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  1. #1
    The human tl;dr Tactical Turtleneck's Avatar
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    Revisiting The Chosen One Prophecy

    I think the Jedi misread their own prophecy. I don't think Anakin was the chosen one. He was, but the chosen one is not an exclusive status limited to one person. It can be any number of individuals gifted with an insanely high midichlorian count and the potential and discipline to bring balance. Anakin was the (first? maybe it's a reoccuring position like the One in the matrix universe and he just happened to be the first necessary in a long time. Perhaps whenever the universe is in extreme crisis and the dark side gaining too much influence, the force instinctively influences the creation of an extremely powerful individual to kickstart or reboot the system).

    Anakin had the potential to bring balance, but when he fell and put the galaxy further into darkness, it passed on from him. The force had already reacted by willing the creation of two twins whose potential would match Anakin's. So by circumstance, Luke became the next Chosen One, although it could've just as easily been Leia under different circumstances. And Luke succeeded or failed, depending on how you looked at it, and so Rey is the next logical heir to the Chosen One status when the force becomes increasingly unbalanced. She probably exceeds both Anakin and Luke in midichlorian count, as the force wills her to use it in a way that most individuals would require years of training.

  2. #2
    Curious... The Cat's Avatar
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    I honestly feel like the "prophecy" of the prequels was way out of left field. It felt very kout of place in SW
    Conservatism is the blind and fear-filled worship of dead radicals.


    Oh, we're always all right. You remember that. We happen to other people.

    And I see fire, hollowing souls
    And I see fire, blood in the breeze
    And I hope that you'll remember me...


  3. #3
    The human tl;dr Tactical Turtleneck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Cat View Post
    I honestly feel like the "prophecy" of the prequels was way out of left field. It felt very kout of place in SW
    I'm only about halfway through TCW so forgive me if they better explained it at some point, but I always assumed it was a vision some jedi had years ago and that the current ones were doing their best to interpret the vision based on events unfolding around them. They were just interpreting wrongly, failing to realize that in order for the path to balance, the jedi order itself needed to be destroyed and eventually rebuilt, having become a corrupted tool of bureaucratic interests (motivated by attachments and deception)

    Also there's a CW episode that sort of explains what the prophecy may have really meant



    Also interesting that Obi Wan genuinely believed Luke to be the chosen one after ROTS. Perhaps it all depends on one's own certain point of view, and really is therefore just a meaningless prophecy

  4. #4
    The human tl;dr Tactical Turtleneck's Avatar
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    TCW really makes me feel for the tragedy of the clones. Unlike their jedi commanders and eventual non-clone replacements, they were doomed to be forgotten. The whole aging at double speed aspect is also tragic. By the time of the original trilogy, most surviving clones would already be senior citizens. I seem to remember reading about a legends source that a lot of former clones formed the basis of imperial cyborg supertroopers, their past experience as soldiers melded with new and improved bodies. Becoming more and more like the mindless droid soldiers they were originally bred to fight against. I hope this is something that will be mentioned in the new canon, as I doubt the empire would just discard all of the clones after the clone wars. Would love to see a battle between old Rex and a cyborgified Cody. For Rex to see what became of his surviving brethren after the war.

    Another aspect of TCW I like is how the jedi actively encourage individuality among their clone soldiers and seem to genuinely value the lives of the clones. A nice contrast to the sith and emperor who viewed soldiers as expendable, nameless pawns. The biggest tragedy is they were ultimately proven to be mindless pawns with the events of order 66. All of these clone soldiers who had been encouraged to be individuals and take personal nicknames suddenly revert to a nameless force of murderers, forgetting everything they learned from their jedi commanders.

  5. #5
    Curious... The Cat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tactical Turtleneck View Post
    I'm only about halfway through TCW so forgive me if they better explained it at some point, but I always assumed it was a vision some jedi had years ago and that the current ones were doing their best to interpret the vision based on events unfolding around them. They were just interpreting wrongly, failing to realize that in order for the path to balance, the jedi order itself needed to be destroyed and eventually rebuilt, having become a corrupted tool of bureaucratic interests (motivated by attachments and deception)

    Also there's a CW episode that sort of explains what the prophecy may have really meant



    Also interesting that Obi Wan genuinely believed Luke to be the chosen one after ROTS. Perhaps it all depends on one's own certain point of view, and really is therefore just a meaningless prophecy
    Oh I'm quite certain that there are many in cannon reasons that the prophecy works as a literary device, I just feel like the chosen one subplot exists in every trilogy. That's like three chosen ones in 60 years. The Father, the Son, and the Holy Rinn.

    I want to see the star wars story where the universe just has Skywalker Palpatinism vs the Church of Corsucant in the Galactic Rennessaince.
    Conservatism is the blind and fear-filled worship of dead radicals.


    Oh, we're always all right. You remember that. We happen to other people.

    And I see fire, hollowing souls
    And I see fire, blood in the breeze
    And I hope that you'll remember me...


  6. #6
    The human tl;dr Tactical Turtleneck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Cat View Post
    Oh I'm quite certain that there are many in cannon reasons that the prophecy works as a literary device, I just feel like the chosen one subplot exists in every trilogy. That's like three chosen ones in 60 years. The Father, the Son, and the Holy Rinn.

    I want to see the star wars story where the universe just has Skywalker Palpatinism vs the Church of Corsucant in the Galactic Rennessaince.
    Maybe the lesson should be not to hold to old ideals and prophecies, regardless of whether they came from jedi or sith. Seemed they were sort of pushing that theme in TLJ before the Rise of Reddit just retconned everything because we needed the big showdown with Palpy.

  7. #7
    Curious... The Cat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tactical Turtleneck View Post
    Maybe the lesson should be not to hold to old ideals and prophecies, regardless of whether they came from jedi or sith. Seemed they were sort of pushing that theme in TLJ before the Rise of Reddit just retconned everything because we needed the big showdown with Palpy.
    yeah, I was not a fan of the Force Awakens. But the Last Jedi I thought. Okay, I see what he's trying to do and I respect that, I cant wait to see what he does with the wrap up, it might be okay. But then, they brought back Abrams(who I tend to have no problems with, but I recognize he's made of straw so, what can you expect, he plays a mean keyboard, and I respect that to no end.It honestly makes up for literally everything else, and Im not kidding. I dont know why I like it so, but I do...) and then the rise of skywalker. Ive seen galaxies burn and empires fall, so I recognized the writing on the wall, far be it from me to shit on prophecies, I respect them I truly do, but Ive seen through the fish bowl, and now I just want a more nuanced sw universe, where everything exists, and is at war with itself and at peace with that. I want to see the adventures of every day average joes in the galaxy where every third person is a chosen one, or has some kind of overwrough space operatic melodrama back story. and is aware of it. I want there to be Star Wars Daria, and see the planets who are loyal empire citizens because they keep the roads paved, have well funded schools, and beleive that alderaan had it coming because they were hiding weapons of mass destruction. I want to see the redneck tatooine slaves who watch troops and have posters of the sw lethal weapon 2 that stars Murtagh as a by the book Imperial officer and Riggs as a Loose Cannon MAndalorian Bounty Hunter hired by Darth Vader as an 80's police comissioner because unlike what the Rebel propaganda would have you believe, Darth Vader actually has a sense of Humor about himself. What about all the money that Plapatine funnels into the preservation of galactic Art? Yes, it's madness. But then, so is everytthing else. I say fuck cannon, let's give everyone lightsabers and force powers and hero complexes and see what happens. STARWARS2020!
    Conservatism is the blind and fear-filled worship of dead radicals.


    Oh, we're always all right. You remember that. We happen to other people.

    And I see fire, hollowing souls
    And I see fire, blood in the breeze
    And I hope that you'll remember me...


  8. #8
    heartland values Julius_Van_Der_Beak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Cat View Post
    I honestly feel like the "prophecy" of the prequels was way out of left field. It felt very kout of place in SW
    I saw a good post on Reddit that made the point that everything would work better if there was no prophecy. I'm inclined to agree, especially because it was never actually explained in the movies what the prophecy was.

    And yeah, I think they did some really interesting stuff with TLJ, and it's unfortunate that all of it was completely ignored. I especially hate the fact that it made Luke's sacrifice meaningless. That was a pretty good way for that character to go out (much better than Solo's), and it appears to have not impacted anything. The movie doesn't even seem to acknowledge that it happens, instead engaging in lots of dumb fanservice. ROS made it look like he didn't realize he was wrong until he died.
    A path is made by walking on it.

    -Zhuangzi


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  9. #9
    The human tl;dr Tactical Turtleneck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Julius_Van_Der_Beak View Post
    I saw a good post on Reddit that made the point that everything would work better if there was no prophecy. I'm inclined to agree, especially because it was never actually explained in the movies what the prophecy was.

    And yeah, I think they did some really interesting stuff with TLJ, and it's unfortunate that all of it was completely ignored. I especially hate the fact that it made Luke's sacrifice meaningless. That was a pretty good way for that character to go out (much better than Solo's), and it appears to have not impacted anything. The movie doesn't even seem to acknowledge that it happens, instead engaging in lots of dumb fanservice. ROS made it look like he didn't realize he was wrong until he died.
    There was no real plan going into the new trilogy. The left hand didn't know what the right hand was doing and the brain seemed disconnected from the entire body. As such, it feels like a hodgepodge, like TLJ was from a separate trilogy (had Johnson been and Abrams each made their own trilogies, then someone decided to swap out the middle films) just sandwiched in-between two Abrams movies. I'd be happy with a Johnson trilogy or an Abrams trilogy if either were cohesive wholes. Kennedy is a good businessperson but should have exerted more oversight or put someone in an executive role that would have overseen a more cohesive trilogy. Abrams was not the guy to helm this. Classic case of a decent director who can satisfy visually but doesn't know the first thing about how to write a solid arc. And I realize similar complaints have been levied against Lucas, who to be fair didn't know the entire story when he was working on ANH, but at least he seemed to have some general idea of the grand story when he finished his trilogies.

    Johnson does get some unfair hate, when really Abrams is to blame. Abrams didn't leave him much to work with. There were no arcs to continue, just a bunch of loose threads and maguffins left over from TFA. He did a decent job of making TLJ seem like it was actually picking up and continuing arcs that were nonexistent to begin with.

    I hope they do scrap this trilogy from canon, I know they won't, but it leaves a bad taste that exceeds even that left by the prequels. At least the prequels still feel like parts of a mostly cohesive whole. And for all their flaws, they weren't just total retreads or reimaginings of the OT. At least the people making the anthology movies and the TV shows have done a decent job of picking up the mantle. Too bad Solo did poorer than expected. I was always more excited by the prospect of the anthology films than I was of anything they were going to do in the new trilogy.

  10. #10
    heartland values Julius_Van_Der_Beak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tactical Turtleneck View Post
    There was no real plan going into the new trilogy. The left hand didn't know what the right hand was doing and the brain seemed disconnected from the entire body. As such, it feels like a hodgepodge, like TLJ was from a separate trilogy (had Johnson been and Abrams each made their own trilogies, then someone decided to swap out the middle films) just sandwiched in-between two Abrams movies. I'd be happy with a Johnson trilogy or an Abrams trilogy if either were cohesive wholes. Kennedy is a good businessperson but should have exerted more oversight or put someone in an executive role that would have overseen a more cohesive trilogy. Abrams was not the guy to helm this. Classic case of a decent director who can satisfy visually but doesn't know the first thing about how to write a solid arc. And I realize similar complaints have been levied against Lucas, who to be fair didn't know the entire story when he was working on ANH, but at least he seemed to have some general idea of the grand story when he finished his trilogies.

    Johnson does get some unfair hate, when really Abrams is to blame. Abrams didn't leave him much to work with. There were no arcs to continue, just a bunch of loose threads and maguffins left over from TFA. He did a decent job of making TLJ seem like it was actually picking up and continuing arcs that were nonexistent to begin with.

    I hope they do scrap this trilogy from canon, I know they won't, but it leaves a bad taste that exceeds even that left by the prequels. At least the prequels still feel like parts of a mostly cohesive whole. And for all their flaws, they weren't just total retreads or reimaginings of the OT. At least the people making the anthology movies and the TV shows have done a decent job of picking up the mantle. Too bad Solo did poorer than expected. I was always more excited by the prospect of the anthology films than I was of anything they were going to do in the new trilogy.
    Honestly, everything I've heard about Treverrow's script makes me wish they'd actually went with that. It seems so much more like an actual continuation of TLJ than a sloppy retcon aimed at fanservice. Also, Coruscant plays a big role in it, which really should have been a part of this trilogy, at least at the very end to bring things "full circle." I didn't care about seeing Luke's x-wing again but that was something I was really hoping to see because it would have helped bring a sense of closure to things (and another complaint about this is how little closure I actually feel... I realize they probably plan on making more movies set after this, but that's no excuse for ending the damn thing at a place that only has meaning for the viewing audience and has no meaning to any of the actual characters in the story. Why the hell should Rey care about Luke's house that she never visited before? Maybe we're supposed to know she won't go bad because she LIKES sand?
    A path is made by walking on it.

    -Zhuangzi



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