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  1. #61
    Somber and irritated cascadeco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cacaia View Post
    Think about it this way: if they do end up going to college it'll give them many opportunities to rethink their lives, to learn what they have not learned yet and they just may surprise you upon finishing... if they do finish.

    Since all of this is off-topic from OP I'll just spoiler it -

    "...On and on and on and on he strode, far out over the sands, singing wildly to the sea, crying to greet the advent of the life that had cried to him." - James Joyce

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  2. #62

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    Quote Originally Posted by awbro View Post
    It's fine you replied here.

    I haven't graduated yet. I have two more years, or maybe just a bit more.
    ah, this actually does make a bit of a difference. you're not exactly hopeless yet, but rather just feeling that way. you're still in school. still on track to graduate, no? depending on the field, they aren't necessarily overly specific on what you studied.

    I was thinking of going immediately into graduate school, if I get in. I hate my major but my parents always comment on my choices with disapproving tones. And I don't have a lot of money. I have to pay for everything myself.
    going to grad school seems like the popular thing to do in today, but i would VERY HIGHLY advise AGAINST doing so if you don't have a specific need to do so. it sounds like you just want to grad school because you have no idea what you're doing. that is a huge red flag. no. do not do this.

  3. #63
    The Memes Justify the End EcK's Avatar
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    basically - do I think degrees are useful ? They are if you want well.. any job.. in the same way paying the mob would be useful if you didn't want your store go the way of the titanic in an unfortunate fire (again talking about most degrees, not like, engineering or medicine, even though, I am a better diagnostician than all but 2 of the doctors' I've ever met with.. yes. googling.. and a good mind for pattern recognition, but yes if we're putting lives in people's hands it seems like a safe bet to give them a long ass, very selective education). It just seems to me like the modern education metastructure didn't adapt at all to the idea that nowadays we should train for the ability to PROCESS data much more than we do the ability to RETAIN data. It made sense to learn stuff by heart etc. back when you couldn't just spend 30 minutes looking through books every 5 minutes (vs 10 seconds google the same information now). Furthermore people hyper specialize etc. not the kind of things that make a 'broadish' education in a given field very useful - the one skill that would remain useful across different jobs would be knowing how to learn, and analyse, and optimize one's workflow. That's not something universities really teach, or if they do it's simply as a corollary of having to learn a zillion things.

    For example I think pretty much every test should come with a 'fact sheet' and students should be primarily graded on the ability to analyse said information rather than just 'knowing stuff'. That shouldn't be enough to get a passing grade in anything but introductory courses (as you need some basic knowledge to be able to think about something usefully).
    Expression of the post modern paradox : "For the love of god, religions are so full of shit"

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  4. #64
    The Memes Justify the End EcK's Avatar
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    @awbro, what I did was to graduate in something kind of vague (ie: that people would find somewhat useful in any company) - so economics with a masters in international management. It doesn't require as much 'learning by heart' as some other fields and is kind of a 'swiss army knife' of workplace skills. That or specialize, alot, based on what jobs have more demand than offer and can't easily be outsourced abroad (ya know, like dentistry).
    Expression of the post modern paradox : "For the love of god, religions are so full of shit"

    Theory is always superseded by Fact...
    ... In theory.

    “I’d hate to die twice. It’s so boring.”
    Richard Feynman's last recorded words

    "Great is the human who has not lost his childlike heart."
    Mencius (Meng-Tse), 4th century BCE
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  5. #65
    Senior Member cacaia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EcK View Post
    Here's one issue with what you said. The internet exist, libraries exist. You can learn anything and everything you could learn in university just reading books for free or next to free. I learned much more on the side (various interests ranging from history, psychology, sociology, biology, history of science, biological anthropology, various things on linguistics etc. etc. etc. ) than I ever did at univ for maybe 1% of what i paid for business school. If someone is motivated enough to learn to spend tens or hundreds of thousands, I'm sure they can pickup a book or two. The only real benefit of the classic college / univ. is that they give you a shiny piece of paper. Sorry but people who go to college to 'find themselves' or 'learn stuff' outside of a very few fields are ... well idiots unwise and pretty much by definition should not have gone to college. in short, i agree with you that it's good to 'improve yourself' - but universities are really NOT about that. They are about finding a job, and are - mostly - just useless gatekeepers at this point. The only thing a university or college can give you that google can't is a piece of paper and a title - neither of which are 'self improvements'.
    Alright, to each their own. But people DO find themselves in college and life CAN be changed for the better if you take the correct courses. Furthermore, people who find themselves by going to uni are not necessarily stupid. They are just hardwired in a different way than others. Also...as I said earlier, we can't all be Bill Gates and learn on our own to get a job. That shit needs to be tracked, is a transcript or Post Ed credit ...
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  6. #66
    Senior Member cacaia's Avatar
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    LOL...just watched this guy representing all MBTI substitute teachers....it reminded me of this conversation....dare you not to laugh out loud!
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  7. #67
    The Memes Justify the End EcK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cacaia View Post
    Alright, to each their own. But people DO find themselves in college and life CAN be changed for the better if you take the correct courses. Furthermore, people who find themselves by going to uni are not necessarily stupid. They are just hardwired in a different way than others. Also...as I said earlier, we can't all be Bill Gates and learn on our own to get a job. That shit needs to be tracked, is a transcript or Post Ed credit ...
    I agree with everything you said. My point was that a) it's a mighty big pricetag for 'finding yourself' b) it is not the goal of college, the goal of college is to find a job - they will tell you otherwise because they are SELLING YOU something. ie: school are selling you their unjustifiably overgrown admin and ridiculous pricetags steeming from same overgrown admin, people are selling you that their decision to college-it-up was fully justified. I for one can really understand people needing extra time after high school. I'm an ENTP for Pete's sake, I was an irresponsible child until 24.

    However of course it depends on many factors. In Europe for example college costs a fraction of what it does in the US so it's a different dynamic and in that case yes it makes more sense to go to college while you are figuring shit out. My private business school for example cost me about 8k a year - and it was in my home city so no need to rent as I already had family accommodations. It's a different dynamic in the US if you a paying say 40,000 dollars a year + dorm and food .. comes to what ? 60-70k a year for 4-5 years? that's insane.
    Expression of the post modern paradox : "For the love of god, religions are so full of shit"

    Theory is always superseded by Fact...
    ... In theory.

    “I’d hate to die twice. It’s so boring.”
    Richard Feynman's last recorded words

    "Great is the human who has not lost his childlike heart."
    Mencius (Meng-Tse), 4th century BCE
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  8. #68
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    go where there's demand...
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  9. #69
    alchemist Legion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tomb1 View Post
    go where there's demand...
    if it matches your natural inclinations*

    (and a good dose of benefit to the greater good!)
    the lone star flies alone

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