about market history rather than music history. Nirvana killed the traditional rock-N-roll market. It's borne out by how there were tons of Nirvana copycat bands with Kurt wannabes around all the way until ~2002 (Puddle of Mudd, Nickelback, ... can't remember any more).

I don't think you know what you're talking about.

But okay.

What Grunge pushed out was Glam Rock, Hair Metal, and 80's pop.

Grunge goes back to the roots of Guitar Rock. Nirvana was also somewhat influenced by Punk and David Bowie.

Soundgarden and Pearl Jam have an undeniable Guitar Rock influence, if you actually look at the more serious, intense, and political Guitar Rock from the late 60's and 70's.
 

FunnyDigestion

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No "Fantasy" had the chorus from this song. Mariah Carey loved this song when she was growing up which is why she sampled it.

...... um, what I meant was Mariah took the "i'm in heaven w/ my boyfriend" part, which is the bridge in Fantasy. It also takes the chink-a-chink guitar part & uses that as the backbone.
 

Thalassa

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Lol. What did I get wrong???

I edited the post. But you seem to think the underlying sound of Grunge was somehow "new" or more "serious" or maybe political...and yes, it is more serious or political than Hair Metal and most Glam Rock.

However, in many ways it's similar to Punk and 70's Guitar Rock, and my friends who are professional musicians listen to both kinds of music just like I do.
 

FunnyDigestion

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Are you mad that I said I thought classic rock (or what I thought of as classic rock) was cheesy? I can't help it!

EDIT, no I don't think it's more serious, there's a ton of cheesy grunge. But when I was an early teenager it sounded "realer" if you know what I mean.

A lot of the stuff I listened to then is laughable to me today, but a lot I still enojy.

EDIT again, also just because something's cheesy doesn't make it bad. esp. when it's really over the top like http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5XcKBmdfpWs
 

Thalassa

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Are you mad that I said I thought classic rock (or what I thought of as classic rock) was cheesy? I can't help it!

No I'm not mad. I just don't think Jimmy Hendrix or Led Zepplin are cheesy, and that it's musically ignorant to put them in the same category as Guns N Roses or Genesis.
 

FunnyDigestion

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Yeah... but thanks to the radio where I grew up I'll always associate "classic rock" with Foreigner & Journey & music where it's 5 guys dressed like women playing to a crowd of bikers if you know what I mean... the 60's stuff I just call "60s stuff".

The 60s were gr8.
 

Thalassa

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Yeah... but thanks to the radio where I grew up I'll always associate "classic rock" with Foreigner & Journey & music where it's 5 guys dressed like women playing to a crowd of bikers if you know what I mean... the 60's stuff I just call "60s stuff".

The 60s were gr8.

Yeah which is why I separated Guitar Rock from the more generic "Classic Rock" on second thought. A lot of 70's music has a very serious, complex sound that required ENORMOUS TALENT. That's why I'm offended - it's not because of my personal taste. I like Human League, you can tell me they're cheesy all day, and I won't bat an eyelash. I'll agree with you and say "yeah but I like it."
 

FunnyDigestion

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That's what I was saying, cheesy doesn't mean bad.

I mean, I posted a Mariah Carey song. To a lot of people Mariah Carey is the epitome of cheesy. I mean, I disagree, I think it's great, & not cheesy, but I would be undeterred by someone else calling it cheesy.

I'm a musician myself, so I respect talent... but it's irrelevant to being cheesy or not-cheesy. Like, Tool is a bunch of musical masterminds, & they're one of the cheesiest bands I can think of.

I can't remember exactly, but I think I originally said the cheesiness of classic rock (mistake in nomenclature) prevented me from having nostalgic memories tied to it. There's more involved in it than just cheesiness though, but that was the first thing that came to me.

I do think it's Lol that you're offended though. Why are you so easily annoyed at something so little?
 

FunnyDigestion

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But the sum is: I AGREE WITH YOU!!@1!11!3

I can't think of anything you said I didn't agree with... except the Nirvana-killing-traditional-rock-n-roll thing.
 

Thalassa

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That's what I was saying, cheesy doesn't mean bad.

I mean, I posted a Mariah Carey song. To a lot of people Mariah Carey is the epitome of cheesy. I mean, I disagree, I think it's great, & not cheesy, but I would be undeterred by someone else calling it cheesy.

I'm a musician myself, so I respect talent... but it's irrelevant to cheesy or not cheesy. Like, Tool is a bunch of musical masterminds, & they're one of the cheesiest bands I can think of.

I do think it's Lol that you're offended though. Why are you so easily annoyed at something so little?

It's not little. I think it's undermining the talent of serious musicians who had a real message to their music. I can see you telling me that some of the 80's synth pop I like, as I said, is "cheesy"...because yeah, it's not very serious music. It's more catchy and happy, and I listen to it because it's happy and "light." I would agree with you, that even though I like that music, that it's cheesy.

However, I will not agree with you that the Allman Brothers or Boston are cheesy, no, I won't.

Also, saying that grunge was somehow transcendent from all that came before it, yes, seems musically ignorant, like you don't even know who those bands were actually influenced by. You're, in effect, disrespecting the musical influences on the people you're putting on a pedestal.

I take music history more seriously than you, and I tend to gauge "cheesy" or not by level of talent and seriousness put into music, lyrics, or both.

So yeah it bothers me, it's not little to me.
 

Hive

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That's what I was saying, cheesy doesn't mean bad.

I mean, I posted a Mariah Carey song. To a lot of people Mariah Carey is the epitome of cheesy. I mean, I disagree, I think it's great, & not cheesy, but I would be undeterred by someone else calling it cheesy.

I'm a musician myself, so I respect talent... but it's irrelevant to being cheesy or not-cheesy. Like, Tool is a bunch of musical masterminds, & they're one of the cheesiest bands I can think of.

I can't remember exactly, but I think I originally said the cheesiness of classic rock (mistake in nomenclature) prevented me from having nostalgic memories tied to it. There's more involved in it than just cheesiness though, but that was the first thing that came to me.

I do think it's Lol that you're offended though. Why are you so easily annoyed at something so little?
I'm curious to hear what about Tool you find "cheesy" :p
 

FunnyDigestion

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However, I will not agree with you that the Allman Brothers or Boston are cheesy, no, I won't.

But I wasn't talking about them... I promise that when I said "classic rock", I had a particular type of music in mind... from which the Allman Brothers are miles & miles away.

Also, saying that grunge was somehow transcendent from all that came before it,

But I didn't say that either!!

& I didn't mean to imply that.

I said it "seemed" "realer" "to me", "when" I "was" a teenager... & it did, so what can I say?

yes, seems musically ignorant, like you don't even know who those bands were actually influenced by. You're, in effect, disrespecting the musical influences on the people you're putting on a pedestal.

Of course I know who they were influenced by. But I don't have to like OR respect everyone who someone I like was influenced by-- otherwise I'd eventually have to like every artist in the history of the world, since it's all connected.

The only grunge band I ever listen to now is Nirvana, & I do consider them great art which transcends a simple musical genre.

I take music history more seriously than you, and I tend to gauge "cheesy" or not by level of talent and seriousness put into music, lyrics, or both.

So yeah it bothers me, it's not little to me.

Well... what am I supposed to say? Talent & seriousness of intent are less important to me than the way the music sounds.

& you're right, I couldn't care less about music history. All that matters is the sound.
 

Stigmata

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Your begging is futile; Your tears only make Marmie Dearest grow stronger.
 
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