I tried to recall what I was taught at school. I already said that I find the hypothesis too simplistic. However, quoting four people - some of debatable Puritan status - would not suffice to dissuade me if I cared to defend it.Except it's not, because they had a robust view of calling, vocation, and God's sovereignty.
"If we look externally, there is a difference between washing dishes and preaching the Word of God, but as touching pleasing God, none at all" -William Tyndale
" Let the people of God comfort themselves in all cases by this doctrine of the divine decrees[God's Master plan]; and, amidst whatever befalls them, rest quietly and submissively in the bosom of God, considering that whatever comes or can come to pass, proceeds from the decree of their gracious friend and reconciled Father, who knows what is best for them, and will make all things work together for their good. O what a sweet and pleasant life would you have under the heaviest pressures of affliction, and what heavenly serenity and tranquillity of mind would you enjoy, would you cheerfully acquiesce in the good will and pleasure of God, and embrace every dispensation, how no matter how sharp it may be, because it is determined and appointed for you by the eternal counsel of his will!" - Thomas Boston
"The action of a shepherd keeping sheep is as good a work before God as a minister in preaching" -William Perkins
Heh even found this quote by Baxter who didn't believe in predestination, but individual salvation, yet he still valued the community and it was his value of the community and God that drive his work ethic:
"The public welfare, or the good of the many is to be valued above our own. Every man, therefore, is bound to do all he can for others, especially for the church and commonwealth" -Richard Baxter
I tried to recall what I was taught at school. I already said that I find the hypothesis too simplistic. However, quoting four people - some of debatable Puritan status - would not suffice to dissuade me if I cared to defend it.
The other point I wanted to make is that there always is a discrepancy between what people believe to believe or are (Catholic, for instance) and what they do believe and are (people who believe in 'a higher power' but nothing else). I think if only people who actually believed all the current version of Catholicism holds to be true were regarded as Catholics, there would be fewer Catholics in the world than Amazonian manatees.
I'm pretty sure if you sat through some of the services I've sat through, you'd have a hard time not puking. I've been raised in the US and Evangelical and I want to puke sometimes. It's like Oprah. Possibly worse.A lot of the modern day religious believers, protestant or catholic are going to be influenced by their cultural mileu as much as the next person, although I do know that the principle of individual conscience was much more important in Luther's ideas about salvation in his break with the RCC, at least initially, than anything else.
There problem there is that no can give the definitive definition of nihilism whereas the Roman Catholic Church can determine what true Catholicism is.I suppose that would be true of nihilists, too, the ones that didn't kill themselves anyway.
I'm pretty sure if you sat through some of the services I've sat through, you'd have a hard time not puking. I've been raised in the US and Evangelical and I want to puke sometimes. It's like Oprah. Possibly worse.
It's more like a self-righteous motivational conference centered on ego than anything else.I could believe it, while I'm pretty sure of my own faith and tradition I've been to the services of others, christian and others but I've been to prayer meetings and services of baptists and presbytarians, of evangelicals too, what about them is it that makes you want to puke? Drama and confessionals?
I dont like the neurotic guilt of many religious, the RCC does that one well, I'm more tolerant of the individuals themselves now but it used to bug me how often I saw it coupled with confused traditionalism or conservatism.
I think everyone has something in their own faith that they dislike.
It's more like a self-righteous motivational conference centered on ego than anything else.
Yeah. I think it's wiser not to presume. I imagine it does happen in all walks of life and faith. I just seem to have a hard time avoiding it in mine.Oh yes, I think I know what you mean, yes, this can be more unique to some sorts of evangelism, ego stroking that they're the possessors of real truth and the keys to heaven.
I presume nothing about God, I'm always wary of any time this appears to happen and it does happen in all walks of life and faith.
Oh yes, I think I know what you mean, yes, this can be more unique to some sorts of evangelism, ego stroking that they're the possessors of real truth and the keys to heaven.
I presume nothing about God, I'm always wary of any time this appears to happen and it does happen in all walks of life and faith.
When and where did you see this?
Yeah. I think it's wiser not to presume. I imagine it does happen in all walks of life and faith. I just seem to have a hard time avoiding it in mine.
I really wouldn't blame him (or other pronoun).I think its impossible to know the mind of God, in no small part because God is not like anything mankind has been able to comprehend, its almost a defining trait.
Could be that God has intended life, one life, as his gift to mankind and IT is heaven or meant to be, people spoil it but there is nothing else after death and no after life or resurrection and all the discussion or debate or assurity about the same is futile.
I presume nothing, I know the stories in the bible tell otherwise but maybe God felt that way then and has different ideas now, in fact my worst fear is not that God does not exist but does and has tired of humanity and left the earth a rock in space and started again elsewhere.
I once read a strange Philip K Dick book which had a sci fi theme but in which God after the crucifixion had experienced a split personality and amnesia or other problems of mind and went to inhabit a mountain on another planet. It sounds crazy but it was an amazing read.
I really wouldn't blame him (or other pronoun).
I kind of figure we can't know for sure, but whether there is a God (or Gods) and whether that God is my God or somebody else's God or something nobody has thought of, I can't go wrong with following, to the best of my ability, Wheaton's Law: Don't be a dick. So my default is the religion in which I was raised, but I don't think that contradicts Wheaton's law. Though I have to admit that some of my co-religionists would consider that compromising with the world or tolerating sin, etc.
If it turns out there is no God, I won't be sorry for trying to treat people right. If there is a God and it's not my God, most Gods seem to be cool with treating other people right, most of the time. If there is a God and that God is in favor of being a dick, I'll just have to accept whatever penalty there are for failing to be enough of a dick.
And when I fail at my own ethics and I am a dick, well, I am only human and we really aren't a very nice species.
So that had me wondering two things, first of all, do you believe in angels? Second, is that the most implausible thing about Christianity or religion and if it isnt what is in your opinion?