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Thread: Mona is unsure

  1. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by EJCC View Post
    I see a whole lot more Fi in your OP, than Ne. Going by the (questionable but often useful) definitions of extroverts "thinking as they speak" vs. introverts "thinking before they speak", you seem very calculated and therefore introverted. Seems like the Fi type of calculation, making sure what you say is as accurate an expression of your values as you can muster. In contrast I've seen ENFPs fudge that a bit and then have to correct themselves later.

    On the other hand, could be that you're a 4 -- that exactness, I mean. For example @Qlip, ENFP 4, doesn't really vibe like an extrovert online, but he's said that he's super extroverted IRL so I take his word for it. Plus -- thinking out loud here -- I vibe "softer" here than I do on Vent, in the Modbox, or IRL, because the pace of conversation is so slow. Not as much opportunity for my Te to show its head.


    You generally vibe 4w3, as do your avatars.
    The problem with forum communication is how slow it really is. I am not a prototype of extrovert irl, but I think I speak before I think. I am pretty reactive on external stimuli.

  2. #12
    Post Human Post Qlip's Avatar
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    Analysis and detailing exhaust me. All I can say is that to me you feel very much like a younger version of a 4w3 that I know. Remember that young ENFPs can tend to seem introverted at times, mostly because of adjusting to all of the social pressure and expectations, and adjusting to ourselves within changing environments. And also remember that 4's will not seem extraverted next to 7's, the most visible ENFPs.

    You seem to have the ENFP balance of needing time to think and needing time to revel. Your thoughts tend to be explorations and not expressions of something formed, INFPs tend to do it the other way.

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Inis Mona View Post
    The problem with forum communication is how slow it really is.
    Then you need to figure a way to communicate with forum people outside of the forum for faster communication


    I am not a prototype of extrovert irl, but I think I speak before I think. I am pretty reactive on external stimuli.
    I think it has more to do with F/T than I/E

    This is what the great dr.jung said:

    For the sake of clarity let us again recapitulate: The products of all the functions can be conscious, but we speak of the consciousness of a function only when not merely its application is at the disposal of the will, but when at the same time its principle is decisive for the orientation of consciousness. The latter event is true when, for instance, thinking is not a mere afterthought, or rumination...
    "Where wisdom reigns, there is no conflict between thinking and feeling."
    — C.G. Jung

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  4. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by INTP View Post
    Then you need to figure a way to communicate with forum people outside of the forum for faster communication




    I think it has more to do with F/T than I/E

    This is what the great dr.jung said:
    I communicate with people outside the forum @riva or @Jarlaxle , or basically anyone from vent could say how reactive I am.
    But yes I can see the point in F being more reactive than T. Also I think I am sx dom which makes me even more reactive on stimuli.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Inis Mona View Post
    I communicate with people outside the forum @riva or @Jarlaxle , or basically anyone from vent could say how reactive I am.
    But yes I can see the point in F being more reactive than T. Also I think I am sx dom which makes me even more reactive on stimuli.
    I was referring to the speaking before thinking and accidentally left the reactive thing on the quote
    "Where wisdom reigns, there is no conflict between thinking and feeling."
    — C.G. Jung

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  6. #16
    Senior Member riva's Avatar
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    Inis from what i know of you from vent, what i have observed of you at vent - i know about you quite a bit and noticed your interactions/personality quite a lot - and WITHOUT READING any of the posts/self descriptions in this thread i will easily type you as an ENFP 7W6.

    I am unabke to type your instinctual variant without thinking about it.
    .

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by INTP View Post
    Then you need to figure a way to communicate with forum people outside of the forum for faster communication




    I think it has more to do with F/T than I/E

    This is what the great dr.jung said:
    I think a lot of Introverted Feelers - maybe even some Extraverted Feelers - would have a hard time with agreeing to that. Myself - even when I identified as ENFP - and other IxFx friends - I think rarely speak without consideration. Of course every once in a while my mouth will run ahead of my brain, but those situations are rare compared to the amount of times that I mull over my thoughts long before voicing them. I do not have much of a gift for speaking eloquently on-the-fly, whereas I think Extraverts tend to do much better with that.

    I assumed that Jung was saying in that quote that a function can be termed conscious if and only if it both is engaged intentionally and produces a marked effect on the person's perspective. Thinking is used as an example of that, if it occurs intentionally and affects the person's judgment before a behavior such as speech. But that doesn't mean that Feelers don't think or even Think before they speak. Plus, I don't remember what Jung's take on this was, but I am of the opinion that Feeling is probably typically roping in more subconsciousness then Thinking.

    In my opinion, preferring to think before speaking or think as you speak can be affected by a number of factors... Extraversion is probably the dominant factor, but I think that ExxPs are also likely to think as they speak slightly more frequently than ExxJs, ExxJs more than IxxPs, IxxPs more than IxxJs. Fs are probably slightly more likely to think as they speak than Ts, but not enough to override extraversion and introversion preferences. I think Enneatype can also play in, with 7s and 9s being less restrictive with language while 1s, 5s, and 3s keep language under tighter specific control, and I can at least speak for e6 hesitance and pre-planning in terms of choosing what to say, how, and when...

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    Quote Originally Posted by skylights View Post
    I think a lot of Introverted Feelers - maybe even some Extraverted Feelers - would have a hard time with agreeing to that. Myself - even when I identified as ENFP - and other IxFx friends - I think rarely speak without consideration. Of course every once in a while my mouth will run ahead of my brain, but those situations are rare compared to the amount of times that I mull over my thoughts long before voicing them. I do not have much of a gift for speaking eloquently on-the-fly, whereas I think Extraverts tend to do much better with that.

    I assumed that Jung was saying in that quote that a function can be termed conscious if and only if it both is engaged intentionally and produces a marked effect on the person's perspective. Thinking is used as an example of that, if it occurs intentionally and affects the person's judgment before a behavior such as speech. But that doesn't mean that Feelers don't think or even Think before they speak. Plus, I don't remember what Jung's take on this was, but I am of the opinion that Feeling is probably typically roping in more subconsciousness then Thinking.

    In my opinion, preferring to think before speaking or think as you speak can be affected by a number of factors... Extraversion is probably the dominant factor, but I think that ExxPs are also likely to think as they speak slightly more frequently than ExxJs, ExxJs more than IxxPs, IxxPs more than IxxJs. Fs are probably slightly more likely to think as they speak than Ts, but not enough to override extraversion and introversion preferences. I think Enneatype can also play in, with 7s and 9s being less restrictive with language while 1s, 5s, and 3s keep language under tighter specific control, and I can at least speak for e6 hesitance and pre-planning in terms of choosing what to say, how, and when...
    Well first i dont think that consciousness of a function is an on/off thing. I asked my ENFP friend once about talking without thinking(/analyzing what to say before saying it) and his attitude is that it just complicates things and thus he tries not to do it when ever possible. Also naturally some Fs use T more(and more consciously) than others, its about how differentiated the function is and how much it effects the overall attitude. In the quote Jung is talking about the consciousness of aux function, but the same thing applies to T in tert/inferior position too.
    Really even tho its about overall use of thinking(like all acting without using T first), it applies to talking before thinking too. Because thinking(or not) before doing something effects the attitude which you take towards the action. My INFP friend for example does often think before talking(but usually its more like feeling the thing before talking), but he does things without thinking really often(and usually feels bad for not thinking before doing something because he just gets the afterthought and sees that he didnt do the correct thing or was acting irrationally), and even tho he feels inferior for constantly doing something stupid, he is still unable to change his attitude.
    "Where wisdom reigns, there is no conflict between thinking and feeling."
    — C.G. Jung

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  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by INTP View Post
    Well first i dont think that consciousness of a function is an on/off thing. I asked my ENFP friend once about talking without thinking(/analyzing what to say before saying it) and his attitude is that it just complicates things and thus he tries not to do it when ever possible. Also naturally some Fs use T more(and more consciously) than others, its about how differentiated the function is and how much it effects the overall attitude. In the quote Jung is talking about the consciousness of aux function, but the same thing applies to T in tert/inferior position too.
    Really even tho its about overall use of thinking(like all acting without using T first), it applies to talking before thinking too. Because thinking(or not) before doing something effects the attitude which you take towards the action. My INFP friend for example does often think before talking(but usually its more like feeling the thing before talking), but he does things without thinking really often(and usually feels bad for not thinking before doing something because he just gets the afterthought and sees that he didnt do the correct thing or was acting irrationally), and even tho he feels inferior for constantly doing something stupid, he is still unable to change his attitude.
    Okay, I see what you mean. I just think that maybe it's important to make a substantial difference between colloquial thinking in terms of just running through mental processing and the specific cognitive process of Thinking. I am sure there are many Introverted Feelers who do not do much cognitive process Thinking before acting. But that is very, very different from whether one runs through any rational mental process whatsoever before speaking or acting. I think the majority of IxFx do tend to run their mental processes prior to acting or speaking, even if they do not use T.

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    Quote Originally Posted by skylights View Post
    Okay, I see what you mean. I just think that maybe it's important to make a substantial difference between colloquial thinking in terms of just running through mental processing and the specific cognitive process of Thinking. I am sure there are many Introverted Feelers who do not do much cognitive process Thinking before acting. But that is very, very different from whether one runs through any rational mental process whatsoever before speaking or acting. I think the majority of IxFx do tend to run their mental processes prior to acting or speaking, even if they do not use T.
    Well i think that the real difference is between feeling before acting and thinking before acting. For example:

    "Oh he is making me so mad because X Y and Z, therefore im going to start yelling."

    Or

    "He is making me so mad because of X Y and Z, if i say this and that to him, then he realizes why he makes me so mad and will change his behavior, im going to tell him to fuck off for good because this shit would never change."

    Both of these include F, but the first example is acting purely based on feeling, but the second one also includes thinking. Both of these are also rational(as jung defined rationality).

    As you can most likely see that F types are also capable of the second example, but it depends on the level of differentiation of thinking and ofc on how intense the emotion and therefore the feeling judgment as well is(and how the person reacts to intense emotions etc).

    And yes, maybe an example with strong negative emotions isnt the best possible, because it tends to bring the irrational and acting without thinking easily in anyone(regardless of T or F), but i cant think of a better example now.
    "Where wisdom reigns, there is no conflict between thinking and feeling."
    — C.G. Jung

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