I am reviving this thread. I received some good feedback from @Starry and a guy – who is obviously well read on it - I was chatting with online who got me thinking or trying to self analyze.
In very very very short and probably missing quite a few steps of the exact conversation, this is the conversation I had with him:
From the beginning he was quite sure I am not an e9 – just like most people on vent who doesn’t seem to think I am an e9 - though I was insisting on it, and said that I am probably an e3.
There were a few things that got highlighted when he asked more and more questions from me. One of which was that I ‘constantly – which means every fucking day – tries to create a personality that is more efficient/better equipped/competent to deal with ALL things that I deem important ‘without losing touch with who I REALLY am.’ Note that I want to change but I don’t want to stray too far away from who I really am because it would feel unnatural to me and maybe even hard to maintain.
He pointed out that E9s unknowingly merge – please note that these weren’t his exact words – with personalities that are stronger than theirs, whereas E3s intentionally put on a personality they believe is attractive. So if by any chance that an e9 merges with a personality trait it would be unintentionally. However, e3s create intentionally.
Since I was insisting that I enjoy creating traits intentionally and I think about this constantly he pointed out that I am more an E3 than E9 since it was more of an e3 characteristic.
Add to the above since I am comfortable receiving attention we settled down on e3 (E9s avoid attention). But then again 9s have a likable vibe that lightens up people’s moods. I know one ISFP 9w1 who becomes a victim of attention constantly (in a good way).
However, settling down on e3 lasted only for a few days. Because if I am an e3 something was quite off since I really don’t try to accomplish to impress and I definitely do not form my identity around my accomplishments. So I assumed maybe I am an e3 disintegrated into an e9 or was simply unhealthy. However, when reading the descriptions of e3s being unhealthy I realized that I definitely can’t be an unhealthy e3 because I DO NOT BRAG. Yes I do brag but probably with the intention of sharing my good fortunes, having something to talk about and lightning up the mood – all of which is done in a way that people feel that I was happy go lucky and sharing my happiness - whereas e3s brag with the intention of differentiating themselves from others (to form an identity perhaps, which has elitist vibes).
Unhealthy e3s falsify things I read and have noticed if they feel that they have underachieved. If I believe I have underachieved I either say I fucked things up or avoid those question – but definitely not while having my chest held high like an e3 would. E3 personalities are painfully obvious to me. I think even before reading about enneagrams I managed to note them and categorize them. (I didn’t even manage to categorize e8s, which probably means I am not a 5w6 :P.)
When 3w2s open their mouths it sounds as though they are beating their chests and asking everyone to suck their dicks for being such an achiever. They have a ‘my, I did, I have’ sentence structures. And there is something in me that want to scream out and laugh at them. I manage to hold myself back only with great restraint. However, their image consciousness could be used as a tool to manipulate them I’ve noticed which probably means they aren’t aware of how they are coming across as to others (He also pointed this out). It’s that painfully obvious to me. (Which is why I think Franks Underwood is a 8w7 over 3w2 dear @Southern Kross – yes I am dragging you back to this thread.)
Introverted 3w4s are equally annoying once I get to know them because they have a ‘fake I am made of plastic’ vibe. Once you notice this about them it’s hard to ignore it. Extroverted 3w4s have the same braggishness 3w2s seem to have but they also seem to have an emo side. They get deeply emotional sometimes. However, I am not sure whether I am confusing them with actual 3w2s.
Anyway after sharing these obvious points with him we realized I am probably not an e3. He also pointed out that if I am an e3 I wouldn’t notice or wouldn’t silently laugh at e3 branded bragging – this is of course an off hand comment by him.
We went back to e9 and then he brought up e7.
I am more comfortable typing myself as an e9 over e7. The main reasons being:
I am quite physically grounded (gut center?), I like routine (gut center?), I am not flighty at all (e7s are fucking flighty), due to being physically grounded I am more introverted than extroverted, I can relate to e3 (e9s integrate to e3) and last but not least I have that bottled up 9w8 anger burst moments (however, I am more like a pendulum of being pissed off and happy than feeling bottled up).
However 9w8s don’t seem animated at all. Even when excited it last for only a few seconds. It’s as if they don’t want to feel excited fearing they would burst like a balloon. They do have the same type of annoyed aggression/bottle up anger I share but I only have these bottled up anger moments at home and only under situations where there is no opportunity to express it. This is quite evident when dealing with my ESTJ 8w7 father. They know how to make you feel pushed against a wall – though are excellent parents. However, I would say I more often say/imply people to fuck off than to bottle things up. Also I think I have become more expressive as I have matured.
This got me wondering what happens to e7s when they disintegrate to e1s? Unfortunately he hasn’t met or noticed what happens to them when they do so and there aren’t that many articles to read on it. Also I know very little about e1s to get an idea of it. Feeling judgmental or judging others are something that probably happens to them he assumed but I don’t think he was entirely sure about it.
If anyone knows what happens to e7 when disintegrating towards e1s please do share!
So finally – could it be that what I am seeing in myself as an e9 is what is happening to me under stressful situations – perhaps an e7 disintegrating towards a e1? Or am I a 9w8 and these obvious extroversions I see in myself especially when interacting with groups of people is me integrating towards e3? However, I don’t become a perfectionist as an e1 would sadly. I become more of a slacker.
(Note – I inquired him whether it is possible that I am a 9w8 integrated towards 3 which is what is making me intentionally create attractive/efficient/competent traits to which he replied that it doesn’t work that way since if your core is e9 it would unintentionally merge and that enneagrams don’t stray too far away from the core.)
But if I am a 7 I have to theoretically be a w8 over w6. I just can’t relate to the nervous energy of e6s, I am seldom nervous, seldom flighty and I am quite physically grounded. I clearly can see the difference between a 7w6 and I.
So am I a 7w8 or 9w8? I am currently reluctantly leaning towards 7w8. Maybe if I know what happens to them when they disintegrate I could relate.
By Starry -
Gulp at 9s fear that they lack identity. When you say ‘they obtain one through merging with others’ do you think they do so intentionally? (If so Starry, I am back on the e9 wagon.)
I don’t know whether I fear I lack identity or whether I fear the identity I have formed isn’t attractive/competent enough. It is possible it is the latter or it is even possible that I initially feared the lack of identity, then I started forming one and now I am currently filling in the blanks.
By Starry -
I think it’s safe to say that I am a TP . I think I should stay away from trying to type my MTBI type for now, because for me the enneagram type is currently more important .