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Career-Related Ethical Dilemma

Aquarelle

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Okay peeps, I need some advice! I have the opportunity to apply for a different position in my field, at a different by nearby institution. If I got that job, it would mean an increase in pay of about 15% and about 25% more vacation time. (Not to mention my job would be closer to home and I could bike there, thus saving $ on gas an parking!) However, I've just been promoted to a new position within my office (6 months ago) and I would feel a bit guilty about leaving so soon after being promoted.

Let me give a bit of background:

I work at a large public university in the study abroad office. I've worked here for 4.5 years; 4 of those years, I was an Enrollment Specialist, which basically meant I did all the administrative-type work related to our study abroad programs (filing, application databasing, sending out emails, etc). But ESs are also expected to, and therefore I also did,higher-up things like advising and presentations. But ESs still get the crappy benefits and pay of an administrative assistant, not to mention a distinct lack of respect. During those 4 years, I was passed over for a promotion once in favor of someone with less experience in the office than I had (this was my office's decision), and also denied a reclassification of my position (and thus higher pay) which I and my supervisor felt I deserved because of all the higher-up things I did (this time it was the University's decision to deny).

Six months ago, I reapplied for the promotion/higher position (Assistant Program Director - it sounds fancier than it is!!) and got it. At that time, my benefits increased a lot (more vacation time, much better retirement plan), and my salary increased a little (about 4.5%). But almost immediately after I got this new position, the University approved a plan to balance its budget by requiring all employees to take a 1.5% pay cut. So I got paid at 4.5% more than my entry-level, union job for 4 months, and now for the last two months I have been making only 3% more. It's still better than being in my old position and taking a pay cut, but still!

My husband and I bought a house last year and have had to put some significant repairs into it since then (new roof, furnace and now AC), and we hope to start trying to start a family next summer. Besides that, my husband wants to go back to school so he can get a different job (he works a dangerous job with crappy hours, right now). It would be very difficult for us to manage a baby on my current salary, not to mention him going back to school as well. So personally and for the sake of my family, I really feel like I should go for this job. But out of loyalty to my office and somewhat to the University, I feel like I should stick around. But I don't know when another opportunity like this will open up... positions in my field don't open up too often, especially a position that wouldn't require us to move!

So, help me out. What should I do?

(Of course, this is all assuming I am offered the position! I think I'll apply either way and if offered it I'll decide what to do, but of course I might not even be offered it! But I think I have a good chance.)
 

JocktheMotie

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I'd leave to pursue the better offer. Don't let ethics or guilt hold you back. Your current employer wouldn't, if they had to. Make the best decision for you and your family. Nobody else matters.
 
O

Oberon

Guest
I think you owe it to your colleagues in your current workplace to move on, opening up another position for one of them to be promoted into.

In all seriousness, you do what you have to do where jobs are concerned. Your employer would not bat an eye at letting you go if their business model required it.
 

JustHer

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Yeah, there's seriously no reason not to take this new job. Don't fall victim to normative commitment, it's a trap.

Then again, if you haven't even been offered this position yet then it is definitely not the time to be making this decision.
 

Blown Ghost

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It sounds like you have your mind already made up and you're looking for moral support, so just take the job. Can you imagine working at your current employer and missing out on what you could have gained? It wouldn't take much to make you regret doing that. Besides, leaving for another job is only shady if you take off right after your first employer sinks a lot of money into your training.
 

Aquarelle

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It sounds like you have your mind already made up and you're looking for moral support, so just take the job. Can you imagine working at your current employer and missing out on what you could have gained? It wouldn't take much to make you regret doing that. Besides, leaving for another job is only shady if you take off right after your first employer sinks a lot of money into your training.
No, I really don't have my mind made up... like I said, I have to apply first and I may not even be offered the job. But I want to think it through beforehand, so that in the event that I am offered the position, I don't have to decide on a rush basis!

Currently, my new employer hasn't put any money into my training. I was supposed to do some traveling in April for training, but due to the ash cloud that trip ended up being canceled! I am due to go in October instead, but I think I would know about this job before I'd have to book the flight for that, so that is good.
 

Coriolis

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If you are offered the new job, before accepting you could give your current employer the opportunity to match your new pay and benefits. But Jock and Oberon are correct: you certainly do not owe your employer more loyalty than they are willing to show you. You have your own business model to follow. If you do move on, just do the usual to avoid burning a bridge: give them as much notice as possible, offer to train your replacement, do your best to leave on good terms with everyone, etc. etc.
 

Randomnity

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I wouldn't worry about it either, sounds like a great opportunity. People leave jobs all the time when a better opportunity comes up. But yes, as much notice as possible and training replacement and being nice always helps.

Good luck!
 

Rebe

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I think you should definitely pursue the better job.
I think they will be fine without you; people leave jobs all the time. :)
 

Aquarelle

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Well, so far overwhelming response seems to be to go for it. :) Thanks for the advice, all. I know they'd be fine without me, I just feel bad 'cause they'd have to go to all the trouble of hiring someone new, training them, etc... they didn't have to invest ANY time/money in training me, because I'd been practically doing the job already for about a year when I finally officially got it.

Also Oberon you make a good point... there would probably be a few people in the office who'd be happy to have a position open up. But Coriolis makes a good point too, that maybe they would match the pay to keep me. Hmmm, do they like me that much? Maybe....

Well I'll for sure apply. Then we'll see what happens....
 

nozflubber

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tell your current employer about the new, better job offer, and how it suggests that your labor and contributions are being undervalued. See if they can match their pay offer, at the least. if not, then leave.


Not only will it pressure them to pay you more, but if they don't put out, you will feel less guiltly later on about leaving, because you will have given them the opportunity to hold onto you :) which in all fairness, they do deserve that opportunity. don't keep them in the dark then leave, that's a shitty thing to do and it is likely to eat up a good infj's soul later on.
 

Scott N Denver

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I'd leave to pursue the better offer. Don't let ethics or guilt hold you back. Your current employer wouldn't, if they had to. Make the best decision for you and your family. Nobody else matters.

I think you owe it to your colleagues in your current workplace to move on, opening up another position for one of them to be promoted into.

In all seriousness, you do what you have to do where jobs are concerned. Your employer would not bat an eye at letting you go if their business model required it.

I'm former government/DOD, and my attitude is "few employers seem to be worthy of commitment." I have older coworkers, some of whom spent a long time in the military, who say "NO employer is worthy of loyalty." As mentioned above, most employers won't bat an eye about letting someone go if it fits their business model or economic needs. As a pretty loyal guy, I'm still reeling in the shock of adjusting to the reality of attitude between employees and employers. I've seen "idealisticly-minded" [NOT necessarily MBTI NF however], make decisions for idealisticly-releated reasons, and then feel very fucked over for it. As strange as it initially felt for me to say this, there is a lot of advantage to taking a "mercenary" attitude towards employment. I read news articles about current job hiring/transferring trends, and said articles clearly say that companies*expect* employees to go elsewhere if given more pay/better options.

I think the last idea of going to your current employer and asking them to match whatever offer you may get elsewhere is a great idea, unless you think they will say yes and you'll get stuck there.

I've met a numbe rof people who have said "quitting my last/previous job was the best decision I ever made."

Good luck!
 

CzeCze

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Congrats on taking the new job. 6 months in your last position is more than enough.
 

cascadeco

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I think that you should take the new job if you would get it. The benefits to it far outweigh the negatives of leaving your current one (although I completely understand, it's hard to put notice in, especially if you're on good terms with your coworkers. Almost two years ago I quit my job and *I* was the one with a few tears going down my face when I gave my boss notice (she was an awesome boss and I adored my team, lol), I just felt so bad.

But in the end, these things happen all of the time in the working world. Think of it this way - you put in many solid years of helping them out. And I'd bet they'd send you off with encouragement and many would do the exact same thing in your position.

And yes... there will be many current employees or others in different dept's who could do a lateral transfer or something that would be more than willing to take the spot you'd be leaving!!! :yes: Yes, they'd have to be trained in, but in the end... it's really not something you should have to worry about. That's the name of the game, and.... it is YOUR life to do and live the way you desire!!! :)
 

Lark

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(Of course, this is all assuming I am offered the position! I think I'll apply either way and if offered it I'll decide what to do, but of course I might not even be offered it! But I think I have a good chance.)

That was my initial thought.

I would say definitely take it, the proximity thing is a big plus and next to that the increased leave, you'll not regret a single day off work on your death bed that's for sure and take advantage of the time now because you're a long time dead too.

Its understandable the reluctance to leave but you have to think of yourself too, I'm pretty sure no agency exploits their workers as ruthlessly as mine but I've found that they will exploit you as much as you let them and most employers depend most heavily on their conscientious staff and also on their conscientious staff passing up opportunities or alternatives.

Although a few things to keep in mind, see if you can size up potential direct line managers at interview if they are present, also ask about the team's composition, age, gender, stuff like that, I've known people who really rip the arse out of this asking about whether or not there's an internal candidate for the post, whether the team's morale is good, what is sickness like for the last couple of months within the team etc.

To some of which they've not gotten answers and probably run risks of alienating the panel but there's one thing I've learned about work you can cope with a mean boss and good colleagues or a good boss and mean colleagues but you cant cope with a mean boss and bad colleagues at once.

Just stuff I consider too, presumably you've got good relationships with seniors and colleagues where you are and that's part of why you dont want to leave. Good Luck :)
 

strawberries

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go for it and talk yourself up at the interview. hold the self-deprecating stuff. SELL, SELL, SELL.

no organisation can expect their employees to stick around forever.

best of luck.
 

EcK

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Just thinking of these poor dictators bring tears to my eyes.
Also, go for it.
 

Halla74

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I think you owe it to your colleagues in your current workplace to move on, opening up another position for one of them to be promoted into.

In all seriousness, you do what you have to do where jobs are concerned. Your employer would not bat an eye at letting you go if their business model required it.

+1. The wise mouse hath spoken.

Take the money and run, and look out for #1, Oh yeah, that's how it is in the business world, and your career is YOUR business. :newwink:
 

highlander

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tell your current employer about the new, better job offer, and how it suggests that your labor and contributions are being undervalued. See if they can match their pay offer, at the least. if not, then leave.

Not only will it pressure them to pay you more, but if they don't put out, you will feel less guiltly later on about leaving, because you will have given them the opportunity to hold onto you :) which in all fairness, they do deserve that opportunity. don't keep them in the dark then leave, that's a shitty thing to do and it is likely to eat up a good infj's soul later on.

I agree with just about everything in this thread but would be a little careful with this advice. Your employer is not just a faceless entity. It consists of people that can and do have emotions and can hold grudges. That is, if you demand more money and they give it to you, it is possible that somebody may resent this. I know because I did this once. They gave me a 40% increase. I stayed. I didn't find out till much later that I had pissed somebody off with that gesture. Was it the right thing to do or would I do it again? Not sure. Maybe.

There are times when it makes a tremendous amount of sense to get a different job. I wouldn't just make the decision based on salary. You have to enjoy what you're doing. In financial terms, long term opportunity tends to matter more than short term dollars.
 
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