Marginal or no preference? Wtf

[Hyoid]

I recently took the humanmetrics test online, and I keep switching between INTJ and INFJ. The results are always consistent with the I N and J, but it lists my preference for either F or T as 1% depending on what result I get, saying I have marginal or no preference of thinking over feeling or vice versa. After reading both descriptions, I feel that neither really fits me perfectly and that I am a combination of both depending on the situation... However I know this is not possible since the 2nd and 3rd core functions are different for both. Help?

 

[Forever_Jung]

I find these sorts of problems result from a fundamental misunderstanding of the functions. Tests are pretty awful and usually only serve as rough starting points. If I were you, I'd google Jung's descriptions of the functions from Psychological Types.

 

[entropie]

Definitly magical

 

[Kullervo]

I recently took the humanmetrics test online, and I keep switching between INTJ and INFJ. The results are always consistent with the I N and J, but it lists my preference for either F or T as 1% depending on what result I get, saying I have marginal or no preference of thinking over feeling or vice versa. After reading both descriptions, I feel that neither really fits me perfectly and that I am a combination of both depending on the situation... However I know this is not possible since the 2nd and 3rd core functions are different for both. Help?

http://intjforum.com/showthread.php?t=14754

Good thread, read through it...

 

[Hyoid]

Yes I tried to determine my type from those. Ni, and a balance of Fe and Te are most applicable to me. Neither Fi or Ti are something that I use consistently from the descriptions that I have read, which is why I took the online test hoping it would provide some clarity.

 

[Kullervo]

Yes I tried to determine my type from those. Ni, and a balance of Fe and Te are most applicable to me. Neither Fi or Ti are something that I use consistently from the descriptions that I have read, which is why I took the online test hoping it would provide some clarity.

Take a cognitive function test here http://www.keys2cognition.com/explore.htm and C & P your results here. Don't try and determine your type directly.

 

[skylights]

Consider how you operate in daily life - do you use your understanding of interpersonal relations to act in ways that improve your situation, or do you use your understanding of logistics to increase efficiency and efficacy? Everyone does both to some extent, but there is usually a fairly clear answer to whether you tend to "play chess" with people systems or thing systems, and whether you tend to focus on the personal or impersonal. IxxJs often tend to feel like they are strong in both T and F, but typically one is used more mentally to understand the "setup" of the world while the other is put into action more to navigate the external world.

 

[Hyoid]

"INTJs have a preference for extraverted Thinking as their auxiliary process. Thus, they are given to "segmenting" -- which includes measuring things with objective criteria. They will naturally calculate how long something will take, how soon the next event will occur, and enjoy telling you about these measurements. They like organizing for efficiency, systematizing, structuring. Their tendency is to provide you with their rationales: "The reason I'm late is because it took me 15 minutes longer on the freeway than it normally does. I was only able to maintain a speed of 25 mph, compared to my normal speed of 40 mph." And so forth. These rationales and measurements are very important to INTJs. They especially love to predict how long something is going to take, and their wristwatch is probably among their prize possessions. They collect trivial facts constantly, and can probably tell you all the contents of their medicine cabinet -- including the proper names for all their pharmaceuticals. Just ask them about their computer -- they'll tell you the processor speed, memory size, hard disk capacity, operating system version, and network capabilities. Chances are they've even memorized the Periodic Table of Elements."

Exactly.

"INFJs have a preference for extraverted Feeling as their auxiliary process. Thus, they tend to be "charming" and are given to "connecting" -- which includes maintaining an extensive web of relationships. They are given to adjusting to and accommodating others, deciding whether something is appropriate or acceptable to others. If she were to dine with others, she would be concerned that the food appeal to everyone's tastes, there are no food allergies, and that the price is within everyone's budget (if it's a restaurant)."

This is also extremely accurate.

"In the INTJ pattern, the tertiary process is for introverted Feeling. Thus, they habitually consider importance and worth, clarify values, and decide whether something is of significance and worth standing up for. ("This doesn't match our priorities so we should refuse that assignment.") They have a strong sense of what's important to them or the project. Sometimes they can be seen as "selfish."

In the INFJ pattern, the tertiary process is for introverted Thinking. Thus, they habitually analyze. They devote energy to deciding whether something fits a framework or model, and will often clarify definitions to get more precision. ("Let's define our terms before we get more deeply involved in this conversation.") They enjoy categorizing, and figuring out underlying principles. Sometimes they can be seen as "critical.""

Neither of these are more accurate than the other. A few aspects of each apply but overall I still am not sure.

 

[Hyoid]

"Cognitive Process Level of Development (Preference, Skill and Frequency of Use)
extraverted Sensing (Se) ******************** (20.6)
limited use
introverted Sensing (Si) **************** (16.6)
limited use
extraverted Intuiting (Ne) ***************************** (30)
average use
introverted Intuiting (Ni) *********************************************** (47.2)
excellent use
extraverted Thinking (Te) ********************************** (34.8)
good use
introverted Thinking (Ti) ****************************** (30.1)
good use
extraverted Feeling (Fe) ******************************************* (43)
excellent use
introverted Feeling (Fi) ****************** (18.5)
limited use
Summary Analysis of Profile
By focusing on the strongest configuration of cognitive processes, your pattern of responses most closely matches individuals of this type: ENFJ

Lead (Dominant) Process
Extraverted Feeling (Fe): Building trust through giving relationships. Empathically responding to others' needs and take on their needs and values as your own. Checking for respect and trust. Giving and receiving support to grow closer to people.

Support (Auxilliary) Process
Introverted Intuiting (Ni): Transforming with a meta-perspective. Withdrawing from the world and focusing your mind to receive an insight or realization. Checking if synergy results. Trying out a realization to transform things.

If these cognitive processes don't fit well then consider these types: INFJ, or ENTJ"

 

[Alea_iacta_est]

[MENTION=21976]Hyoid[/MENTION], if you wouldn't mind, I'd wonder if you could select two choices from the two questions below, as part of a little typing method I have thought of, which is based off of the perspective of Beebe's archetypes of the anima/animus and the trickster (and their Socionics counterparts, the Suggestive function and Vulnerable function). If none of the following apply, let me know, as these are only 4 of the 8.

What are you most suggestible to? Which of these seem to influence you the most and even attract you?

Are you easily swayed by promises of power, immediate material gain and abundance of resources, or the determination/vindication of another person's argument or cause, as well as trust in straightforwardness and candidness?

Are you easily swayed by the emotional atmosphere put out by others, appeals to social ethics, or physical/vocalized expressions of emotions toward you?

Are you easily swayed by the logical purity of an argument, the mental frameworks and theoretical models presented to you (which are seen as mostly veritable) which have been built by others, or detailed analyses of topics provided by others?

Are you easily swayed by the presence of empirical evidence, knowledge indicative of society (common knowledge), the believed efficiency of systems, logical order and organization, or any argument/claim/evidence made/provided from any source (regardless of credibility, which isn't typically looked at)?

Which of these creates feelings of suspicion and often make you want to turn a blind eye towards?

Displays of power and vindication, promises of power and immediate rewards, straightforwardness or candidness of any kind. It just seems too straightforward and in your face to be taken at face value. (Nothing is as straightforward as it seems)

The perceivable emotional atmosphere, emotions that are being expressed towards you physically and openly(they might be a facade, for instance), any kind of argument derived from social constructs or the general ethics of society, others emotionally supporting (empathizing/sympathizing/relating) what you might value or what they think you value.

Theoretical systems and frameworks that do not possess an actual, realistic manifestation, a lack of trust in most theories as they are seen as too idealistic, models might be seen as over-complicated since they seem to be unable to be related to physical reality (think String Theory, all mathematics, virtually no empirical evidence), detailed analyses made by others.

Empirical evidence put in front of you, common knowledge indicative of society, evidence or arguments provided by sources ("Don't always trust what you read" adequately describes this) of any degree of credibility (be it farmer Joe or Dr. Joseph), the logical organization and management of resources.

 

[Kullervo]

"Cognitive Process Level of Development (Preference, Skill and Frequency of Use)
extraverted Sensing (Se) ******************** (20.6)
limited use
introverted Sensing (Si) **************** (16.6)
limited use
extraverted Intuiting (Ne) ***************************** (30)
average use
introverted Intuiting (Ni) *********************************************** (47.2)
excellent use
extraverted Thinking (Te) ********************************** (34.8)
good use
introverted Thinking (Ti) ****************************** (30.1)
good use
extraverted Feeling (Fe) ******************************************* (43)
excellent use
introverted Feeling (Fi) ****************** (18.5)
limited use
Summary Analysis of Profile
By focusing on the strongest configuration of cognitive processes, your pattern of responses most closely matches individuals of this type: ENFJ

Lead (Dominant) Process
Extraverted Feeling (Fe): Building trust through giving relationships. Empathically responding to others' needs and take on their needs and values as your own. Checking for respect and trust. Giving and receiving support to grow closer to people.

Support (Auxilliary) Process
Introverted Intuiting (Ni): Transforming with a meta-perspective. Withdrawing from the world and focusing your mind to receive an insight or realization. Checking if synergy results. Trying out a realization to transform things.

If these cognitive processes don't fit well then consider these types: INFJ, or ENTJ"

xNFJ, you mentioned you considered INFJ as an option and I won't dismiss your judgement. What you clearly are not is an INTJ. Fe is usually our weak point - there is no conceivable way that an INTJ could have such high strong Fe.

 

[á´…eparted]

xNFJ, you mentioned you considered INFJ as an option and I won't dismiss your judgement. What you clearly are not is an INTJ. Fe is usually our weak point - there is no conceivable way that an INTJ could have such high strong Fe.

This is not true. Aside from the fact that this cognitive function test is shotty at best. Use of Fe and Te don't have to be inversely proportional to each other. While it's common for INTJ's to not relate to Fe, or in fact have a "kill it with fire!" attitude towards it, it doesn't mean that they're all going to be like that. I mean, Fe is my dominant function, and I rather strongly relate/connect with Te as well even though I don't "use it".

Though I do agree (in particular with the way the questions are worded in this test) that xxTJ types are not very likely given the results.

 

[Kullervo]

This is not true. Aside from the fact that this cognitive function test is shotty at best. Use of Fe and Te don't have to be inversely proportional to each other. While it's common for INTJ's to not relate to Fe, or in fact have a "kill it with fire!" attitude towards it, it doesn't mean that they're all going to be like that. I mean, Fe is my dominant function, and I rather strongly relate/connect with Te as well even though I don't "use it".

Though I do agree (in particular with the way the questions are worded in this test) that xxTJ types are not very likely given the results.

Explain how could you be a TJ if your Fe is 3x more devaloped than your Fi?

That makes no sense at all.

Cognitive function tests do only give an indication, but they can also reveal obvious patterns.

 

[Hyoid]

What are you most suggestible to? Which of these seem to influence you the most and even attract you?
Swayed by the logical purity of an argument, the mental frameworks and theoretical models presented to you (which are seen as mostly veritable) which have been built by others, or detailed analyses of topics provided by others.

Swayed by the emotional atmosphere put out by others, appeals to social ethics, or physical/vocalized expressions of emotions toward you.

Which of these creates feelings of suspicion and often make you want to turn a blind eye towards?
Displays of power and vindication, promises of power and immediate rewards, straightforwardness or candidness of any kind. It just seems too straightforward and in your face to be taken at face value. (Nothing is as straightforward as it seems)

The perceivable emotional atmosphere, emotions that are being expressed towards you physically and openly(they might be a facade, for instance), any kind of argument derived from social constructs or the general ethics of society, others emotionally supporting (empathizing/sympathizing/relating) what you might value or what they think you value.

For this last it one was difficult to choose a second. I'm extremely skilled at knowing when others are putting on a facade or trying to please others, so this isn't something that creates feelings of suspicion but will immediately make me discredit what they say and research it myself, or try to get them to share their true opinions.

 

[á´…eparted]

Explain how could you be a TJ if your Fe is 3x more devaloped than your Fi?

That makes no sense at all.

Cognitive function tests do only give an indication, but they can also reveal obvious patterns.

A given type only has access to four functions. The rest are "shadow" and are not used. In other words, what might look like Fe, really isn't Fe at all. As with myself, what looks like Te is (for the most part) my Fe appearing under that label. Just cause it looks that way doesn't mean it is that way. A xxTJ that shows "strong Fe" in the sense that there are aspects of the individual that look like Fe, in all likelyhood is really just Te and Fi showing up, and it's being mislabeled as an actual literal use of Fe. Which is why claiming an xxTJ to have "developed Fe" is a misleading misnomer. As I said for myself, I have what looks like a lot of Te, and I rather relate to it, but I did not say I have Te (because I do not).

There's lots of ways in which functions can manifest in an individual, and tests aren't able to easily see through that either.

 

[Hyoid]

A given type only has access to four functions. The rest are "shadow" and are not used. In other words, what might look like Fe, really isn't Fe at all. As with myself, what looks like Te is (for the most part) my Fe appearing under that label. Just cause it looks that way doesn't mean it is that way. A xxTJ that shows "strong Fe" in the sense that there are aspects of the individual that look like Fe, in all likelyhood is really just Te and Fi showing up, and it's being mislabeled as an actual literal use of Fe. Which is why claiming an xxTJ to have "developed Fe" is a misleading misnomer. As I said for myself, I have what looks like a lot of Te, and I rather relate to it, but I did not say I have Te (because I do not).

There's lots of ways in which functions can manifest in an individual, and tests aren't able to easily see through that either.

This makes the most sense to me and why I would be mistaken in thinking I use Te, especially since I don't completely understand the typing system and their manifestations.

 

[Alea_iacta_est]

What are you most suggestible to? Which of these seem to influence you the most and even attract you?
Swayed by the logical purity of an argument, the mental frameworks and theoretical models presented to you (which are seen as mostly veritable) which have been built by others, or detailed analyses of topics provided by others.

Swayed by the emotional atmosphere put out by others, appeals to social ethics, or physical/vocalized expressions of emotions toward you.

Which of these creates feelings of suspicion and often make you want to turn a blind eye towards?
Displays of power and vindication, promises of power and immediate rewards, straightforwardness or candidness of any kind. It just seems too straightforward and in your face to be taken at face value. (Nothing is as straightforward as it seems)

The perceivable emotional atmosphere, emotions that are being expressed towards you physically and openly(they might be a facade, for instance), any kind of argument derived from social constructs or the general ethics of society, others emotionally supporting (empathizing/sympathizing/relating) what you might value or what they think you value.

For this last it one was difficult to choose a second. I'm extremely skilled at knowing when others are putting on a facade or trying to please others, so this isn't something that creates feelings of suspicion but will immediately make me discredit what they say and research it myself, or try to get them to share their true opinions.

In the first question, "swayed" is meant to mean more like overly trusting in an area presented to you (which isn't necessarily a bad thing, but with the inclusion of some manipulative individuals that value the function in question can make you believe things that are not entirely veritable). Do you overly trust the dynamic emotional reactions/attachments you see from others towards you or any other object in the environment? Or are you always suspicious of the appealing genuine emotional elicitation, doubting those who try to comfort you emotionally or support you emotionally as it seems off or even condescending. Suspicious of the ethics of society, how interpersonal relations are to be dynamically assessed and maintained?

Or, are you overly trusting in any theoretical model shown to you, tending to align with almost any theoretical model shown to you even if it isn't attached to reality or is without evidence? Too trusting of logical arguments based primarily out of a priori reasoning.

EDIT: Evidence allocated thus far:
Se is not Anima/Animus and is most likely unvalued. Possibly PoLR/Trickster.
Ti possibly valued.
Fe is uncertain.
Te is uncertain, but probably not Anima/Animus nor PoLR/Trickster.

DOUBLE EDIT: Follow-up Question: Are you attracted to powerful individuals or people with the will and motivation to do whatever they want so that they may, too, infect you with their contagious motivation to go out and simply do instead of wait?

 

[Elocute]

Explain how could you be a TJ if your Fe is 3x more devaloped than your Fi?

That makes no sense at all.

Cognitive function tests do only give an indication, but they can also reveal obvious patterns.

A lot of what it stated for Fe could be have a large social factor. "Do you organize gatherings?" I could imagine an INTJ doing that, especially if he was a social variant on enneagram. Fi could be considered "selfish" in their family or circle.

 

[Hyoid]

In the first question, "swayed" is meant to mean more like overly trusting in an area presented to you (which isn't necessarily a bad thing, but with the inclusion of some manipulative individuals that value the function in question can make you believe things that are not entirely veritable). Do you overly trust the dynamic emotional reactions/attachments you see from others towards you or any other object in the environment? Or are you always suspicious of the appealing genuine emotional elicitation, doubting those who try to comfort you emotionally or support you emotionally as it seems off or even condescending. Suspicious of the ethics of society, how interpersonal relations are to be dynamically assessed and maintained?

Or, are you overly trusting in any theoretical model shown to you, tending to align with almost any theoretical model shown to you even if it isn't attached to reality or is without evidence? Too trusting of logical arguments based primarily out of a priori reasoning.

This was also very difficult to answer... I think I'm overly trusting in theoretical models. If it is described to me in such a way that seems logical and makes sense from my viewpoint, I will believe it is credible or at least a possibility. However this could also be because I am most attracted to people who can explain things in such a way that they inspire others into belief. Which also goes along with your follow up question:

Are you attracted to powerful individuals or people with the will and motivation to do whatever they want so that they may, too, infect you with their contagious motivation to go out and simply do instead of wait?
*swoon*

 

[Alea_iacta_est]

This was also very difficult to answer... I think I'm overly trusting in theoretical models. If it is described to me in such a way that seems logical and makes sense from my viewpoint, I will believe it is credible or at least a possibility. However this could also be because I am most attracted to people who can explain things in such a way that they inspire others into belief. Which also goes along with your follow up question:

Are you attracted to powerful individuals or people with the will and motivation to do whatever they want so that they may, too, infect you with their contagious motivation to go out and simply do instead of wait?
*swoon*

Well, evidently, it would appear that your Anima/Suggestibility lies in the realm of Pe, if the latter is truly the case.

Furthermore, one can even further reason from your statement here:

However this could also be because I am most attracted to people who can explain things in such a way that they inspire others into belief. Which also goes along with your follow up question:

that your tertiary function is introverted thinking, based on the fact that your anima/animus is oriented toward Pe.

Breakdown:
The Auxiliary function and the Tertiary function are both functions you utilize to craft a view of the world and are used to relate your dominant and inferior perspectives to others.

Your inferior function is related to others through your tertiary function, and in Socionics, there is a concept called Duality. Duality in Socionics is an intertype relation between two types with the same functions, reversed. An example would be an INFp (INFJ) and an ESTp (ESTP), where the ESTP's Anima, or goal, is the Introverted Intuition function relayed in terms of Extroverted Feeling (inferior-tertiary), which happens to be the specialty of the INFJ, and the INFJ's Animus is Extroverted Sensation relayed in terms of Introverted Logic/Thinking (inferior-tertiary), which is the specialty of the ESTP. Ergo, these two types tend to get along very well with each other. Well, your attraction to those who are both powerful (Pe) and who "explain things in such a way that they inspire others into belief" (which specifically points toward the Pe-Ti mechanism being powerful and conjuring up feeling and expression through the Fe-Pi mechanism), indirectly asserts that your own inferior is indicative of an Extroverted Perception function, and that your tertiary function is indicative of the Introverted Logic/Thinking function.

Ergo, we have the basis of your type skeleton (Pi - Fe - Ti - Pe), meaning that you are either in Socionics's Alpha or Beta quadrant (though we won't go into any more detail of Socionics, lest the idiots who can't piece together the resounding unity between the two systems decide to intervene and advocate the separation of the two), meaning in JCF or MBTI, you are an IxFJ.

This of course, leads us to the final question.

Do you value those powerful individuals who are physically assertive, hands-on, and wield command over practical logic, or do you value those powerful individuals who are assertive with ideas, abstract reasoning, and are ludicrous in the pursuit of alternative possibilities?

Do not choose based on who you would like to be, either, as that won't do you any good. Choose based on who you are.